thanks EPH. that is really good advice. I am seeing my lawyer on Monday. i see how the later of the 2 choices is the best course of action. this is why i joined this forum. all of you guys have really helped me out.

as for a voice recorder. is this something that you hook up to your phone? she usually calls me on my cellphone so there isn't another line to hook it to. please let me know because that sounds like a reall great idea.

go to your local Radio Shack tomorrow. they can give you all the electronic low down

get a voice activated recorded. If you can, talk to her on speaker phone. They do make some that you can connect to your cellphone but mine did not. Be pleasant and don't let on to any legal maneuvering you are doing. When she says no to you when you ask to see your daughter, be polite and tell her you will call again later. You can explain your disappointment, but never say anything about telling your lawyer. Your wife will probably talk more freely that way.

And don't tell your WW anything about what you are doing in terms of trying to get your DD back. As you were warned and then found out, your WW will lie - they all do. Your MIL will too as unfortunatley blood is thicker than water. My MIL did not believe me either when I exposed the A to her. Oh, and exWW, her mom, and her brother all lied in their depositions (at the time my exWW had filed for a legal separation).

document everything.

You have a plan....your wife does not. She is running off the high of her affair.

"bat symbol" LOL Eph

You're in good hands, bdhinferno.

Good news. I did some digging and Nevada is a one party state. That means you can record your WW without her knowledge. Only you need to have that knowlege.

Recorders are cheap. You can record the conversations by either putting the recorder up to the receiver of the phone or by using the speaker feature.

Yes, be calm. Don't let her know at all that you're recording. Be reasonable and catch her denying you the right to see your daughter.

It's even better if you catch her showing her wayward, entitled self who yells and screams and calls you names.

Get her to talk about OM.

But mostly get her to talk about how she won't let you see your kids.

You can either get a dedicated recorder or one that hooks up to the phone. I personally would get one that you can carry with you and simply hold up to record when you put WW on speaker on your cell or that you can hold up the receiver on your house phone.

Just have it handy at all times. She calls, you say, "hold on a sec". Pull it out, hit record, and get her talking.

Having her openly deny you the right to see your child is BAD.

thanks

bdh, let us know what's going on. Any developments over the weekend? What's your plan for this week?

I have an appointment with my attorney tomorrow at 2pm. then I will see where it needs to go from there. I am confused at this point. i don't know who is lying and about what. I am getting to see first hand just how screwed up her family is.

but this is day 2 of plan B and i am feeling pretty good. I just need to see what the attorney says so I can start down the road of getting my daughter.

Your lawyer will help you, but an emergency hearing that forces your WW to return DD to the marital home is in order and important. Be ready to show how she's exposing the child to OM and have print outs of this man's web page.

You need to be prepared with care arrangements for DD2 in terms of work.

Go get books on Father's Rights and Custody for Fathers.

They provide good guidance.

just an update. my ww called out of the blue yesterday and let me come and get my kid. my lawyer said that there is nothing we can do at this point because we don't have any evidence. my kid is only 2 1/2 but she is very smart. she doesn't know anyone named tony. she keeps asking for someone named ruben. i don't if it is one of her friends or what. i don't know if i am just paranoid at this point or not. i didn't find any evidence at her apartment. my daughter doesn't know a tony, and she talks non stop about the names that she knows. and my mil is completely psycho. so for now that is all that is going on. not much else to tell right now.

So...

Are you lining up a PI so you can get the evidence you need?



If you don't start doing something now to update the status quo then the courts will think that you are OK with this living arragngement.

If you don't want to become an "every other" weekend dad then you need to start taking action now.

Do yourself a big favor right now. Go to your nearest "back to school sale" and by yourself a notebook.

Start to write notes about what you are doing in it in your handwritting.

Recorded the attempts to contact your DD, you spouses acceptance / refusal / reasons.

The talk with your lawyer about doing something to see your child more often.

When you hired the PI to see what was going on (Hint, Hint).

Your concerns for you childs well being.


Note that computer print outs don't carry as much weight with the courts as Hand written / dated documents.

The time to fight for / protect your child is NOW!

i would love to hire a pi but I don't have the money for one. my parents are already fronting the bill for the lawyer and I have to pay them back. I don't know how else to gather info about what could possibly be going on. the only pi in the area wants $85 an hour with a minimum of 4 hour sessions. $0.75 a mile (he has to come from Reno 60 miles away.) then if he does find a guy he wants $350 dollars for a simple background check. i am stuck and I don't know what to do next.

Here's the thing. If you get your daughter, YOU DON'T HAVE TO GIVE HER BACK!

Keeping her in the marital home is the status quo.

Don't get wrapped up in making this more complicated than it is.

Get your daughter. Don't give her back. File an emergency motion to keep you DD in your home until a pendente lite hearing can be scheduled.

You're seeking a protective order due to abandonment and out of fear that your W will kidnap your daughter again.

$350 to do a simple background check is robbery. Shop around for other PIs. $100 is more appropriate or you can get online services to run them for about $60.

GET YOUR DAUGHTER!

Tell your lawyer you will get your daughter and you want an emergency hearing to keep her in the marital home until a custody arrangement can be established and legal separation can be established.

If she doesn't act on it, then find another lawyer.

Go get a book on Father's Rights. They have lots of legal advice in there on what to do.

Get her on audio denying you the right to see your daughter.

Don't tip off that you have the recorder in any way. Make her lower her guard somehow and get her talking on audio.

You're in a one party state. Take advantage of that!

You can still function and do a lot without a PI.

Also, credit cards can help you fund this stuff if you need to, but I don't think you have to resort to PIs with evidence that's on hand.

things seem to have got back to the way things were with me and the ww. my mil won't talk to me anymore and is acting really strange. there isn't any evidence of om except for what my mil had said before. i always knew that she was a little bit mental, but this takes the cake.

my ww has since talked to me and we have a resonable child support amount hashed out, time set for my child to come over, and are back on calm speeking terms. i still don't know what all went on but the mil has went off the deep end. i really think that she needs help.

so as for now my gut feeling is that there wasn't om. but one can't always be to sure. i am defenetly going to be a lot more cautious and untrusting from now on. and i am continuing on with plan B.

I hope that this is all that happens with this situation. but if anything else happens then I am ready to pounce.

I think there IS an OM, call him Tony, Ruben, whatever.

Your MIL was trying to stand up for your miarriage, and now she is crazy?

my mil is hard to explain. she is one of the strangest people that you will ever meet. she will take something and run with it without knowing the facts. if she really is standing up for my marriage then she wouldn't have flaked out like this. she hasen't confronted her daughter about it at all, and when her daughter confronted her about what we were talking about she denied it and called me a liar. she is not talking to me anymore, and is hiding out from everybody. so what am i supposed to think of her?

Maybe she doesn't want to have a rift between her and her daughter. I think your wife is cheating. But that is just my opinion. Who cares about your MIL? She can be crazy as heck, but the signs of an affair are there.

From DD's talk, I would assume the OM's name is not Tony.

Oh you mean your wife has moved back home w/ your daughter?


Nope. I guess I was wrong.

Your WW is still gone w/ your DD.

And you're still headed for D.

You're OK w/ that?


But, you don't believe there is an OM. Did you give her a Plan B letter?

There can be no Plan B w/o a PBL.

I'm w/ Believer.

All signs point to OM, even if your MIL is certifiable.

Protecting you little on is a big issue here, but one thing that I feel in the posts is a panic, when panic sets in you make huge LB's and harm your chances for recovery, take the advice from everyone about your D. But make sure you do no show malice, or do anything to stir the situation with anger. That is one thing you want to keep out of it...anger will push her further to OM.
JMHO

mc,

thank you for the informative post. I could use more advice like that. I am having a hard time with the LB's in this situation. i have been doing a really good job on the anger thing. better than i ever thought that i could. the panic thing i have kept under control for the most part, but it keeps popping up here and there. i have made lasting changes for the better that i know that she is noticing, but some of it i am having a hard time nailing down. i know that being consistant is the key.

what would be the best way for me to get her to open up and talk about what is going on without being pushy or pushing her away? what ever is going on i want to hear it from her, but i don't know how to get it out of her without the LB's.