Just Learning,

I need some of your perspective about now. I have an issue that I could use some of your insight. Please bear with me as I may ramble some because my thoughts are all over the place right now.

You have kept up with us and I feel you have a good handle on where we were and where we are now. We had a damn good M pre-A ... our M was the envy of all of our friends and family. FogFree had a touch of most things being "all about her", but she had led a sheltered upbringing, was the classic "good girl" and had seriously never really had a major life "screw up" prior to this.

I, on the other hand, had made numerous bad life choices ... had taken responsibility for them and had finally reached a point in my life where I thought all of that was behind me. I had paid my dues and was ready to enjoy "empty nesting" with the woman of my dreams.

I know some of this is normal, but we seemed to be sailing along in the early stages of R, and then on February 14th (Valentine's Day) I was shopping for a card for FogFree, and as I read through the cards, I could feel the anger welling inside and it really hasn't subsided yet. I realized at that point, that FogFree was still anything but "fog free" as she still hadn't "gotten it" about just how much this had affected me.

It was a month or so later that we had a big blow up, after she had made a particularly "fogged" up reference to something (I honestly don't remember what it was) and I nearly lost it ... the rage just overwhelmed me and I at least had the presence to leave for the evening and spent the night at our hunting cabin alone. For the record, I have never even considered any physical violence towards FogFree ... its just not my style ... honestly, it would be much more likely that I would take out my anger on myself or a couple of auxillary players in this mess, but realistically that is remote, also.

Anyway, after this episode, something seemed to click inside FogFree and she "got it". She seemed to acquire a "sense" of what I was feeling and needed to briing me out of my anger/depression at any particular time. In fact, on a couple of particularly dark days in the past few months, she has really taken charge and dragged me through some very tough spots. She tells me how very much she loves me ... how sorry she is ... and how she regrets hurting me so badly. She is sincere and it shows through in her eyes, actions and words.

However, the rage has remained, basically unchecked for months now. I have never felt so out of control of my emotions for an extended period in my life, and today it is about to "ring the bell". You see, in a couple of hours, it will be exactly one year since FogFree hooked up for a ONS with the POSOM, while she was on a vacation with her girlfriends. One year ago tonight she was drinking and dancing with this slimeball that she had just met ... tomorrow moring will be one year since she woke up holding him and right now I'm bouncing back and forth between a deep depression and outright RAGE!!!

I understand why I'm all screwed up today, but why won't the underlying anger go away?

In a way, I feel guilty, because they're BH's here that would give anything to hear that their FWW was sorry for what they did and the pain they inflicted on them and loved them more than anything ... AND REALLY MEAN IT!!!

Of the regular posters here, I probably "relate" to Krazy71 the most. I "understand" his anger ... I feel the same thing, but I didn't experience anything as devestating as he did ... so WHY is this anger not going away?

I will admit to feeling better when I've forced myself to stay away from MB for extended periods, but I still come back here ... maybe looking for something ... I don't know. I mean, I REALLY HATE this place ... I HATE adultery ... I HATE seeing fellow BH's in pain and confusion and I hate myself for not having better control of myself.

I've dealt with some pretty terrible situations throughout my life, but I've always faced them "head on" and gotten through them relatively well, but this is DIFFERENT.

You seem to have a way of seeing inside of someone's posts and cutting through the "stuff" to get at what is really troubling a person in need ... I hope you still have your magic.

Thanks, again!!!

I've wondered the same thing.

There are plenty of BHs who have it far worse than I do...men whose wives are "in love" and take off with OM, take a year to de-fog if they ever do, etc.

I had none of that. I've asked myself many times, "Why I am still angry enough to disembowel OM like William Wallace, in full view of his entire family?"

Another part of my brain answers that question with this answer:

"She still *****edit***him, didn't she?"

"Yes."

"Well, then that's why you're still pissed off."



That's what worries me. I'm not angry because she's lacked remorse, or she's foggy, or I'm worried about continued contact...I'm just angry that she ***edit*** him, plain and simple.

Since time machines are in short supply, I don't know if it will ever go away. At this point, I've nearly integrated that anger into my personality in order to cope.

I didn't want to be the "angry, bitter old man" type as I aged, but I think I probably will be.

MyRev, I know you didn't ask me, but I wanted to comment because I know exactly where you are in your recovery. The peak of my RAGE came right around 8-9 months, where the shock wore off and the rage came out. I felt such rage from about 8 months to 12 months and then it gradually subsided. I thought things like "why am I am settling for this bum" etc, etc, etc... It is my observation that most BS' peak, in rage, somewhere around 8 to 12 months. After that, it seems to gradually subside until you think about it less and less.

So, your mileage may vary, but your pattern looks very normal to me and I would expect that you become less and less angry over the next few months. The first year is the WORST, and after that it seems to get better and better.

Sorry about the language...I thought I had sufficiently censored myself. Obviously not.

ML, thanks for responding and I appreciate your persepctive. However, in reading yours and Krazy's responses ... I seem to relate much more to what Krazy is describing.

Maybe I just relate to other BH's pain better ... I don't know, but Krazy's response was a pretty accurate addition to my original post. Most days, I keep a lid on my anger, but its always laying just under the surface for some unsuspecting person to do or say the wrong thing.

It is affecting my job performance. I think a couple of my co-workers and possibly my son "sense" that something is wrong, but so far, no one has inquired about it ... it may be one of those questions, that they would rather not hear the answer ... who knows.

I'm bothered that this anger has drowned out my passions, and I no longer find any joy in the things that I'd always turned to for comfort and grounding.

That's about my timeline, and I was already divorced when it happened. Still working in the "less and less" phase.

I think you'll do fine.

I've always been ssssllllllloooooowwwwww to let anger, grudges, and resentment go. Now I'm supposed to forgive and get over this beast? It seems impossible.

Although my d-day was quite recent, I too would like to join this club of BH's that are having rage issues. Heck, I'm moving to another town, because if I don't I'm probably going to end up in jail. I don't even go to the grocery store, because if I run into him, it's 100% certain that he's gettin' it.

And, I haven't even come close to the 1 year mark that you guys are speaking of...that's scary.

MyRev

I'm not JL but I can empathise with you and Krazy. You have both hit the one yeaar mark, and what Mel says is true. You've had one year to come out of the shock and daze and confusion of your life and M exploding out from underneath you, and the realization that it was the one person in the world you were convinced beyond all doubt that you could totally trust.

Pretty harsh reality when it finally sinks in, and after one year, you can rest assured it has now sunk it. Your new reality, so to speak. For you, Krazy, me and all other BS's. And yeah it just plain sucks. Well at least, at first.

But if you will trust and old man, after 6 years of this stuff, it does fade with each passing year. Even now, I have my moments, but I refuse to bring it up. I occupy myself doing other things to distract myself, and as that old saying goes, "this too shall pass."

Hang in there guys, this is the toughest journey you will probably ever take. OTOH, you have an opportunity here to rebuild your character with a base of love, mercy, and forgiveness. In time you will come to appreciate the new change in yourself. Right now, it feels awkward, but learn patience and understanding and you will come out on top.

All Blessings,
Jerry

Is it about respect?

I always thought that my W had to earn my respect back after the A. I was so angry at the whole A. So, she had to earn my respect back. This was my battle ground. My placeholder for my anger.

But, I think it was Dr. Harley that told me there was the problem. It was so clear to him. I still remember it.

He stated, that in a marriage and a romantic relationship, respect is a mandatory condition. It is given.

Good post

MyRev,

From my observations here everyone is telling you something very consistent. It takes time. The first year seems to about remembering what happened "last year". After the anniversary of the A ending, then memories are of recovery. A year later they are about your life as it is now. For some reason us humans seem to mark time in years, not months, but years. I think that is part of the issue.

But, you said something else that caught my eye. You said
It struck me, although I might be wrong, that you expect your W to be a "classic good girl". Not an unreasonable expectation right. But you yourself have made a few bad life choices. You have overcome them, but you sort of expect yourself to mess up, but not her.

Fair enough. I know I am going to hear from the women on this comment, but hey it won't be the first time.

Most of us guys grow up expecting to "mess up". Especially when it comes to relationships. I think most women grow expecting us to "mess up" as well.

However, most of us guys expect "classic good girls" to never mess up, after all they know more about relationships than we do, they have their boundaries in place (yup, we have felt the sting when we crossed one right?). We expect our "classic good girl" wifes to actually lead us in this regard...and they do for the most part.

My guess is that your anger may come from "accepting" that your W failed and then you not doing anything about it. Yet, and here is where the conflict comes, she has forgiven you your messups in the past, so you should do the same.

I think the "peace of setting it down" comes when you realize, even good people mess up. Better people realize their mistake and work to overcome it within themselves and those they have hurt. Your expectations of your W while very admirable and I am sure enjoyed by your W, were not realistic with regard to her messing up.

You know the chain, right? Expectations lead to resentment, lead to anger, lead to poisoning yourself. You know you are poisoning yourself, which is why you are asking now.

So paraphrase an old saying (when one finds themselve in a hole, the first step is to put the shovel down), when feeling the anger of expectations, step away emotionally and ask yourself about what it is you expect.

You are a bright man. You know intellectually all of us mess up. But, emotionally this just plain hurts, because you loved a "Saint", and she failed you.

But, here is where I think sometimes I see things a bit differently than some here. I think the true measure of a person is what they do, after they mess up. What they do, despite their limitation. Fogfree is "getting it". She is doing her level best to make your marriage, her future/your future, the best it can be. You are actually doing the same.

It seems to me the change in perspective is to see what she is doing NOW as a measure of her character, rather than what she did when she messed up. I would dare say that you probably evaluate your own character this way as well, or you should. You may have messed up, but you learned, your overcame, and you became someone you respect. I am sure others respect you as well.

Does this make any sense?

You know I sort of harp on this perspective thing. It is because I have been exposed to what perspective can do to ones evaluation of someone...good and bad.

MyRev, I may be missing the mark, but you miss the "idol and rock" your W was, while not appreciating the quality of her character when confronted with her own failings. You did not fail by giving her a chance to show her character. YOu did not fail by showing your character by giving her the opportunity to show you her love for you.

MyRev, you should be at peace with yourself, because you had the Grace to allow her to show you what she is really made of...it is good stuff. You chose wisely my friend, you really did.

I hope something I have said is of use to you.

God Bless,

JL

MyRev - I have severe reservations about posting to you since I am pretty certain you aren't interested in anything I might have to say, but I've also lived through the sort of anger you are experiencing and thought maybe I might be able to say something that you could use to begin to "get past" this anger stage that you don't like. If you'd prefer I not post, simply say so and I will not intrude.

Thoughts:

As others have said, this "anger stage" is very normal. Sometimes it's intense and sometimes it's very intense, but it tends to happen to most, if not all, Betrayed Spouses sometime around the 6 to 12 month mark of when REAL recovery began.

In some respects it's like Post Traumatic Shock Syndrome. In other respects it's a function of actually beginning to believe that your spouse really does love you and you no longer feel as thought you are "walking on eggshells" and that he/she won't leave if you aren't all "Plan A sort of lovey and nice." In some respects it is "restoring the balance" with anger counterweighting betrayal. Once balance is reached, they "negate" each other, and we move on toward a Recovered marriage.

There really doesn't seem to be much to do to avoid the emotions of anger, especially because the hurt is real and it is very personal.

There is something about what is referred to as the "holy of holies" in a person's heart and in their marriage, and only the spouse is to have the key to that place. When that key is given to someone else, there is a diminishing of the "specialness" of that place and the plan God had for marriage between a husband and wife. It CAN be restored, but the process is painful, and anger over the loss is one of the consequences that must be worked through. "Working through it" entails both understanding what promises a forgiver makes to the one being forgiven and a conscious commitment to uphold the promises.

It isn't "easy," but as with most things, the more one does it, the "easier" it gets. Obviously, that also entails the passage of time as the "doing it" isn't just a one time thing but is something that is done daily, sometimes with great struggle to be faithful to the promise that was made.

It is hard because it is something that the BS has to do and it can't be done by the WS, and that, too, can seem "unfair."

The "wrath of God" over sin, especially adultery against God, is often just a "phrase" people hear but never really begin to understand. It is my contention that a Betrayed Spouse feels a little of the magnitude of God's wrath against sin because adultery is the one sin that is both against God and against "me" personally. Most other sins are not directly against me, and certainly not on the level of betraying the "no other person beside me" as is the "no other gods beside me" sort of thing.

I have many times listed the "threefold promise" that is inherent in choosing to forgive someone, so perhaps you already know it. But the one aspect of those promises that is so very hard to do is the "I will not dwell on the forgiven sin" part. This stuff is so hurtful that is "on the mind" literally every day for a long time. When triggers hit, when memories are brought to the front, when the pain is revisited....it is not the initial desperation and anguish that hits, it is the ANGER that was suppressed and is not given "audience" as the recovery is beginning to really be believed.

This is also a "danger time." This is the time when anger can be "stoked" and the flames kept burning intensely. If that is allowed to continue, the little voice that says "stop before it's too late" is ignored, it can destroy recovery as the spouse is crushed under the weight of guilt and condemnation.

When we talk about "enduring," it doesn't just apply to enduring the WS "fog" stage of a current affair, it also applies to the long and sometimes very stressful recovery process. This "anger stage" is part of that process, and unless you choose to let you anger continue to burn, it WILL pass. You will still feel anger from time to time, but the "white hot inferno" type of anger will not be there. The reason is that the anger is directed at a "past reality," and that past is being replaced by a new reality, one in which your spouse DOES love you and will NOT be the cause of such pain again. And you start to believe it. Once you reach that stage you will also begin to trust your spouse for real again.

This process sucks, I know. It is also why it is known that the "average" recovery takes two years. Mine took almost 6 years, but each is different and depends upon the individual marital situation.

Hang in there. It WILL get better.

TJD,

In addition to FogFree regaining respect, I am also struggling with my own self-respect, which is something that I'm finding difficult, as confidence has never really been an issue for me.

Regarding the quote above ... would you please expand on this. I'm not sure I understand the context of what Dr. Harley was saying.

JL,

Once again, you've stepped up to the challenge.

You have stated so many things that are POWERFUL for me right now. Admittedly, I'm pretty emotional this evening. I'd like to re-read your post several times and then comment on a few (maybe several) of the parts that connected with me.

Thank You VERY Much!!!

FH,

We may be as different in our beliefs and personalities as two people can be, but unfortunately, we share a common bond, and I've learned from the school of hard knocks not to discount the knowledge of someone who has travelled a similar path before me.

Certain parts of your post resonate with me, especially those dealing with the missing "specialness" and your anger issues.

I've found much wisdom within this entire thread so far.

Thank You.

MyRev,

I hope I have helped.

God Bless,

JL

MyRev,

I know you and I have disagreed about things in the past... but I wanted you to know I'm pulling for you here. I think JL is right on the money. I understand that BHs feel rage as you describe - but I see nothing more heroic than someone who is willing to forgive, and to work at that forgiveness - especially if they have to work hard at it.

You're going thru a rough time now... but I'm very confident you'll find that peace you are seeking.

All the best!

JL,

I can't tell you how many times I read this over and over last night and again this morning. Not only does it make sense, but I think you've PINPOINTED a big part of my conflict.

I believe that I was holding FogFree to a higher standard than I did myself. I knew I was capable of making a major life screw up, but she was a 40 something and never had experienced anything like this. While I took great pride in her "purity", for lack of a better word, I never looked at her as fallible. I trusted her so much, that I never considered that she had ZERO life experiences on how to handle a situation like this where she encountered a predator in a setting where she had no real support system.

I now see HOW this could have happened, I just never considered that it actually WOULD happen to HER.

I guess that once it did happen and we were faced with picking up the pieces ... my "image" bubble had burst, and the anger built gradually over her failing, with a few spikes in anger around certain triggered events.

Your recommendation of a change in perspective is spot on. I DO define my own character by my ability to deal with and rebound from past mistakes, and even prosper. Now I need to hold FogFree to THAT standard also.

She really is the model for "F"ormer WW's now ... maybe not 6 months ago, but she has GROWN so much, and at this point, I no longer question her commitment to our M or her unconditional love for me. I really do see this whole mess as a complete abheration of her normal character.

With that said, and with YOUR direction, now I need to focus on the part of her character that has motivated her to own her mistake, learn from this and establish boundaries and extraordinary precautions to insure that it won't happen again, and return to me as a fully engaged and participating partner.

Furthermore, I need to work on putting away the "act" of her betrayal into the place where I have kept my previous life failings after they have been dealt with and conquered, and focus on the here and now, rather than the there and then.


JL, I doubt you have any idea just how powerfully this statement hit me and affected me. I TRULY value your opinion, and it means so much that others can see the traits in FogFree that I do.

This has been a rougher than normal couple of days, but overall, I'm mostly back to the place where I am PROUD to claim and proclaim FogFree as my WIFE with no other qualifiers or discriptive letters.

Thank You so much for your time and PERSPECTIVE!!!

[quote=MyRevelation
She really is the model for "F"ormer WW's now ... maybe not 6 months ago, but she has GROWN so much, and at this point, I no longer question her commitment to our M or her unconditional love for me. I really do see this whole mess as a complete abheration of her normal character.


This has been a rougher than normal couple of days, but overall, I'm mostly back to the place where I am PROUD to claim and proclaim FogFree as my WIFE with no other qualifiers or discriptive letters.

Thank You so much for your time and PERSPECTIVE!!! [/quote]

I don't know when I've been more TOUCHED than when I read this--I LOVE YOU, MY DH!!

JL,

You have been a rock and a beacon for both of us during the past year, and you'll never know how much we appreciate the time and effort and words of WISDOM that you have given to each of us. Your post made me cry for a long time last night (my eyes are still swollen, thanks to you! and this post from my DH has made me cry as well. You are a blessing to MB, and I look forward to reading more of your posts in the future. I hope they mean as much to other people as they have meant to us.