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I've always worked under the assumption that a marriage ends when the divorce is final.

No dating until then, no starting relationships until the divorce is FINAL.

And I've always had the belief that this is when the marriage is OVER. And its the point where the two former spouses are exactly that...EX-whatevers...with no allegiance or committments or responsibilities to each other beyond whatever legally is determined by the courts.

Once the divorce is final, neither 'owe' each other anything further...emotionally, physically, whatever. Financially perhaps, determined by the courts. But relationship-wise...nothing.

That's my take...but I've seen other posters that appear to believe differently, so I'm curious...

...At what point DO they become "ex's" in every sense of the word?

Last edited by Owl; 08/15/08 10:44 AM.
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I agree with you. Until the divorce is final, you are still husband and wife whether separated or in the process of getting divorced. If spouses are dating or sleeping with other people during the course of the divorce, they are committing adultery. Period.


BW - me
exWH - serial cheater
2 awesome kids
Divorced 12/2011




Many a good man has failed because he had a wishbone where his backbone should have been.

We gain strength, and courage, and confidence by each experience in which we really stop to look fear in the face... we must do that which we think we cannot.
--------Eleanor Roosevelt
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Is it adultery if they're in a relationship with someone after they're divorced? If they start a relationship with someone that they didn't know in any fashion when they were married?

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It depends on who's definition.

According to the christian definition, an affair-marriage is adultery, but you are pre-forgiven so it isn't.


I watch, and am as a sparrow alone upon the house top.
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On this board, which is probably a reflection of legalities in most of the US states, you are an EX upon divorce. In Canada, the division of property, wealth, child custody and visitation etc., is done in the separation agreement, which can take place before, during or after the divorce. The divorce is merely a certificate that says you can get remarried. So here, most people consider legally separated the same as people on this BB consider divorced. In fact, many people never divorce and live for decades legally separated. In this regard, my former spouse is an EX.

For the purposes of not getting everybody's knickers in a twist on this BB I refer to him as Wstbx, even though how soon he actually files for divorce is a crap shoot (I don't need a D as I'm not getting married any time soon).

As for your second question, if you are divorced, you can't be committing adultery since you have no spouse. Unless whoever you are having a relationship with is married, then it's adultery.

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I can also add that WstbxH and OW are legally recognized as commonlaw spouses, though neither are divorces from their "stbx's". They filed their taxes this way, they claim each other's benefits this way, they apply for loans this way, they are on each other's life insurance this way and they are legally considered each other's next of kin. So if I'm not an ex, then what am I?

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Originally Posted by Tabby1
So if I'm not an ex, then what am I?

An inconvenience?


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Owl, I generally agree with you. I will only date women who are divorced, widowed or never married. I don't want to wander into the grey area of "going through divorce and my marriage is dead". Maybe it is dead or on life support, but I don't want to be the guy who helps push it into the grave.

However, I can see one exception to this rule. This is what happened to an acquaintance of mine, and I know it has also happened to other people on MB. His wife left him for another man. The OM had a lot of money and was able to finance a brutal legal fight against the betrayed husband. The goal was to get as much as possible and show him NO MERCY WHATSOVEVER! The WW was living with her wealthy OM and having a great time. Her lawyer was using every trick in the book to ruin the betrayed husband. False accusations of spousal abuse, false accusations of child abuse, witch hunts for 'hidden' assets, unnecessary disruptions at his workplace, etc.

He was in court three times to prove that he did not molest his kids and he should be allowed to see them unsupervised. That alone took over six months. My point is that his divorce went on for almost three years. During that time WW was with her wealthy OM, living well, traveling, etc. In that case I can cut the poor betrayed husband some slack and allow him to see other women. (What woman would want to be involved in that mess is another story. Either a fool or a saint.) The entire goal of WW was to stretch the divorce out as long as possible, get as much as she could, and make him suffer, suffer, suffer.

And please don't tell me that this will catch up with her. It has been over four years. She and the OM are still living together, still having a great time, and still firing the occasional legal potshot at the ex husband.

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It's not even that simple here in the States, Tabby. It really depends on the state (if we're talking about legality). Here in Texas, there is no such thing as a legal separation. Once a spouse files for D and the other spouse is served, both people fall under the jurisdiction of the court and temporary orders are put into place, but these orders are not an LSA. They merely outline and address what both parties can and cannot do w/re to the children and assets. The D can take months or even years to occur depending on the docket.

My attorney informed me (I did not ask) that I wanted to, I could pursue another relationship without legal jeopardy. However, he did advise against it on a personal level.

Anyway, I started referring to the ex as "the ex" as soon as she moved out in July of 07. I determined at that point that there would be no reconciliation and that the M was nothing but a legal technicality. I look back now and regard the M as over in April of 07 since that's when she took off her ring and moved out of the bedroom.

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Legally, in Louisiana and probably everywhere else, once the divorce is petitioned and the other party is served you are free to do whatever you want and it's not considered adultry. (My female attorney told me this)(not in those words)

Spiritually is a whole other story that could be debated till the EX's come home. I know in the Catholic Church any SF short of getting the marriage anulled and remarrying in the church is considered adultry. Basically any SF outside of church marriage is adultry. Technically, according to the church, I am still married so I can have all the SF I want with EXWW and I'm covered.

Do I believe this

He11 no! and I'm a church going Catholic

It costs money that I don't have to get my marriage anulled. So I'm stuck religiously. I disagree whole heartedly with the church on this.

I think most people have the same basic defenition of what is adultry, but if you got down to technicalities I think you'd be suprised at the difference in peoples beliefs

I've been split for a few years and divorced since May, I'm not currently dating, but am starting to put it out there, so this is actually in play for me right now.

It sucks, it really sucks. So I find myself playing golf more than looking for dates.





BS 33 EXWW 35 DS 5
OM1 9/06 - 03/07
OM2 04/07 - present
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Originally Posted by auto009988
I will only date women who are divorced, widowed or never married.

same here

If I met a woman tha was seperated I would probably just tell her to call me when the divorce was final and not a day before, which I'm sure would be the end of that.


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OM2 04/07 - present
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Between legalities and religious differences, it's no wonder there's so much confusion. Personally, I think you know in your heart based on your own upbringing and beliefs and that's going to be different for everyone. One thing I have trouble understanding is the religious viewpoint that you are married by the church, yet you are not divorced until the state says you are, even if that takes years. I agree with Seabird - looking back I became an EX the day he asked for the divorce.

As far as being legally free to do whatever you want, marital status has nothing to do with that anyway. XH/wstbxH was legally free to have his A at any time, any place, in any capacity and it wouldn't have made a bit of difference. It's not against the law to commit adultery here.

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Originally Posted by Pariah
Originally Posted by Tabby1
So if I'm not an ex, then what am I?

An inconvenience?

rotflmao rotflmao rotflmao

Oh, that's a GOOD one!!!!!!

Charlotte

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Originally Posted by Tabby1
It's not against the law to commit adultery here.

It's not against the law here either, no matter how arcane Texas family law is (from a father's rights perspective anyway). However, it can affect the outcome of a custody battle. I have a friend whose XW left him for an OM just after she had their first and only child. My friend had to spend some money, but he won primary conservator status largely based on her adulterous actions.

I think most courts recognize that WSs probably aren't going to be candidates for Parent of the Year.

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Unfortunately, that's not the case here. Here they still strongly favour the woman regardless of whether she's an adulteress or not. In fact, you are not permitted to mention adultery in court when deciding custody. Not only that, they don't factor in the OM's income when determining CS. So for the example described above of the WW who moved in with a wealthy OM who financed an expensive and painful legal battle against the BH, the BH is STILL legally obliged to pay CS - even after the D and WW and OM get married.

(if you haven't noticed, I'm bitter about this)

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OK, lets look at this from an infidelity perspective.

If a M has an affair. Ends the affair. Divorces his wife (or is divorced, either way) and moves on. Then begins dating someone else...is that person an OW?

And...where do the feelings of the BW come into that? Is it a new affair if the BW had no interest in rebuilding the marriage? Or would it be a second affair only if she still wanted to reconcile, regardless of the divorce?

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Originally Posted by Owl
If a M has an affair. Ends the affair. Divorces his wife (or is divorced, either way) and moves on. Then begins dating someone else...is that person an OW?

To me, an affair involves betrayal of the vows of exclusivity. Once a marriage is dissolved, so are those vows. I don't see how it's "cheating" when you start a new relationship after divorce. Gawd, if it were, we are all cheaters on this board...

AGG

Last edited by AGoodGuy; 08/15/08 01:21 PM.

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Originally Posted by Owl
If a M has an affair. Ends the affair. Divorces his wife (or is divorced, either way) and moves on. Then begins dating someone else...is that person an OW?

No. The relationship is post-D and didn't begin until after the D was final if I understand the scenario right.

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And...where do the feelings of the BW come into that? Is it a new affair if the BW had no interest in rebuilding the marriage? Or would it be a second affair only if she still wanted to reconcile, regardless of the divorce?

Is this all hypothetical Owl? These scenarios are sounding awfully complex and intricate. Like, "If the moon is in it's 3rd phase, and it's an odd numbered year, and the D occurred on an even numbered day...".

LOL! Sorry, I'm not trying to make fun of you... Just trying to illustrate my point with a little tongue in cheek humor. wink

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Originally Posted by Owl
OK, lets look at this from an infidelity perspective.

If a M has an affair. Ends the affair. Divorces his wife (or is divorced, either way) and moves on. Then begins dating someone else...is that person an OW?

No. Other than the fact that she's just an"other woman" that he's dating. She's not an affair partner.

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And...where do the feelings of the BW come into that? Is it a new affair if the BW had no interest in rebuilding the marriage? Or would it be a second affair only if she still wanted to reconcile, regardless of the divorce?

Once divorced, the BW's feelings have nothing to do with whether the above scenario is defined as an affair because she is no longer a BW, but an XW.


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Thanks for the replies.

I asked the question based on my previous experience on this board.

An old poster (who was here as an FWW at the time) returned to this forum recently asking questions about issues she was having dating a man she'd met after the divorce was final with her FBH.

She was accused of being in a new affair, and told to go back to her divorced husband. No mention had been made by her at any point as to whether or not her FBH had any desire to reconcile with her or not in her posts.

I'm trying to understand the mindset behind that advice. I've always been of the same opinion as others on this thread have provided...once the d is final...that's the end of the marriage.

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