Last week I posted in the Recovery topic, but now I think I am should consider going to Plan B. The fog has not left my WH, I think I was caught in his fog and believed his crap!
Any suggestions on whether this is the best thing at this point?


I am not sure if I can link my other thread other than to give you the URL:
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/ubb...in=151607&Number=2087704#Post2087704

The link worked BTW.

I think you may be right about needing to go into PB, but first think through the whole plan and write a great PBL. You also want to leave him with a totally awesome Plan-A last encounter before going dark. Like a last date or something. (Don't tell him yer about to go into PB though!)

What are your requirements for reconciliation? Put those in your PBL. If you want, post a draft of your letter here and folks will help you edit it. You want it perfect.

You may want to repost on GQII, it gets more traffic.

Thanks Jayne...
I will work on it this week and post it.
I do not know about leaving at a good point in Plan A; he has been avoiding seeing me over the last few days. He won't even take the time to sit down with me and talk about our situation. He insists on talking on the phone. I have been very encouraging and supportive of him overcoming his pain pills withdrawal, building his business, standing up to family and whatever else has been going on. This has not seemed to make a difference.

Any suggestions on getting together with him would be great!

As hard as it is, in Plan A you do not talk about the relationship.
Never never talk about the relationship.
Even when your screaming inside, DO NOT TALK ABOUT THE RELATIONSHIP.
It wont get you anywhere, it pushes WS away, it makes you feel hurt.
Talk about anything else you like. Think up a dozen possible topics that are safe in advance if you need to.

Okay, it is apparent that I have not done a good job of Plan A. When we talk everyday and begin to get closer, I want to move to the next step and he pulls away. This makes so much sense. Is it a good idea to be in Plan A living seperately, especially when he continues to see the OW?

I can only tell you what i did.
it may not have been the best plan A, but it was the best I could do.
First of all i found out what his top En's were. In his case it was RC, H&O, SF, Admiration and Affection.
Now he would not let me fill all those needs, so i concentrated on what he would.
MyWH lived 5 hours away in another town. I had 2 one week stays with him and a long weekend.

DISCLAIMER: I did continue SF. This is not recommended. I have had an STI test. This is recommended.
I spent time with WH, and just 'hung out'. We did some activities, like going for drives, a little recreational shopping, out for a few meals. That was about as much RC as i could do.
I sent a daily appreciation note. I had to draw on the past ALOT. but if he did do something for me I would write it down and it would be used a few days later. I also discovered accidently that he prefered being thanked for his practical help so I made sure those where well represented.
As far as I could I was open and honest with him. I had to use discression. there was alot of stuff I didnt want him to know.
Afffection, well that was rather hit and miss. he didnt want that need filled by me.

I made up my own little mantra:
1. always show your love
2. be the better person
3. expect nothing
4. accept what good comes.


I also got him to tell me what his expectations of me where and what my love busters where, and I worked jolly hard on every single one of them. I wrote another list which is still on the wall beside the bed of what he wanted from me, what not to do, and the mantra underneath it.

What lil says is absolutely true. (I feel like saying, "Well done, grasshopper!" You learn fast. ) Absolutely no relationship talk in Plan A (unless they bring it up, and even then, make sure it's pleasant).

In Plan A, you show them how great life can be with you; you make all the changes they've wanted you to make; you eliminate all LBs and meet whatever ENs you can.

Even with him out of the house, you can do this much. You can eliminate all LBs (which includes relationship talk) and you can meet whatever ENs he will allow.

If you have to meet or talk for any reason, make sure you look your best. Make sure the house looks great, etc. If there's anything he's ever complained about, now's the time to fix it.

If you can bear it, you need to stay in Plan A a little while longer, at least long enough to do it right. You want to leave him with a great memory of how things with you could be.

A good Plan A is extremely hard emotionally. Dr. Harley recommends going on antidepressants. Have you looked into that? I would think just telling your physician that your H has moved out would justify it.

An alternative to EN's and LB's if you dont think you can get him to fill it out is try this modified love languages thing i wrote up for my WH when he first moved out. I emailed it to him and I think because it was so short he did fill it in. I will leave his answers in so you can see what sort of response i got. You can cut them out and email it to your spouse.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Ways to fill the "Emotional Love tank"

Love is a choice.

Words of Affirmation

Verbal compliments on appearance, skills, attributes, abilities. Verbally support and encourage decisions and goals. Empathy: "I know, I care, I am with you, how can I help you?" Kind words. Requests not demands.

Quality time

Giving undivided attention for periods of time. Dating. Walks.. Picnics. Concerts. Shared interests. Family game times. Holidays. Use Active Listening.

Quality activities need a) one person to want to do it, b) other person willing to do it, c) both know why you are doing it - to express love by being together.

Receiving gifts

Doesn’t matter if you’re a spender or a saver. Flower picked from roadside. Card - purchased or made, Single bloom from florist. Favourite biscuit. Anything that there has been a desire expressed for recently. An interesting stone or shell found during quality time together.

Acts of Service

Mowing lawns, cooking tea, wallpapering a room, cleaning car, vacuuming house, helping with jobs. Not done out of fear, guilt or resentment.

Physical touch

Holding hands. Back rubs. Sitting close on couch watching TV. Frequent hugs. Soft caresses. Physical intimacy beyond act of intercourse. Stroking leg. Massaging scalp. Placing hand on shoulder. Stroking face.

Questions

"I feel most love by my spouse when......" Spend time doing things, taking part in my life
What does your spouse fail to do that hurts you deeply? Turn up and take part
What of the above languages do you request of your spouse most frequently? Quality time, Words of affirmation

In what of the ways above do you most express your love to your spouse? Words of affirmation, touch

In what area are you most comfortable expressing love to anyone? Service

I have been on anti depressants and they have been increased and dr added a new one to what I am taking.

I have made a lot of changes over the last 6 months. My husband has even said that I have been truly amazing through this process and I am a strong person. He has noticed good changes in me.

It is apparent that he has allowed to let this woman to get into his head. He ended it this past Friday (which is the second or third timein the last 1 1/2 year) but it doesn't last.

I am wondering about moving out of state. I want to discuss this with him, but I am not supposed to be talking about the relationship, right?

My concerns about not ever bringing up the ongoing affair:

*my daughter is in the middle of the affair because she goes out to dinner and he has the OW and her baby over his house-that messes with her head! How do I not say something about that!?
*also, isn't that sending a message that I have accepted the affair and the way our relationship is?

You can try setting boundaries. Is there anything you can do, like if he does A (like brings OW when D is visiting) then you will do B (ask the court to specify visitation cannot include sleep-overs if OW is around)?

There may not be much you can do. But "nagging" him (sorry, I'm not saying yer nagging, but he prolly sees it that way) won't make him agree with you. So you want to concentrate on the things you DO have control over, and that's just your actions.

You can talk to your D and make sure she understands your values. Depending on her age, you can give some age appropriate explanation. You can't control what he does tho, whether you bring up R talk or not.

In the past I tried the setting boundaries to not include D in activities with OW; he said he understood my feelings and would. That turned out to be a lie-he just tried to hide it from me. So, even though it makes me sick to have my daughter around her there is not much I can do. I have talked to my daughter and she knows what the Bible says about this situation, etc. That is the only thing that I can control.

Last night my WH and D met me for dinner; we had a nice time, nothing serious, just kept it light. We all enjoyed it. My WH told me that he really knew he didn't want to be with the OW, but he did not want to be alone. He said he was afraid to get back with me because he does not want it to go back to the way things were before. I pointed out that I have changed quite a bit over the last year and he agreed. That conversation was great progress (even for my WH to figure out what he is feeling).

Although,tonight he is spending the eve with the OW. I will just have to continue to pray consistently and maintain the most kind and consistant behavior that is humanly possible.

Unfortunately, I am in a bad living situation. I am renting a room from my friend and her husband. My friend just found out yesterday that they are being foreclosed on and have until the 21st of this month to get out. I will have to pray for some doors to open. It is an interesting position to be in!

Anyway, thank you for your suggestions, it is helpful to get insight and sometimes confirmation for what I am already doing.

It sounds like you are doing the best you can under the circumstances. Good job, keep it up.


That's great! I'm sure that made some love bank deposits.

About the part I put in bold: you want to make sure that you are doing this [i]for your own self]/i]; you are making these changes, because you want to be a better person and a better wife; if not his wife, then someone else's, but no matter what, YOU WANT to make these changes.

Make sure that's how you think of it. Then he will sense it also. Plus, if he brings it up again, you can tell him. You could even thank him for helping to open your eyes! And make sure he knows that these changes are permanent, whether he comes back or not. If he doesn't want the benefit of being married to the new-and-improved you, then someone else can. But you LIKE the person you are becoming, and you WANT these changes FOR YOURSELF.


Did you leave the marital home? If so, you should try to get back in it. You shouldn't be the one to leave, he should. You are not the one walking away from the marriage. If he wants to live there also, fine, he can rejoin the marriage. Otherwise, you and your D should be living in the marital home, not him.

Thanks for the encouragement.

One thing we talked about earlier on was that I was definately not happy with myself and where I was at personally.

I like the way you phrase this-it is a great way to make love bank deposits but also emphasizing that this is not all about him!

As far as the living situation....
In February we moved out of the home that we were leasing for almost 3 years. Due to financial changes, etc it was something that we had been trying not to do but could no longer avoid the move. Initially we were going to move seperately, then decided to move together. He found and secured a house and put his name only on the lease...the house is one block away from the OW! I could not go into that kind of situation where he could kick me out legally. Therefore, I moved in with friends. In some ways I think it would be best to move in with him, claim the house and my family; put positive energy and prayer into the house, etc. Financially, it would be best for both of us; I know my daughter would be better off as well. The other part of me does not want to seem like a fool who is willing to put myself out there more than I already have. Does that make sense? My WH and I are meeting after church tomorrow to talk about the living situation, I am not sure how to approach this-I do not want to push my way into the house however I think he should step up to his responsibility to me and my daughter as well. I have learned through this process that he has to want to take responsibility and I can't push it. Can you suggest the best way to approach our conversation tomorrow?

I'll think on it today and see what I come up with, as far as specific suggestions on what to say.

Meanwhile, I definitely think you need to claim your position in that house, back with your family. So I guess your D lives in that house? Then it looks like (I'm not saying it is; I'm just saying, to the casual outside observer, and maybe at least subconsciously to your D) that you are the one who left.

It will also make Plan A whole lot easier. In Plan A you certainly don't want to be the one who left.

I think this conversation tomorrow about moving in is very important - what conditions and boundaries do you want to set (Do you think he'd agree to NC?); and how best to explain your change of heart regarding leaving. I think you should explain that you aren't ready to give up on the M yet; that being away has given you some time to think about *yourself* and the kind of life *you* want to live and the example *you* want to show for your D.

I think you need to get as much advice as possible. How about posting this question on GQII?

Great idea-I am going to post it now. Look forward to talking to you soon! THANK YOU!