i need help. my wife left me in april to be with another man, whom she said was her friend for a while (and i think he was just her friend at first) we were fighting a lot and we had just lost our two children to the state and we were not connecting at all. she said that she enjoyed talking to him and that they had good conversations with each other and she eventually left me for him. well a month later (may) she came back to me because she felt that she was doing wrong and that she shouldn't have done what she did, and everything was ok. then she found out that she was pregnant. she believed it was his child and went back to him. a couple of days later he went to jail and she hasn't seen him since. she went and got tested and confirmed she was pregnant, and was talking to me over the phone for a while and decided she wanted to come back to me. i told her that even if the child wasn't mine i would take care of it and her because i loved her and she said ok. i brought her back home and we went to the doctor and they told us that she is 4 months pregnant which means it is my child and not his (unless she's lying to me about when she had sex with him) but its hard for me right now because i am trying really hard to make her happy and she is having really bad withdrawls from him. and to make it worse he will write her from jail and we (myself and her mom, step dad and sister) will not let her have the mail from him. we have told her that its not a good idea to have any contact with this man and she gets upset about it, especially since she is having withdrawls from him. it was getting a lot better until one day her stepdad accidentially brought up one of the letters he sent her and she seen it. i took it and threw it away before she could read it but she got really mad at me and we argued about it. i am trying to meet her needs but i am only thinking of the sexual one because she told me about how often they had sex and all the positions they did and how she would ask him for it (when i have had to practially beg for sex) and i was wondering how i can go about finding out what her needs are if she isn't telling me anything. i can figure out a couple of them, they are family commitment, conversation and physical attractivness (although i am more attractive than the guy she was with) but i can't figure out anymore than that right now. i have been spending almost all my time with her playing games, talking to her as much as she'll let me and figuring out what we are going to do for our child, but she says that maybe it'll be better once the baby is born so maybe family commitment is the top priority for her. i just want our marriage to be better than it ever was before and i want to be able to hold her, hug her and kiss her but right now she doesn't want much of that from me.

please anyone with advice to give me on what i should do how i should go about meeting her emotional needs please help i don't want this to end and i want to be with her for the rest of my life.

i am not trying to make fun of her but she has a learning disability and she has a borderline personality disorder, anxiety and depression already and i was wondering if that would make her withdrawl from this guy longer than it would a woman without those problems? i don't know if she can take her depression medicine because we haven't asked the doctor yet. i was going to at her next appointment.

Welcome, sage. I have a few thoughts for you. First, though, would you mind telling us why the state took your kids? It might have a bearing on what advice we give you. And it's admirable you agreed to take on what you thought was someone else's child, but what will happen when the state finds out you have another child? Is that a risk?

One of the basic tenets here is that, before you start meeting her needs (ENs), you should stop Love Busting her (LBs). That's because if she's getting unhappy about anything you're doing (LBs), it doesn't matter how many ENs you meet, cos she'll still be upset with you. can you ask her about that? There's a great LB questionnaire here you can print out; ask her to fill it out so that you will know what you're doing that she doesn't like. She ought to be glad to do that! Once you know, do your best to stop doing them. You could even ask her to help you realize when you're doing them; that would go a long way for her to feel connected to you.

Withdrawal can take a very long time. People here say it can be six months, easy. So prepare yourself to be patient and understanding. The best medicine is talking. Get in the habit of talking to her about everything.

Also, they urge us here to spend at least 15 hours with our spouse each week, doing fun, bonding stuff. That, too, will go a long way toward making you the man of her dreams.

As for the letters, there's some material here that talks about No Contact that you could print out and give to her to explain why you're doing it. In fact, it urges her to write a No Contact letter to him to give to you to mail, symbolic shutting off of the affair for forever.

You might want to read up on the learning disability, etc., to see if you can find some good advice on how to live with it.

Finally, you might want to repost this over in the Infidelity section (General Questions II) as well. All the people who've been through affairs are over there and can give you great advice.

Welcome to Marriage Builders, Sage...

I'm so sorry for the circumstances which brought you here...and very happy you found this board!

Have you read Dr. Harley's book, "Surviving an Affair"? Helps you understand a lot more, including Withdrawal (Affairs are like drugs and you were asking about the withdrawal period...and yeah, withdrawal starts over anytime there is contact...whether it's news of OM, seeing the letter...just restarts the clock...and you guys need to let the prison know to take you off the list of who he's allowed to write, 'k?).

How long was the affair?

Another good book which could help you understand better boundaries is "Not Just Friends" by Shirley Glass...because part of your responsibility in a marriage is to protect marital boundaries...so you help cultivate friends of your marriage...and work on being friends to others' marriages, not have friendships with members of the opposite sex.

While she's in Withdrawal, you stay aware and keep checking for any contact between them, 'k? Not to fight about...just so you know the truth and know you can get the truth without going through her for now.

Focus on doing what's necessary to get your kids back from the State...Alanon is a great resource for helping you through crisis times, and non-crisis times. Are you having to do anger management therapy? Do you have a caseworker you report to?

Read all the articles here on this website to help you--you're not alone...infidelity tears apart marriages...and the Harleys help you recover them, rebuild and have much healthier, happier ones.

Read up on Love Busters first...even before identifying her ENs and yours...Each LB you do wipes out 20 acts to meet ENs...so they're really important to identify and eliminate in yourself, 'k?

Also may help you get your kids back.

You are in control right now of fighting to save your marriage. If your WW is giving you too much information (more than you ask for) you can tell her to answer your questions simply...share that the details are devastating right now and you know it's going to take at least two full years to recover and heal from her choice to have an A...that you're willing and want this marriage.

Please don't buy into "better maybe once the baby is born"...you're proactive right now...stay that way. Read and share about how to affair-proof the marriage, require transparency from her...and follow the rules of marriage...get in the 20 hours of Undivided Attention (UA) each week as your top priority. I suggest Recreational Companionship (RC) for most of these hours, along with doing communication exercises for an hour each week within that time.

I believe length of Withdrawal is based on the length of the affair, and her wayward mindset (WW = Wayward Wife). Fill in your details for us--how long together, how long married, ages, number and ages of children, etc.

You can put this info in your signature line (in your preferences) so anyone wanting to post to you can see it easily...

You're not alone. We're here for you, 'k? We've been where you are right now.

LA

lets see... we have been married a year and a half. we have been together for seven years. i was a bad husband and boyfriend. i wouldn't spend any time with her, i wouldn't spend time with the kids and i wouldn't do anything that made her happy. it was all me me me. it wasn't until she left that i realized (what a dummy huh?) that i was the problem. she always loved me. she would always call me when i was at a friends house. she always took the initive to make me happy and i couldn't return the favor because i was too soaked up in myself, and drugs ( i used to smoke pot, but i have been clean since febuary) i didn't even notice the guy that i was until i cleaned up, but by then it was too late.

our kids are now technically wards of the state and the foster parents that have them are in the process of adoption. they terminated our rights in april and we haven't heard much since then about them. they are 3 1/2 years old and 1 1/2 years old. they are beautiful and they both loved me and my wife. they took them away because at the time we were only living on my wifes ssi payment (because i was a deadbeat) and they took that away from her because we got married (because i don't get it) and the landlord at our apartment decided to kick us out because we couldn't pay rent, and we had these people that would come over because my wife was in the system when she was a child that was supposed to help us keep the welfare system out of our lives but she seen a couple of bruises on our youngest daughter so she called the welfare about it. we explained that we had both seen our oldest daughter hitting our youngest (from what i believe was jealousy) and that caused the bruises. neither my wife or i ever hit our children, as far as i know.

anyways they took the kids and let my mom have them for a little while but after a couple of months they took them from my mom too (as a mutual decision because she worked midnights and could not give them the attention they needed) so they were put into foster homes. instead of trying to give us a chance they were doing nothing but making my wife go through psychological test after psychological test, goto therapy and other things that had nothing to do with the children. they said that since she was in the system and she was abused as a child that she would do the same to our kids, but i never seen it. we went to visits, all court dates (except the last two but that was my fault) and every time they told us we weren't going to get the kids back. even my lawyer told me that if i would have left my wife they would have given them back to me which isn't right because it was as much my fault as hers. i told them no way and i stuck by my wife the whole time, i defended her to everyone and i wouldn't let her feel like a failure, even though at the same time i was still mistreating her at home.

we ended up moving to kentucky because the police came to my house one day looking for me and at the time i still was smoking pot and i got paranoid as heck and left. after i left my neighbors family started stalking me and i figured out that they were the ones that called the police on me, so i got scared and we moved to kentucky. when we got there she got a job and then i did too and she met the guy she left me for.

she started out just by talking to him, she said that they had good conversation together and at the time we were arguing all the time and never really talked about anything. she told him about our relationship and how i didn't goto court for our kids because i was scared to goto jail and he told her the old line "ohh i'll never do that to you" and "i would have never let that happen to you" and she fell in his arms. they were only together for about a month. i think that is why she said that the sex was so much better because i have been reading the pages on this site and it says that if she was emotionally "in love" then the sex is going to be great no matter what.

i have it kinda figured out about her i think that if i had to guess that her biggest emotional need is family commitment followed by conversation and affection. so now that we are back together i have made it a point to goto every doctors appointment (which i never did before) read up on pregnancy so i know what to expect, i was going to goto parenting class and lamaz class with her and be there for her at every oppurtunity. i am looking for a job right now but we definitally spend more than 20 hours a week together (unfortunatly its also with her mom, sister and stepfather) but we play games she likes together and we talk a little and i read to the baby and stuff so i know i'm doing that.

i feel like her slave sometimes because i do everything she asks of me (mostly because i always used to tell her no, not right now, later or i can't afford it) but i don't want that to become a habit, and i know she's pregnant so i am a little more leniant but i don't know how i tell her to stop after the baby's born without hurting her feelings.

our case worker told us that if we had more children that it would be ok unless someone calls the welfare on us and the welfare finds out that its a legitimate reason. other than that they can't just come in and take our baby when its born.

i have asked her if she would goto marriage counseling with me and at first she was like "no" but now it's more like "i don't know" and sometimes she thinks about it but doesn't answer me. i told her about this website and she just said "thats nice" and walked out of the room.

i am going to be patient and i want her to see how i have changed because i have found god and everyone else i know (including her parents who used to hate me) say that i have changed and like me now. i want our marriage to work because i love her like i have never loved anyone else in my life (and even when i thought of myself all the time i still loved her then but i was too "macho" or selfish to take the time to show it to her) and i just want to spend the rest of my life with her. there was a time that was all she wanted too and i hope that it will become like that again.

wow. you've been thru an awful lot.

I'm impressed that you have stuck by your wife through all this, and it gives me hope for you two.

I can tell you from first hand experience, that if you are being extra nice to your wife because she it pregnant, that is WONDERFUL and will make her feel very special and loved.

BUT, if you are already planning on 'going back' to not treating her as well after she has the baby, she will be hurt, angry and resentful. It's better to be honest with her now and tell her how you intend to treat her after she has the baby. But do it in a nice loving way.

For example:

Honey, I love taking care of you now. It makes me feel like a very good father and husband. But there are some things I would like to change a little bit, would it be ok to talk about it?

And then explain to her what you think you might be doing that is "too much" or feeling like a slave and work out something you can keep doing and be happy about it once she has the baby.

There is nothing more depressing than to be treated like you are special and precious to your husband while you are pregnant with promises that they will treat you the same way when you have the baby, then to be discarded and ignored once the baby comes.

well i'm not 'planning on it' so to speak. i just know that i will be working to support the family and when i get home from work i am going to try to spend time with the baby as much as i can and i just dont want to come home to my wife saying 'oh i need you to do dishes and make dinner and take out the trash and sweep the floor and mop it and vaccuum and pick up these clothes and give me my dinner and give the baby a bath and put her to bed so you can finish cleaning while i sit her and do nothing'

i know that sounds like i'm complaining and i know i will have to do some of that but right now its like i do all of that. i cook, clean and take care of her which i don't mind doing all of that but after the babys born i hope it will change a little.

Pursue the counseling. You both need it.

And, unless she has a medical condition, you are doing her no favors by babying her while she's pregnant. She needs to be up and active for the baby's health. I went into labor during an aerobics class.

So sit down and go over the workload and work up an agreement on which each of you should be doing. And stick to it.

oh she does things. she just got done cleaning our room. but the reason i am doing so much is because during her first two pregnancies she did EVERYTHING and i did nothing. nothing at all. i would goto work, come home goto my habit (the pot) and sit there playing videogames all night not talking to her not spending time with her not doing anything to be a part of the pregnancy. she did not like that and i knew it then but i was so stuck on myself that i didnt think about her feelings. it was wrong and i am completely sorry for it and i have told her that a lot. but now i am completely involved in her pregnancy and i goto every doctors appointment, i read to the baby (even though the baby can't hear me yet) i read books on what i can do to help her through this (because this is the worst pregnancy she's had, she's sick almost everyday) so i take extra care of her. i just hope it's starting to make a difference. i think it is but i'm not totally sure yet. i guess we will wait and see.

Has your WW gone no contact (NC) with OM?

I'm sorry I stopped replying. I felt incapable after reading your second post. I'm so sorry you have lost your children. I can't imagine...conceive of that in my experience.

You sound like you truly are changing your life, patterns and habits...I believe you've changed your beliefs and permissions, too, inside.

I think you're loving yourself better so you are now loving better.

In my prayers,

LA

yes she has but not by her choice. he is in jail (in florida) and he doesn't goto court till october 2nd. she doesn't have any way to contact him right now because i threw away everything that had anything to do with that guy. all his letters to her, pictures of him, cards, everything. she got pretty upset about it too. but she has gotten over it since then.

the only reason i would let her even talk to that guy is if the baby was his but its not. ultrasound has recently shown that the baby is mine (due to the date of conception) so there is no reason for her to talk to him. we are no where near florida and i have moved her away from kentucky and back near her family so there should be no contact, but i don't know for sure. i know the letters have stopped coming from him for now. i have told her that when we get a phone line that we are not having long distance on it, she asked why and i told her we didn't need it. she was like 'well how are you going to call your mom?' and i said that is what my cell phone was for. to make sure i can get ahold of her if she needs me and to make sure i can call my family. i dont think she likes that too much either but if she wants to call long distance she can use my cell phone, while i'm home. i dont want to sound controlling and i am not trying to be that way but i am not ready to trust her completely yet, nor do i think i should have too.

see she came back to me about a month after she left, saying that God wouldn't like her committing adultery and she had noticed how i had changed. we were together for ten days and they were ok, but after she missed her period she knew she was pregnant, which i had already known, and she figured it was his. i told her that even if it was i would take care of it and that i loved her and it was ok, but she told me that she wanted to tell him herself, so we went over there. well she stayed over there because she told me that she didnt want the baby to be without it's father. she stayed with him and that was it, untill two or three days later she called me (after i had left the state) and told me he was in jail for grand theft auto. he was already on probation in kentucky for recieving stolen property and is a crack addict. why she wanted to stay with him when she knew all of this i don't know but she did. needless to say we talked on the phone for the entire month of june and she decided to come home to me. so i went and got her and we have been together ever since.

i am trying my hardest to make this work and i hope it does i just don't know what else to do to take her mind off of him. i know she still thinks about him.

i have a question i don't know if anyone can answer for me... withdrawl from the affair... is it like withdrawl from drugs or tobacco? can there be any physical effects? because i noticed every night when my wife goes to sleep for about 20 minutes or so before she actually is sleeping she shakes, not badly but she'll shake. i was just wondering if that is a sign of withdrawl or if its something else?

Still here? I've been on vacation. Don't know if you still have the issue, but I'd guess the shaking was her crying, or maybe trying NOT to cry. I know, cos I've done the same many times, trying not to let my H I was crying. Some people shake when they do.

Anyway, what is your status?

I don't know. She doesn't cry or look like she's even feeling like crying. It's only at night when she first lays down to goto sleep, and it's not every night. And lately it has been less than before. I was only asking because I was worried because the guy she was with is a crack addict and I was worried that she may have done it. She told me she never did but you never know with situations like this and I was worried that she may be having withdrawls or something.

We have been ok. The other night she wanted me to log off of the computer and come to bed with her so she could lay by me before I had to goto work, which was cool because this was the first time she has said anything like that to me, but on the other hand she barely wants to have sex with me, barely kisses or hugs me but when we are in bed together she always puts her arm around me or I her, and the other day was the first time she actually curled up next to me and wanted me to hold her while we slept, maybe because of a bad dream or ?

We have talked alot about this whole situation. We went to the doctor when she first came back and the blood test she took told her that she was almost 12 weeks pregnant, which meant that the baby was mine (unless she did something before she left me with this guy which she denies) and she is now 18 weeks pregnant, which is what the ultrasound said. But her doctor keeps pushing the due date back to Febuary 3rd which would make the baby his and not mine. She has been worried about that and has expressed her concern to me about it, and she even asked me last night if I would still love the baby if it wasn't mine and I told her that not only would I still love the baby, but I love the baby right now. I read to the baby every night, I make sure she eats enough everyday, I goto every doctors appointment and ultrasound that is scheduled. I know the baby can't hear me read to him/her yet but I do it because I want to make it a habit to read to the baby everynight of the week. Even when we argue or she doesn't want to have sex with me I still read to the baby and I still make sure she has everything she needs to be comfortable and that the baby is healthy.

I think that it is starting to work because I have noticed that she will hold my hand (like when we go for walks) and stuff like that and she plays around with me and like today she came over and put my arm around her so I could feel her stomach, but she still doesn't want to goto marriage counseling, so I have been reading this site as much as I can to try and figure out things I can do to make her happy and start depositing in her love bank again.

What other advice can I have to make it where she knows that I care about her and the baby's well being but at the same time tell her that I have needs as well (and right now the most important one is, as weird as it sounds coming from a guy, is affection.) I want to make love to her and I would enjoy doing it more but I need affection. I need to feel loved. The way she left me made me feel like she never loved me, but after the way I treated her I know she did but she just couldn't take it anymore.