Thank you - NO RELATIONSHIP TALK. It's so frustrating to do Plan A where he won't tell me what his ENs are. And I can't keep asking him. I want to change and I have been trying to include him on the kids' activities - he refused - said "I have to work". I have tried to ask him for his input - said do whatever you want - I don't care.

I am fine with how things are - how our marriage is right now - I don't want to change it at all - heck if things were fine he wouldn't be off having an A.

When he said "he'll be out of the way by the end of this week". He meant that he is going to move out by this Friday. He said he found an apartment and it costs $1000. He said I've tried to make this M work but it doesn't seem good enough. Said he didn't want to pay for it but I have a feeling that he went to see the OW today and went apartment hunting together probably letting her think that he's living some where else beside home with his wife. BUt what I don't understand is he still have her garage opener - why didn't he give it back? - Did he really found an apartment?

I just don't understand - that's the part where I'm really going crazy. I don't know how to meet his ENs when I don't know what they are.

What if I keep trying to be happy, include him and do all these stuffs when he won't participate or let me?

Look at the EN's article and try to meet the top 5. (If you really don't know what WHs are, but if you think about, you'll realize you probably do know what they are). Think about it, OW never had him fill out paperwork, she still managed to pull it off. You know him a heck of a lot better than she does.

So you will keep bouncing around being happy and smelling sweet and he will keep being grumpy on the couch. If that lasts for a while, he may look at himself and think maybe he IS the problem.

Have you tried filling out the ENQ for him, the way you think he would? It won't be entirely accurate but it's a start, better than nothing.

Can you negotiate to get him to wait another week?

If not, then you only have until Friday, to do an awesome Plan A. Do it. You can do this. You can do anything for one week.

I have bought him the book "His Need, Her Needs" for his birthday two weeks ago and he didn't even open his present. He told me he didn't want it without even looking at it.

I can tried to ask him but then wouldn't that be a "Relationship" thing? It may not be even accurate since he probably just wanted to get it out of the way. Yeah it probably better than nothing.

I have tried to negotiate with him about not leaving at all until we can get help with our M because we haven't really tried since he moved back. And we can't not afford to put our daughters through that same trauma and he agreed with me on that part. He said he has signed the lease already. That's why he didn't unpack any of the things he took back from her house. That's why I don't know if he's bluffing and get me to come to an agreement on his term - I don't know????

Plan A is about me changing and meeting his ENs and being positive and happy - I need to do my best but he just moping and dragging his feet - it's soooo depressing and I can't get myself motivated by looking at his behavior.

What do I do when I tried to include him with the kids when he doesn't want to be involve - do I just go ahead and do them anyway - Today is Saturday - I asked him if he wanted to go out - said "No" - you can go by yourself. Any suggestions as to what I can do this Awesome Plan A - that leaves me Sunday tomorrow until Friday. Weekdays are so hard since our daughters are in school and he has work an all.

Any suggestions????? I really need some inputs.

I feel so bad for your story. It is hard to meet whs ENS when they act so distant thinking of the OW.

The advice I have is to unpack his stuff from the car and move him back into the house totally. Then if he wants to leave he has to pack again which is emotionally hard. It is easy to get in the car and drive away if you have a clean set of clothes and no worries. If he gets mad tell him how happy you are to have him home and you wanted to help him be as comfortable as possible. So much eaiser to find your stuff when it is put away!! Of course you may ant to verify with Steve first but this sounds like a good plan A and keeping him in the marital bed.

He doesn't seem to want to be involved right now in the kids. Keep the kids occupied and call on every friend you have to help you run them to activies. I did this, lucky we were in school at the time but our dd spent alot of time with others the first month while I just devoted myself to my dh. That is what I think really worked for us. He remembered who WE were. Now he is with out dd just like before but for awhile there I made our home like the OW, no probs, no kid, no chores, and fun fun fun things even though it cost a ton!!

Good luck in plan A for this week!!

Yes, that is relationship talk. Stop it, buy him a movie or CD, preferably something that will trigger a pleasant marriage memory for him.


What are these terms you speak off. Don't discuss divorce, just smile and say you only do marriage, then ask if he wants a sandwich.

Do something fun on Sunday. Anything that the family used to enjoy?? Zoo, movies, rent a DVD and have popcorn in the family room. Create Norman Rockwell in your home. (Expect him to sit like a big Grinch)

For the week, cook his favorites, unpack the car and lovingly do his laundry, look good, arts and crafts at the table with the kids.

Oh, and while he's at work, make copies of pertinent papers you may need, bank statements, acct info, tax returns. Assume he is moving at the end of the week and get ready.

Disclaimer: I flunked Plan A so you may want to get advice from someone else. Don't do what I did. When my WH sat like a lump, I stormed out saying "Fine, I'll go hang out with people who LIKE me" (That's NOT plan A, don't do that!!)

Yes, what jean and SW say are great ideas.

When I said to fill out the ENQ for him, the way you think he would, I meant... do it for your own information, do it without talking to him about it; take the ENQ and pretend to be him, as honestly as you can, and try to figure out how he would answer the questions. Do that so that you can have as good an idea as possible as to how to meet his needs. Do the same for the LBQ.

You don't have to do that, it's just an idea, to help you figure out what LBs you do that bother him, and what ENs you need to work on.

Do NOT talk to him about it. NO RELATIONSHIP TALK.

You don't have much time. You need to do this, and do it as good as possible, as soon as possible.

I went over the ENs Questions - I do have an idea what his top 5 needs are but one of the 5 (Recreational Companion) is most definitely very challenging - he will not let me meet that right now - Because that's where the OW was able to do with him in this triathlon training. But I guessed I will work with what I have.

I woke up this morning and he was still grumpy - really a grumpy old man

I showered - got the girls ready - let him have some alone time for himself. I suggested that we all go out to eat breakfast as a family. He said "I'm not hungry" Well I replied you got to eat somehow. Let's take the girls out and enjoy our time together I said. Then he came around said sure let me shower then we go.

During the our time together at the restaurant - wouldn't talk to me at all - like I'm invisible. He spoke to our girls. Asked them questions - I answered for them when they weren't sure of the answer. It was hard - I want to smack him in the head and say "Hello I'm sitting right across from you - please acknowledge me but nope. Tried to carry on a conversation but only replied a few word."

After that we went swimming in our pool - had a great time splashing water around. Then he left said he had to stop by for work which I knew he didn't - he went to see the OW - because I snooped again and saw a couple of things he had purchased in his car near where she lived after he got home.

Made a really nice dinner but he didn't eat with us. So an hour later he went to the kitchen and helped himself wit dinner. I asked him if he wanted to see the Olympic closing ceremony - of course replied "No that's OK" and went to the family room and watched his boxing show. OMG it's soooo hard with PLan A.

So with that said - the end of the day - I said "Good night to him". Tomorrow will be another day - I have to start thinking what I'm going to do when he gets home from work since there's not much time and he usually doesn't get home until close to 7:30 pm and I have to get ready to put the girls to bed.

Well I'm still thinking and it's been sooooo long and I'm running out of idea - and sometime I asked myself - what happened to me? Am I sooo boring nowaday. I took care of our daughters for 8 yrs and I'm running low here.

Sounds like you did well! And Kudos for not knocking him upside the head!

Maybe when he comes home Monday, you can show him what the kids did in school, have a nice dinner, look fresh and smiley.

Just do it for one day at a time.

Do you have the chance to do coffee and breakfast in the morning?

I thought about breakfast but he normally skipped it. I thought about just waking up and making something for him even if he doesn't eat - We both don't drink coffee - So I can't really give him something on the go! So what do you think?

He always wake up - shower - and head of to work - I have asked many time before if he wanted something to eat but replied "I don't have time - I have to head off to work"

I normally make lunch for him to take to work but since he's been home - I have asked many time and he would tell me - "No I don't need lunch - I will grab something at work".

Oh, yes, coffee and breakfast is a great idea! Someone - either Pep or schoolbus I think - says that men are more likely to feel bonded toward the first person they talk to in the morning. And that men tend to not talk about a given subject with a lot of different people, so if you're there and you talk to him about something first - even something minor, like the weather, or sports - he's less likely to talk to someone else about that same thing.

And yes, kudos for not bopping him upside the head!

Hang in there, you can do this, it isn't gonna last forever...

You could start planning your last evening together. Do you know when he plans to move out yet? (DON'T ASK HIM! Just, if you happen to know, if he's mentioned a day, tell us. But DON'T ASK HIM! In fact, it would be good if it just kinda slips his mind...) Can you get a babysitter for the night before? Or arrange for the kids to visit grandparents?

Can you get a babysitter for any other evening this week?

If RC is big for him and he won't let you meet that, then a good long-range plan is for you to develop activities and interests of your own, related or not to his interests... and let him know that you are developing into this interesting, attractive person. Time enough for that later, but if there's something this week that would make you seem like an attractive RC partner, take advantage of it. Even if you don't actually do the thing together, just to show that you have interests and are fun to be with... you'll have to come up with the specifics, depending on what you have going on. But even if it's just mentioning some event, or hobby, or something.

Just throwing some ideas out there. If they don't fit, don't worry.

Oh I just read your reply, that he doesn't drink coffee or eat breakie much...

Men usually *love* cinnamon. It's erotic, it has something to do with blood flowing to their nether regions or something, I dunno

... so, what if you had a nice warm batch of cinnamon buns coming out of the oven just as he was coming out of the shower???

Ever since he started the triathlon training he's been very picky and he's trying to lose weight. I made yogurt parfait before for him so I can tried making that - if he eats it then it will be great - if not at least I hope he takes notice in it.

Supposedly he said he's moving out this Friday - So I'm assuming that he will leave in the morning - Thursday is hard to find a babysitter - Since the girls have school and my babysitter only do weekend. I am hoping he leave Friday night so that I can plan a nice dinner just the two of us and give him the PBL.

So far he hasn't mentioned anything today so I will leave it alone and won't bring it up.

I am little confused reading up on Plan A - Am I suppose to do things for myself even though he may not be interested in it?????

The doing things for yourself, is mainly to take care of yourself, to maintain your sanity, and to not be a doormat. I think. Especially when you only have a week, I think the emphasis would be on being pleasant to him - but not subservient, not a doormat, and not dishonestly so. Maintain your integrity and self-respect. You deserve respect. You don't get it by demanding it, but you might get it by treating him with respect and treating yourself with respect.

Yogurt parfait is good, if he's health-conscious... how come healthy food never has the rich aromas though??? Can you think of anything he'd like, that would have the big good smells like cinnamon buns?

Maybe some green tea or herbal tea? Or even a scented candle?

Heck, you could make the cinnamon buns for yourself, and for the smell... and have the yogurt parfait for him. Nothing says you can't be a seductive temptress with your own H! Maybe he'll give in and have a bun... unless you think that would be an LB.

One thing I used to do when I dated a runner, was I'd mix up yogurt for him that was half the good stuff in the little tiny cups, and half the ultra-plain yogurt, zero fat and zero sugar; add a little granola maybe, for crunch. So you get the taste of the high-calorie yogurt but with fewer calories. Blueberries on top are great.

Would a love note in his brief case be a good idea in your case?

Ok today I didn't get a chance to make breakfast or anything - I woke up early asked him - said "No". So I maybe take up on that advice about cinnamon rolls - I went to the grocery today - spent a little more than usual because I am going out of my way this whole week.

I bought some fresh fruit for him just in case he passed up the cinnamon rolls. Bought Yogurt with granola. I'm going to wake up early and crank up the oven so the house will smell like cinnamon rolls. I will make fresh fruit for him - He might just say "NO" to me again. Oh well if he won't eat - the more the merrier for me I guessed!

I got dressed up really nice - clean the house and all. He came home about 7:30 pm today and I said "Hi" but he didn't even look at me at all and no hello kiss neither. He didn't want dinner but he grabbed some cheese and munch on that.

Gave him some space - the girls kissed him "Good Night" - I put them to bed. Then asked him how was his day - he said "OK". I told him about our days and our daughter's school but really little response or feedback from him - So I just said "Good Night to him" since he seem to be occupy with the computer.

It's driving me crazy - This PlanA isn't easy - It's like a roller coaster. Moment were I'm trying to be happy and smile and pretend nothing is bugging me but at times I just want to scream at him..

Let see how it goes tomorrow and keep y'all an update. One day at a time.

Alright today was not my day to pretend to be happy and smiley to my H - I tried so hard but I couldn't - I did wake up early to bake cinnamon rolls - he didn't want it but did take the fresh fruit though. So at least that's a start!

Later this afternoon - I browse through the Triathlon website that he belongs to and guessed what I found. Their pictures together my H holding her very close just like the way he used to hold me before. I broke down and cried - He lied to me about the trip he took - He told me that he didn't love her - He told me he didn't live with her and she meant nothing - but pictures are worth a thousand words.

I couldn't keep my face straight when he came home - I couldn't pretend to be happy after what I saw today. I never had proof before - he always said to me that I'm crazy and being paranoid. Now I have it here - I copy the pictures and took it to a one hour lab.

Well his plan was moving out on Friday anyways - so I figured I will give him the PBL and the pictures I developed today. I don't know if I can last that long till Friday - to pretend to be all happy..... happy... happy.... I thought about doing it tomorrow - give him PBL and pictures and asked him to leave instead of him leaving.

I saw all the people in the pictures. I'm sure no one know that my H has a family and children at home. - should I expose to their friends???

Aw, VL...I'm so sorry!! I feel so bad that you are feeling so bad.

((((((((((VL22))))))))))

I don't know what else to say except hang in there. It will get better. It might take a little while but it will get better. I know you probably don't want to hear that right now. I know I didn't want to hear it, but it helped even though I didn't want to hear it. So please bear with me.

Pullin' for you and standing behind you as much as possible in cyberspace,

Charlotte

((((VL))))

I am sorry you had a bad day.

Do you have your planB letter ready. Do you need a mediator and is that in place? Financial Plan?

IMO, it would be better for you to planB him a day or two early, as opposed to spending his last days there with you mad, sad, angry. Oh, and in my opinion, you don't have to be "happy" in planA (not in a Stepford Wife kinda way) but be WONDERFUL.

Maybe think "You, Mr Poopyhead, sitting on the couch, are a foggy, crazy wayward. But I am a wife who loves her husband, marriage and family and I have all that is good on my side. All you have is a skanky OW". And smile to yourself.

Remember, the only thing we can count on is change and with planB, you know change will come, one way or the other.

It is about to get different.

Thank guys for cheering me up! I do have PBL ready. There's no legal separation in TX so I will have to file for "D". I made an apt with the attorney on Thurs because I think he's been moving $$$ around already. I don't know how much but it's the only way for me to secure for my daughters' future.

I'm all set to got - I am thinking of doing it tomorrow night. So I have been praying so I can be strong to do this and not give in to him anymore.

I cried so much today - my hands were shaking when I saw the pictures. I couldn't eat dinner tonight but I had to wash my tears away and sit with my daughters and enjoyed a dinner with them.

I will keep you posted tomorrow - it will be a bid day!!!

I gave him the PBL - he moved out on Friday and I have file for "D" today to protect myself financially. He text me today - asked "When can we talk?" I didn't reply - I was soooooo tempted but I didn't. Then he sent another text "We need to work this out one way or another." Still nothing!

I found a picture of the two of them - intimate pictures posted publicly online - One thing is to know about it but a whole different story when you see your H is with this OW looking so happy together - I was shaken, I was disgusted, I was torn, and sad.

I finally broke the final news to our daughters that Daddy doesn't live here anymore. The girls cried so much - my oldest said "why does daddy have to break up our family?" "We have so much fun together." Oh she was sobbing so much.

Well I am going dark from now on - I pray to give me the strength to stay strong for this time and for my daughters.