ThisBitterPill,

Thank you for sharing your experience with me. It does sound very similar to my situation. YES, I would love help with Plan A. How and when do I start it? I don't think that he will "go along" with any plan that I've gotten here. So - in the beginning, it will be mostly one-sided. How do I make that work? Plus, one of the "problems" is that I was doing too much for him and he felt that I treated him like a child. How do I avoid that and not seem like I'm being a B**ch?

Thanks again...I look forward to your suggestions. I'll go read more on Plan A.

Andi

Have you read through the Newly BS thread?

You start Plan A ASAP. Plan A is one-sided. You don't expect much from your WS right now. You are not sharing with your WS what you are doing. You are focusing on controlling your actions, not his, and improving yourself.

No more Love Buster-ing. You mention that your H thinks you treat him like a child. This is a LB. This is also something I had to work on for myself and it has been a change for the better in our M.

Even though you are avoiding LBs, that does not mean you are a doormat or that you condone his wayward behavior. Read this:


One more tip: Someone here told me about how bonding occurs with the first person you have (positive) conversation with each day. In Plan A, I would try to engage my WH in short easy chats about current events or his work, the kids, or anything that I thought he would enjoy talking about. It was very hard because he was acting very weird and disconnected...but I did it.

Other than that, I focused on having fun with the kids, making the home a nice place to be, and on doing things that made me feel good about myself (exercise, new clothing, makeup, etc) instead of focusing on him.

Are you continuing to snoop? Does he know you are checking his email? You need to print and keep records of what you are finding. Have you considered a recorder in the car?

Reason To Believe,

Thank you, thank you, thank you for that quote about Plan A! Where did you get that? Can you give me the link to that thread? I seem to only find the brief explanation that Dr. H. gives in the Q&A section and that really does not help me. The quote you gave is clear and gives me more insight on what to do. I can't check his email - that was just a fluke. He took a shower and left it open and I checked it then. I don't have access otherwise. But, I will keep my eyes and ears open. One thing that I have to work on is rebuilding trust. He does not think that I have faith in him or that I have trusted him since the A in 2002. BUT! I did! I forgave him and trusted him. Only recently, when he started acting strangely, did I begin to doubt. He also said that he thinks I am not over the A that happened in 2002. I told him that I am. But, that he has to understand that I may have acted insecure in some instances because of it. I told him that he made that bed...Of course, I said those things yesterday when I confronted him. Tonight, when he finally came home, I acted normal. I sat with him and we talked about trust and who I think he is as a person. I did not push to talk about the details of the email. We talked about the fact that he finds it easier to talk to other people. I told him that does not make me mad - it hurts my feelings because I really wish that he felt he could talk to me. I think tonight was productive. By no means the end of our discussion...but, I'm taking it slow.

Thanks for being there for me...

Andi

PS - Just a note...He is leaving at the end of the week for a month long deployment with his unit. So - I don't want to send him away angry. I am being assertive. Standing up for myself. Keeping myself looking good and bringing up things to discuss when I think the time is right. Suggestions? Thanks!

Here's the link to "For Newly BS" thread in JFO:
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1659680#Post1659680

Re your conversation about trust, if I were you, I would avoid talks like this. It is only giving him an opportunity to gaslight you as another poster mentioned earlier... It is normal to have to rebuild trust for a long time after an A and it is normal not to trust someone who is acting the way your WH has been behaving.

I hope you can get some mileage out of the conversation tip I gave you in the last post like I did when it was given to me.

Now do you have cell records? How about putting a voice-activated recorder in the car?

Trust was not the focus of our conversation. I think that I had to clarify the fact that I don't think that he is out having a PA. I told him that it hurts me that he feels he can talk to other women (or other men for that matter) and not to me. I told him that the fact that he talks to people does not bother me - it just makes me wonder when he gets defensive about it. He told me that it's his life and he can talk to whomever he likes. I said that he's a grown man, but there is a point when talk becomes inappropriate and disrespectful to me and our home. I don't have access to cell phone records as we use pre-paid phones over here. Although, I'm trying to access his account online. Just have to be quick about it. I can check his phone if he leaves it unattended for a few minutes. Don't know if a voice activated recorder is available to me as we are overseas. Plus, we have two cars and we alternate between the two. I'll check, though. If we should not talk about trust right now...can you give me an idea of what we should talk about? Should I ask questions or let him come to me?

Andi

How do I approach the situation if he is emailing another woman in the states? He met this chick when he was in Germany for training in May. They have been writing back and forth - flirting, etc. I confronted him with a print out of the email on Saturday before he left home for 24 hours. I told him that that type of email is inappropriate and disrespectful to me and our home. I *think* he wrote her last night again. Now, this morning, on her MySpace page (all I can see is the banner because it is set to private) is what (appears to me) to be a message for him: Just break the ties. What the hell? I have her phone number. Should I call her? What should I do? I'm trying to work Plan A - nice home, talking, etc. But, this makes me MAD. The "message" may not even be directed at me or him...but, that's how I take it. FRUSTRATING considering we had a good talk the night before and last night we hung out and talked (not about our relationship - about fun stuff) and played fussball with our daughter. Why are there such flaky people out there in the world who don't care if a person is married or not? I know that he has to set those boundaries...but, this chick knows he is married. Not worried about a PA as she is in the US and we are in Italy. But, the EA is just as hurtful.

Andi

Oh...one more thing....he'll just say that they are only "talking" and he'll take me asking him not to email her as an ultimatum. Plus, when he went to a therapist (once back in April) the therapist told him it would be better to talk to other people. Joey told me that on Sunday and laughed/snickered because that is what is causing our problems.

Stuck between a rock and a hard place and not liking it one bit.

Andi

Well, you know you can't reason with someone having an A. But you CAN discuss what he thinks about what a marriage should be. As in, 2 people relying on each other, not letting other influences in. Find out how he thinks a marriage can survive with others involved. Ask him what he would think if you met a man with whom you started corresponding every single day; how would he feel? Try to get him to see WHY you are doing what you're doing.

Keep working your Plan A. Stay calm. Keep conversation to a minimum.

But I think also you need to get your exposure ducks lined in a row which may include contacting the OW/s. Maybe you can put a shoutout to MelodyLane to help you with that.

Hang in there.

OK. I'm working Plan A. Looking good. Making sure the house is clean and dinner is made (although I did this normally) and that home is a nice, relaxing place. We hung out last night...did not really talk much as he is sick (Strep Throat) and fell asleep in the recliner. Then, he went to take a shower and I went to check my email and my MySpace account. Well, they have this silly thing on MySpace where you can Own Your Friends. You can buy your friends as pets and edit what the caption is under their name. It's really rather silly. So - this other chick (from the email) has been "buying" my husband. So...I "buy" him back. When I went to on there last night, she had "bought" him and changed his status to: "Luvs his new owner and wishes no one else would ever buy him again (maybe that will work)" OK - I know this is ridiculous. But - I was pissed. How dare this b**ch invade MY home and MY life? I know that he is ultimately responsible for establishing the boundaries - but, this chick KNOWS he is married. So - then I check the status on her MySpace page and it says: "Can you ever really take back I LOVE YOU." Once again - speculation and silliness. But, when he tells me nothing and all I have is the email thread with them flirting with each other...too many coincidences. Normally, I would have tried to cool down and stop to think rationally about this...but, he came up from the shower like a minute after I saw that and I was HOT! I showed him the messages and told him that I was pissed at HER and who did she think she was? He told me that I was overreacting and that he has not been in contact with her. I told him again that I don't think that he is cheating on me (PA) but what was I supposed to think about this? He told me that I don't know half the story and that had nothing to do with him. I told him that if he told me even a 1/4 of the story it would be better than what I know - the email - and that I would most likely not think twice about the situation. Then he said that I was being insecure. ARGH! Now, I regret blowing up because I know that it's silly. But, at the same time, I don't really because this is MY house, MY life, MY marriage - and I'm trying to make it work and it really made me ANGRY that this person that my husband met at a bar and talked to a few times thinks she has the right to invade my space. I don't think so. SO...today... I take a deep breath and go home and act normal? He has to see how this is affecting me. Can I just bury my head in the sand and wake up when this is over?

These women are invading your space, your home and your marriage because your husband is enjoying their attention.

Why haven't you put a keylogger on the computer so you can find out the truth. Frankly, his claim of wanting to be trusted is ridiculous. Too many things happening to him for him to be innocent.

I agree. Also a voice-activate recorder in the car. I would have gotten answers in one day had I done that...

I live overseas and don't have access to all of those things (key logger and voice activated recorders). I'd have to order those things online. We use separate computers. His is a laptop. I think he would notice anything added to his computer. I'm keeping an eye out.

I have to say that - today - after I was angry last night, he has been acting somewhat normal. I'll see how it goes when I get home tonight. Carrying on with Plan A. (But, thinking about getting a bat to knock some sense into people.

Andi

Andi, all you have to do to get a keylogger is go online and pay for one, from his computer. It then allows you to download it, and once it downloads, it's invisible. Can't be detected unless he's a computer programmer. You get special keys to press to open it up to see the keystrokes, etc. I got one for about $20-$30, and it works great. No need to order anything.

I did not realize that. But, here's the next dilemma...he has his computer password protected.

well, you can research the company you want to get it from, keep the info (URL) and a credit card in your pocket at all times, and just watch for an instance when he is going to be keeping it turned on, but away from it for awhile. Then you can get on, order it and download it, all in about 5 minutes.

OR you could try to negotiate that both of you have each other's passwords. Which is how it should be.

You could order a recorder on ebay or something, couldn't you?

I think you should read through these threads:
spying
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1572288&fpart=1

exposure
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2053438#Post2053438

These are the two parts to your Plan A that you haven't been working on that I think would really help you.

Good luck.

Catperson,

I told him last week that everyone I know has shared passwords with their spouses. So - he knows that is on the table. However, I think he is leery and thinks I am being "nosy". His words. So, I think that approach won't work right now. But...let me research the URL's.

Bitter Pill...

Thanks for your post. It's late and I am tired. I will read those threads in the morning and reply.

Thank you guys SO MUCH for being here for me.

Andi

Today....I am overwhelmed with sadness.

Andi

((andigirl)) I am so sorry to hear you are having a bad day...

This is a traumatic experience...definitely a rollercoaster ride. Not to mention you are still probably dealing with pain from your H's first A years ago.

How are you feeling about the snooping and exposure threads?

We are here for you. Hang in there.