no the guy is from California. she lied to me and told me that she was going with her dad to California this weekend, instead she went over there and spent the weekend with the om and then brought him back with her to her apartment in Nevada. (all the while my daughter was with my mother-in-law in nevada. so at this moment everyone is in Nevada. I don't know if he is here to stay or if she just brought him over to stay for awhile. i don't even know if he works or not.

you are all going to have to fill me in on all of your abreviations. I can only pick up on some of them.

Here's a list Justuss (one of our mods) put together:

Most Common MB Acronyms (Alphabetically):

BS = Betrayed Spouse
D-Day = Discovery Day
DH = Divorced Husband or Darling Husband
DJ = Disrespectful Judgement
DV-Day = Divorce Day
DW = Divorced Wife or Dear Wife
EA = Emotional Affair
EN = Emotional Needs
FOO = Family of Origin
FS = Faithful Spouse ("betrayed")
G&T = "Give & Take: The Secret to Marital Compatibility"
H = Husband
HNHN = "His Needs, Her Needs"
LB = Love Bust(er)
MB = Marriage Builders
MLC = Mid-life Crisis
OC = Other Child (S's and OP's)
OM = Other Man
OMW = Other Man's Wife
OP = Other Person
OPS = Other Persons's Spouse
OW = Other Woman
OWH = Other Woman's Husband
PA = Physical Affair
POJA = The Policy of Joint Agreement
S = Spouse
SAA = "Surviving An Affair"
SAHD = Stay At Home Dad
SAHM = Stay At Home Mom
SO = Significant Other
W = Wife
WAW = Walk Away Wife
WS = Wayward Spouse ("betrayer")

Relationship Acronyms:
BF = Biological Father/Boyfriend
BIL = Brother In Law
BM = Biological Mother
DD = Darling Daughter
DS = Darling Son
FIL = Father In Law
GF = Girlfriend
GP = Grand Parent(s)
MIL = Mother In Law
SD = Step Daughter
SF = Step Father
SIL = Sister In Law
SM = Step Mother
SS = Step Son
STBX = Soon To Be Ex

MB specific Acronyms (CB MB forum members)
CB = Coined By
P.U.S.H. = Pray Until Something Happens (CB… NSR... see Inspire (20))
PTC = Patience, Time and Consistency (CB… NSR... for Plan A to work!)
TDNT = That Do Nothing Thing (CB… NSR/RMA)

Generally accepted Acronyms:
BTW = By The Way
IMHO = In My Humble Opinion
IMO = In My Opinion
IMVHO = In My Very Humble Opinion
LMAO - Laughing My *Rump* Off
LOL = Laughing Out Loud
ROTFLMAO = Rolling On The Floor Laughing My *Rump* Off
EOM = End Of Message

Divorce/Custody Acronyms:
CP = Custodial Parent
CPS = Child Protective Services
CS = Child Support
CSE = Child Support Enforcement
DCW = Dept. of Child Welfare
FOC = Friend Of the Court
GAL = Guardian Ad Litem
MSOL = Marital Standard Of Living
NCP = Non Custodial Parent
PAS = Parental Alienation Syndrome

what is the

plan A

plan B

bd,

plan A is what you must implement to deal with your WW.

I dont' have the time to expand on it.

Plan B is much simpler. You cut off contact with the wayward wife in every single way. No calls, texts, or any communications until she ends the affair and establishes no contact with OM and agrees to return home to fix the marriage.

Plan A is basically to end behavior that was bad, stop talking about relationships, make yourself attractive to your spouse, be strong, and compete with the affair. You give unconditional love and expect none in return. Plan A is hard because you'll be hungry for affection from her.

Read up on it. It's easy to find on this site.

It sounds like you have a good head on your shoulders, but establishing an emergency order is extremely important if you want to protect your rights as a father.

Print out his Myspace page as evidence. Same goes for any your WW may have. It's evidence which shows character.

Best of luck and get that lawyer on the case!

ok, so I read the plan A plan B stuff. now i need some help. i kind of have a mixed situation. I think that my wife has been formulating a plan to leave me for a long time now. this guy has only been in the picture for a few months now. how do i go about the negotiation process. she has been gone for over 2 months, we have talked about all kinds of stuff. I do think that she rekindled with this guy when she went back there for vacation. so all of the conversations that we had before don't really fully apply anymore. this whole time i have been perpetrated as the bad guy that distroyed everything. i do fully admit that we were very distant for a long time. so a lot of this is my fault. but fault or no fault now i am not the only bad guy here now. i am the one that has been betrayed. she broke the marriage vows not me, and she drove a few hundred miles to drag this guy back. how do I go about the negotiation process now? I can see what I need to do, but I don't know how to go about it. please help! any wrong move at tis point and the whole thing will blow up.

i am probably going to see her when i go see my daughter on friday and I need to formulate a plan.

dude in ca they have something called an "emergency custody order". you can file one and get legal physical custody of your dd until your w contests it in court. with the situiation where w has abandoned the family you should have a good chance of winning this case. see if they have one in nev.

a few point blank court papers will get her realizing quite fast what she is doing to her family

i may not be that up on all the ins and outs of mb stuff but i don't see what knowing a darn thing about om can do for you.

you need to know what your w is thinking. it is obvious that she wants out of the m right now and has for some time. but why is the question you need to answer

once you find that out you will have a direction to head in.

good luck

There is no negotiating. You need to take emergency steps to protect your rights as a father and your daughter's safety. Under no circumstances do you negotiate.

The negotiation is simple.

Come home. Work on the marriage. DD2 stays here until you get your head out of your rectum.

Negotionation done. You grow a pair and she respects you for it.

Protect your DD2. THAT is all that really matters right now.

i understand what you are saying. I am taking steps to protect my child. she is in a safe place right now and i am going to get her on friday, then i am going to take steps from there. but after my daughter is safe i need to start plan A. saying what you just said to her is not going to work at all. i really need some real advice on how to go about this situation. after my child is with me, then I still need to start the negotiation process. will someone please help me on this?

A "plan" for what?




bdhinferno, there IS no "negotiating" with a Wayward Spouse who is lost in the fog of selfishness and adultery.

There are Standards and Boundaries, but not any "negotitaton process."

Her "idea" of negotiating, at this point, is for you "to go along with whatever she wants." That isn't much of a negotiation, is it?

She seems to planning on taking you child away from you, probably out of State. That's not much of a negotitation, is it?

She is having, at the very least, an "Exit Affair" of HER choosing, for her own predetermined reasons. That's not much of a negotiation with you, is it?

Negotiations will be handled by attorneys.

Recovery from adultery is another thing entirely.


Your ONLY focus (if you want to try to save your marriage) at this time should be on "Destablizing the Affair." The PLAN for that is all over this system. Only when the affair is destablized will the "fog" begin to thin and she MIGHT be able to begin to start thinking rationally again. And the fog does not lift "all at once," but it DOES take some sunlight to begin to shine on what is hidden by the fog in order for things to "heat up" enough for the fog to begin to lift. You don't "negotiate," for example, EXPOSING the affair. You DO it unilaterally because an adulterous spouse will never "negotiate" with you on that point, and that point is a VITAL step should you really want to try to get the fog to begin parting so you CAN have a shot at recovering your marriage.

thank you. I need any kind of advice. I have read the materials but i am still a little bit lost. I know that my first plan of action should be to destabalize the relationship. other than getting it out in the open what else can I do at this point? this is the kind of advice that I need.

I want to show you the negotiation process that I am talking about. I am going to cut and paste Dr. Harley's words to show you what I am talking about:

Plan A is for the betrayed spouse to negotiate with the wayward spouse to totally separate from the lover without angry outbursts, disrespect, and demands. These three Love Busters not only ruin any effort to reach a negotiated settlement, but they also make the betrayed spouse much less attractive to the wayward spouse. Instead of encouraging total separation from the lover, the anger, disrespect and demands of the betrayed spouse make the lover appear to be the only one who truly cares about the wayward spouse. They literally throw the wayward spouse into the arms of the lover.

On the other hand, if the betrayed spouse approaches the wayward spouse with respect and thoughtfulness, the cruelty and self-indulgence of the affair is much easier for the wayward spouse to understand. And once the wayward spouse's mistake is acknowledged, it's much easier for him or her to take the first step toward recovery by agreeing to never see or talk to the lover again.

In these negotiations for total separation, the causes of the affair should be addressed. Since one of these causes is usually unfulfilled emotional needs, the betrayed spouse should express a willingness to meet those needs after the affair has ended. Another common cause is a wayward spouse's failure to take the betrayed spouse's feelings into account. The betrayed spouse's inconsiderate behavior sometimes leads the wayward spouse to believe that he or she has the right to return thoughtlessness with thoughtlessness by having an affair. Willingness of the betrayed spouse to follow the Policy of Joint Agreement goes a long way toward resolving the issue of thoughtlessness.



This is what I need help with.

As I said when I posted before, I am no attorney but the main thing that I would want to do right now is get your DD home safe with you. That gives you a legal leg to stand on, keeps your child out of harm's way and is an eye-opener for your wife. After you have done that, you can think about Plan-A.

Your MIL could be a terrific help to you once you have your baby home. You should get more info on and check out what a scum ball this guy is after you have your baby at home etc, etc.

Just please don't get yourself in a position where your unreasonable, alien WW is angry as she can be and has your daughter. Don't set yourself up for twice a month long distance visitation with DD while WW and unknown scumball raise her.

Get your daughter home first!!!!

God's Blessings,

Say

Bud, you're dealing with the most irrational creature that exists on this earth: a wayward.

They are selfish creatures. They think nothing of how they hurt others. They possess no redeeming qualities at all.

Negotiations are pointless because 100% of the words coming out of their mouths can't be trusted and because 50% of what you see can't be trusted.

So all you can do is take action. Negotiations happen with someone who is going to participate and concede. That doesn't happen with waywards. So you are, by default, acting alone.

Plan A is a start. That's as solid a plan as you can get. I will post the 180 for you to execute in dealing with you WW.

So what "advice" can i offer?

Here's a good list of things:

Believe none of what you hear and half of what you see when dealing with your WW.

Under no circumstances is your DD2 to be around OM.

Learn to reverse babble.

Expect you WW to say certain things all waywards say (usually after exposure):

"you're violating my privacy"
"How dare you betray my trust this way"
"You're smearing my reputation and dragging my name in the mud"
"We had a chance but you just ruined it! There's no way we can be together now!" (This one is effective in scaring betrayed husbands in particular)
"Why do you want to be with someone who doesn't want to be with you?"
"You can't force me to stay!"
"DD2 will be fine. She'll adjust."
"Millions of people divorce. People adjust and are fine."
"I love him. He's way better than you because (insert something hurtful in here that she pokes at)"


What kind of stuff makes OM better in her eyes? He's more exciting. Better in bed. Listens more. Is understanding. Is a nice guy. Is sensitive. Is a better man than you. Likes kids. Floats in air and performs miracles.

Expect any of the above when reference is made to OM.

You'll also hear, "he has nothing to do with why I want to end things".

Here's the reality. There is no chance at all that you can recover your marriage so long as another person is in the picture in any way at all.

So the advice you're asking for is to tell you to prepare to fight a very longly and emotionally draining battle. You'll hear many things that hurt and will likely hear everything said above nearly verbatim.

Oh, I can't forget this one either since you are working with MIL:

"Why are you dragging my family into this? I can't believe you'd be so low!"

So you're asking for advice and one big piece of advice is to forewarn you of things you will hear. You won't be surprised when you hear them this way and can be prepared with good answers.

I hope this helps.

Several years ago, Michelle Wiener Davis, the author of Divorce Busting, introduced a concept to the world of infidelity that is designed to help you and your partner move forward in the healing of your relationship. It is my suggestion that any new betrayed partner implement these behaviors immediately. They aren’t designed to make you look good or your partner bad. They are, however, a means of protection for the betrayed. They also empower the betrayed to face their new world with dignity and bravery. They appear stronger to the wayward partner and at this point in time, that is exactly what you want to portray.
This list was originally titled, “The 180” and it won’t take you long to figure out why. What you are actually doing is a complete 180 degree rotation in your actions and attitude. You no longer are a weeping sack of sorrow. Suddenly, you appear strong, happy, independent, and quite capable of making it on your own.
The 180
1. Don't pursue reason, chase, beg, plead or implore.

2. No frequent phone calls.

3. Don't point out "good points" in marriage.

4. Don't follow her/him around the house.

5. Don't encourage or initiate discussion about the future.

6. Don't ask for help from the family members of your wayward partner.

7. Don't ask for reassurances.

8. Don't buy or give gifts.

9. Don't schedule dates together.

10. Don't keep saying, "I Love You!" Because if you really think about it, he/she is, at this particular moment, not very loveable.

11. Do more than act as if you are moving on with your life; begin moving on with your life!

12. Be cheerful, strong, outgoing and independent.

13. Don't sit around waiting on your spouse - get busy, do things, go out with friends, enjoy old hobbies, find new ones! But stay busy!

14. When home with your spouse, (if you usually start the conversation) be scarce or short on words. Don't push any issue, no matter how much you want to!

15. If you're in the habit of asking your spouse his/her whereabouts, ASK NOTHING. Seem totally uninterested.

16. Your partner needs to believe that you have awakened to the fact that "they (the wayward partner)" are serious concerning their assertions as to the future (or lack there of) of your marriage. Thus, you are you are moving on with your life…with out them!

17. Don't be nasty, angry or even cold - Just pull yourself back. Don't always be so available…for anything! Your spouse will notice. More important, he/she will notice that you're missing.

18. No matter what you are feeling TODAY, only show your spouse happiness and contentment? Make yourself be someone they would want to be around, not a moody, needy, pathetic individual but a self assured individual secure in the knowledge that they have value.

19. All questions about the marriage should be put on hold, until your spouse wants to talk about it (which may not be for quite a while). Initiate no such conversation!

20. Do not allow yourself to lose your temper. No yelling, screaming or name calling EVER. No show of temper! Be cool, act cool; be in control of the only thing you can control? YOURSELF!

21. Don't be overly enthusiastic.

22. Do not argue when they tell you how they feel (it only makes their feelings stronger). In fact, refuse to argue at all!

23. Be patient and learn to not only listen carefully to what your spouse is really saying to you? HEAR what it is that they are saying! Listen and then listen some more!

24. Learn to back off, keep your mouth shut and walk away when you want to speak out, no matter what the provocation. No one ever got themselves into trouble by just not saying anything.

25. Take care of you. Exercise, sleep, laugh & focus on all the other parts of your life that are not in turmoil.

26. Be strong, confident and learn to speak softly.

27. Know that if you can do this 180, your smallest CONSISTENT action will be noticed far more than any words you can say or write.

28. Do not be openly desperate or needy even when you are hurting more than ever and are feeling totally desperate and needy.

29. Do not focus on yourself when communicating with your spouse. It's not always about you! More to the point, at present they just don't care!

30. Do not believe any of what you hear them say and less than 50% of what you see. Your spouse will speak in absolute negatives and do so in the most strident tones imaginable. Try to remember that they are also hurting and afraid. Try to remember that they know what they are doing is wrong and so they will say anything they can to justify their behavior.

31. Do not give up no matter how dark it is or how bad you feel. It "ain't over till it's over!"
32. Do not backslide from your hard earned changes. Remain consistent! It is the consistency of action and attitude that delivers the message.
33. When expressing your dissatisfaction with the actions of the wayward party, never be judgmental, critical or express moral outrage. Always explain that your dissatisfaction is due to the pain that the acts being committed are causing you as a person. This is the kind of behavior that will cause you to be a much more attractive and mysterious individual. Further it SHOWS that you are NOT afraid to move on with your life. Still more important, it will burst their positive little bubble; the one in which they believe that they can always come back to you in case things don't work out with the affair partner.

thank you much for all of your help. this is going to be tuff but you have given me more tools to work with.

ok here is another question. when I go over there tomorrow what happens if i find myself face to face with the om? I know what i personally would do left to my own demise, but that is not productive or healthy. so how do i handle that if it arises? this is not all his fault, but he knows that she is married and has a kid. he is scum, but I don't want to lower myself to his level, and I don't want to do anything that would legally jepordize my standing in the right with my daughter.

On the very off chance he is there I would laugh at him and say 'thanks for taking that *bleep* off my hands'.

Then pick up your daughter and leave.

thats real cute