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MEDC, I have no interest in having faith in anything that is not FACT. I may as well believe in the tooth fairy if my faith is based on nothing. My "belief" is meaningless if its not true. And I don't know many people who believe in things they don't know are true.
I am a Christian only because I investigated the underlying FACTS and found it be true. The same as I investigated the FACTS and believe the existence of Cuba to be true. The same as I believe in the history of the American Revolution. I have never been there, didn't see it happen, but I have FAITH it exists based on FACTS and EVIDENCE. And it's existence is either TRUE today or it is FALSE today. My faith is NOT based on things UNKNOWN, only on a GOD that is UNSEEN.
See, the key issue for me is not what others believe, but WHAT IS TRUE. That is what matters to me. But just as others have the right to believe their religion is true, I have the same right. Tolerance is needed for opposing views, after all.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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Mel, I see where you are coming from and since my heart is involved in the decision, it is fact to me. BUT, FAITH would not be required if it were all verifiable fact...observation would suffice. I NEVER said your faith was based on NOTHING. I didn't even come close to saying that. Your faith is based on your personal relationship with Jesus Christ.
I think your belief is true...and yes, it would be meaningless if it isn't true. YOU know it to be true because you were called to Christ.
I do not believe in Christ because of facts I investigated....I have faith because He touched my heart.
Last edited by medc; 08/02/08 12:46 PM.
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But just as others have the right to believe their religion is true, I have the same right. Tolerance is needed for opposing views, after all. you've made this point several times now...and I have responded to it previously. I have said NOTHING that infringes on your right to express your faith or beliefs. I think you should continue to express yourself as you see fit. AS IF I had any control over that mouth of yours!!!!!  Have a nice day Mel.
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thanks friend, I understand completely where you are coming from and hear this from many Christians. I am going to guess you are a cradle Christian?
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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never heard that term before Mel. I came to Christ in my mid 30's(at a Harvest Crusade). I was baptized at 35 (I just turned 45).
I was born and raised Catholic and left the Catholic Church in my late 20's (I think you know the reasoning behind that).
I go to a church that is considered by many to be a Bible "thumping" church...but actually find it to be quite tolerant of other beliefs and cultures(doesn't mean we think they are right).
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***************edit**************
Contact mods or Admin with concerns about MB
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So the question becomes, when will all Christian faiths unite once again under the the same altar? When will we be able to put aside our diferences and unite to worship under ONE altar of Christ? The one that was left to us when He accended to heaven?
We have taken His Cross and splinterred it into a thousand pieces.
Any hope for Christians to unite?
Doesn't look good, but I pray.
All Blessings,
Jerry
Last edited by shinethrough; 08/02/08 01:32 PM.
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Mel, I see where you are coming from and since my heart is involved in the decision, it is fact to me. BUT, FAITH would not be required if it were all verifiable fact...observation would suffice. I NEVER said your faith was based on NOTHING. I didn't even come close to saying that. Your faith is based on your personal relationship with Jesus Christ.
I think your belief is true...and yes, it would be meaningless if it isn't true. YOU know it to be true because you were called to Christ.
I do not believe in Christ because of facts I investigated....I have faith because He touched my heart. medc, no response is needed to this post if you don't feel like posting anything, but I had to agree with what you posted here. But this position is different from what you said earlier about "irrefutable proof." That's why Jesus himself said to some people, "even if someone were to rise from the dead, you would not believe." PROOF is independent of "opinion." People can, and do, CHOOSE to reject proven things all the time, and the resurrection of Jesus is no different. God bless.
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**EDIT**
LB, if you have concerns, questions about the moderation of this board, please email the mods instead of posting it here.
Thanks, Revera
Last edited by Revera; 08/02/08 02:45 PM.
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**EDIT**
Last edited by Revera; 08/02/08 02:58 PM. Reason: STOP!
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**EDIT**
Last edited by Revera; 08/02/08 03:09 PM.
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LB, as I said before, if you have complaints about this board, please email the mods.
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**edit**
Last edited by Revera; 08/02/08 03:19 PM. Reason: TOS
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I'm just not getting this, Revera, as evidenced by the first time that I get edited by a Moderator since I registered in 2001 it turns into five edits in a row! Sorry to have been a problem for you. Again, enjoy your Saturday (I'm not going to post any more  ).
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Lovingboundaries, we do appreciate your cooperation.
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I do not believe in Christ because of facts I investigated....I have faith because He touched my heart. That's lovely, medc.
Faith
me: FWW/BS 52 H: FWH/BS 49
DS 30
DD 21
DS 15
OCDS 8
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**EDIT**
Enough! If you want to discuss the editing of your post, email Justuss2@aol.com.
Last edited by Revera; 08/02/08 04:02 PM. Reason: TOS
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FH,
I edited that post. Guess I neglected to check the "edited by" box....
Mods or Admin can be contacted by clicking on their names where they are listed, on the bottom of the forums.
Feel free to contact me at any time.
JustUss
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Quote:***************edit**************
Contact mods or Admin with concerns about MB
Well, I tried to contact the mods or Admin, but the "notify" button, according to the system, has already been used and the system will not let me take my "concerns" to the mods or the Admin.
Curious.
Curiouser still is that the ENTIRE post was edited out of existence, not even edited for whatever part someone thought needed "editing," AND NO notice of it being edited by a Moderator is on the remaining blank post, just the "edited" notice.
Very curious. Just what about this entire post seemed to need removal of the ENTIRE post? Well, I tried to notify the Mods via the "notify" button but on the quoted message, but once again got the "already been notified message," so I cannot add in any message TO the moderators or my email address for a response as has been requested. I would appreciate if no one would use the "notify" button on this post so that I CAN "notify the mods." Thank you.
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MEDC...
I think why your views on this puzzle people (I think I'm right in thinking that it puzzles others -- it does me), is that you are so outspoken on so many things...You typically do not care to offend people at all...Political Correctness has certainly never seemed to be your bag...Until now...About Christianity of all things...Jesus said that his name would offend...Me? I don't care if it does, I will still stand up and proudly proclaim it...There is but one truth, and it doesn't matter if others believe that or not...It is TRUE, and does not depend on their belief to make it so...
I know you said that no religion has been "proven"...I think there are many books you should read if you feel that way about Christianity...A good one is The Case for Christ by Lee Strobel...I have friends that were raised as atheists, and they will tell you that they now believe for one reason and one reason only...Because it is TRUE...
Anyway, not trying to cause a rift, just wanted to let you know my thoughts...
Mrs. W Just wanted to highlight this great post.
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