It would help you to know she could not lie to you.

Lies by ommission are still lies.


Boinking another man is not an isolated incident!


So you diligently defend some of Dr. Harley's rules and disregard other so you can keep your head firmly planted in the sand?

I'd bet anything your wife was in a PA. You will fell 100% better once you REALLY know. I was there.

I have been trying to find a good key logger for the Mac. The one I had she found it, it was weak.

In a month, if you do what you've been told, you'll be posting about how we were all right and it was a PA and your wife was gaslighting you!

Read KOS's post. Just like yours!

It might be serious but it can still be isolated. My head is not planted in the sand.

PEOPLE READ MY POSTS. I TRIED TO CALL NO ANSWER SO NOW I AM WAITING!!!

Of course it is easy to look back and say who is wrong who is right.

Of course its easy to look at someones situation and says its exactly the same as mine. Well they are not.

This is how I am handling it for now.

Red
Spector Pro is the best one out there, around 90 bucks. If thats too much, there are plenty of free ones, look on download.com. No spyware, no viruses and USER rated, which is good. And you can always bittorrent it if you like, but that is up to you.

And some voice activated recorders can be had for as little as 40 bucks. And check these EVERYDAY. I know its scary. Many many emails crushed my heart. Keep checking, you have the RIGHT to the truth.

Do you realize how lame that sounds? I tried to call?!

Please, man up.

READ MY POSTS. I did call there was no answers. I called for three days. I dont need to man up to anything. I tried and it failed. I am not going to fret about calling the number everyday for the rest of my life.

When I feel I need to call I will.

If I call and call and call and call. And I never get an answer will you still be telling me to man up.

If you weren't such a girl you would drive there.

PS. Sorry to offend you girls!

READ MY POSTS THEY LIVE IN TEXAS!!!!

Had you not found out about your wife's EA, would you be here, willing to look at what is wrong in your marriage and figure out how to fix it? Had you not found out when you did and started working on it, do you believe the affair would have just magically stalled at the place it was when you discovered it? Affairs progress or they end. I'm not as sure as you are that your wife's affair has ended, but I am sure that the OMW has no hope of fixing what is wrong in her marriage if she doesn't even know that it's broken.

There is more than one way to skin a cat.

She told me she wanted a divorce a week before I found out about EA. I would still be doing the same things I am now whether I found out or not.

I hear you. I just hope this doesn't backfire on you because we (MBers) have seen this time and time again. I never exposed to OW's spouses because I didn't know about MB. I still regret it. It would have ended with the 1st affair and recovery could have begun in earnest WAYYYY before it did.

I'm still here for you regardless and I'll be praying for you both.

It doesn't matter that you tried. It matters that you stopped trying.

I think the only reason you stopped trying to contact OMW is b/c your WW promised you NC and you feel SAFE...and you are afraid to give OM a reason to contact your WW. Well, I think you need to change your mindset about contact. Even if your WW promises NC, you are still NOT SAFE.

The risk that they will have contact again is high...the risk is even more higher when OMW isn't watching from her end...and even higher yet when OM and OMW don't have the opportunity to fix their own M.

BTW, OM is likely just waiting in the wings, waiting for his chance to reignite the A because he is still in fantasyland. Exposure to OMW is what helps to break the fantasy bubble in OM's world.

As far as a moral POV, I believe not telling OMW is coming from a very selfish place and this is something that you know is wrong...and I believe this is something that you will come to regret once you come out of your tunnel vision(ie, keeping things nice with your WW).

I have an idea BigRed.

If you feel that YOU have no moral obligation to let OMW know that her WH is having an affair with your WW, then why not hand the duty over to someone else?

There has to be a way for you to let someone in this forum know a contact # where OMW can ber reached. No one has to say any names or anything...just one phone call to say to OMW "your husband is having an affair with another woman...online, texting, not sure if it has become physical or not"...click.

Why not let someone else do it for you? Preferably a "vet" whp is better with words than someone like me lol.

I think it's been done here before...if I'm not mistaken.

**Warning! I apologize for the lenght of this**

Redhead-

I usually just read, as I still feel like I’m not as educated about MB as much as a lot of other folks around here, but I’ve been struggling not to chime in as I read your situation, and I just couldn’t hold it in anymore.

My experience: Due to immaturity, age, and lack of bounderies, I had an extended telephone/computer EA (both myself and my H were not knowledgeable enough to recognize it for what it was at the time; H new about contacts). I ended it on my own and recommitted to my H when we got M. I knew that if I was going to M him, that he deserved 100% of me, and I gave it to him.

While I was enmeshed in the 3yr EA, I wasn’t a good GF to him; I was selfish, distant, mean, verbally abusive towards him. I hid how often I spoke with the OM, I hid what we talked about. I bet that H new something was wrong, but didn’t attribute it to the OM, because OM was in another country and there was no physical contact. I still tried to plan contact, though…


My other experience: Due to H’s own lack of bounderies, he found that he made the horrible decision to have a ONS with a co-worker. He fell down the slippery slope into it (flirting, she made him feel good about himself, they were “just friends”, etc), he didn’t intend for it to happen, it wasn’t an EA at all, just a ONS that literally right in the middle of, he stopped and said “I can’t do this this isn’t right”, and ran.

He hid it from me for 1 year and 1 month. I had was clueless.

Let me tell you what I know now. The guilt, shame, hurt, hatefulness he experienced towards his self, while not coming clean, to me festered itself as verbal and emotional abuse to me. He was angry, accusatory, mean, selfish, and emotionally removed from myself and our child. It wasn’t until somebody physically forced him to tell me, that he did.

I was shocked, and physically went into shock. I feel like part of me died, and you know what, it did, the M that I thought I had, it was murdered the day I was cheated on, I just didn’t know it.

I have learned that it was the not-knowing, the secrecy of the both the EA (on my part) and the ONS (on his) that contributed to the downfall of our R. We were both getting needs met by outsiders, and as long as that is happening, no amount of recovery can occur. I also learned that lieing by omission is just as damaging as bold-faced lieing.

This is why the OMW needs to know. She may know that something’s wrong, he may be treating her horribly, she may be being too trusting because she’s not as knowledgeable about PA’s/EA’s as others are. Maybe she knows there’s problems in her M, but has NO IDEA what it is. I do not think it’s up to you to fix their marriage, but I do think it is your responsibility to educate that poor woman. I wish somebody would have educated my H and I long before. We wouldn’t have lost all of the years we did treating each other horribly. We could have had the M that we have now much, much sooner.

I fully believe that my H would have tried to take his secret to the grave, but I’m thankful that I found out, because I wouldn’t have the man that I knew he could always be, I wouldn’t have the wonderful man that I have now. Like others, I hate what the A’s did to us, but I wouldn’t trade what I have now for anything in the world.


Exposure and the NC Letters were key to our (ongoing) recovery.

The fact still remains that you had to KNOW there was a problem before you were in a position to try (or have the motivation) to fix it. Asking you for a divorce was your wife's way of telling you that. When you found out about her affair, you then knew why she asked you for a divorce. The OM has likely not asked his wife for a divorce, or told her of his relationship with your wife. Until she knows there is a problem, she won't have the opportunity you now have to work on your marriage before it is too late.

Hey, I know youre lurking. Everyone that doesn't like to be ridiculed lurks. I did. There are plenty of us who haven't questioned your manhood here. Youre in a tough time right now. You ain't thinking straight. You react with what YOU HOPE and WISH is happening. You might be right, or you may be wrong. If you don't do what you are uncomfortable with, its because you STILL have hope that your best aspirations ARE, IN FACT, TRUE. So go with those best wished, there is NO time clock.

But, whether or not you give your wife the benefit of the doubt, you ABSOLUTELY HAVE to keep snooping. And there is, unlike your OTHER OBJECTIONS, NO REASON to stop snooping. She has PROVEN herself untrustworthy. That doesn't mean that she can't BECOME the worlds best wife, I'm sure thats possible. It only means that COMMON SENSE says that you have to keep an eye on her actions.

I really admire your faith. Faith can be a wonderful crutch when EVERYTHING ELSE that you desire seems unattainable. I know. I'm in a situation where my FAITH is the only thing keeping me going. And I truly believe God will answer your prayers. But, to understand Gods plan for you, you MUST understand what is going on AROUND you. I know your HOPING everything turns out all right. But HOPE without action is ALWAYS JUST HOPE. Now, hope WITH action is called PROGRESS. And I really think, what YOU want is indeed progress. Good luck Red, I will reread your posts when my faith begins to wane.

Bigfat,

I’m a FWW who had an EA through e-mail exchanges. My BH didn’t want to have the EA exposed due to personal reasons and circumstances. The non-exposure to OM’s W definitely had a very negative influence on my recovery and M. Because of the non-exposure, the OM tried to contact me throughout the years. Usually his attempts to contact was months apart, sometimes up to almost a year apart. That kept me vulnerable in spite of the fact that I always informed my H and tried to restrain myself from acting on his attempts, but eventually (a few years into recovery) I had a weak moment and made the very wrong choice to react on OM’s e-mail. It leaded to a 2 day resumption of the EA and was a huge set-back for us and our M. I was back at square one of withdrawal and my H experienced the pain and hurt of betrayal all over again. I know OM would have probably never attempted to resume contact if the EA was exposed to his W in the first place.

Bigfat, don’t underestimate this type of addiction and take all take all precautions you can to protect your W and M. Expose to the OM’s W as soon as you can and if you still can’t get hold of her, try other means to reach her. Exposing to OM’s W will help protect your M and your W’s vulnerability because there is a smaller chance for contact to be resumed later on if both BS’s knows about the A and can watch from both ends. If you don’t do it, I can almost guarantee that the OM will try to resume contact with your W on some point. Exposure will also give the OM’s W the chance to learn the truth about her H and M and do something about it. Rather do it sooner than later. The longer you put it off the more difficult it will become to take that step and bigger the chance that you will eventually decide to not expose to her at all.

If you keep postponing exposure because you’re afraid the OM will contact your W, please keep the following in mind:

1. Whether you expose now or later, there might be a risk of the OM contacting your W anyway, so it’s better to do it now than later. It’s better for her to start withdrawl all over again now while you’re still in early recovery, than later when she has moved passed most withdrawl symptoms and then have to start the withdrawal all over again… Therefore, postponing exposure will only prolong recovery in the long run and the time it will take for your W to get through withdrawal.

2. If you expose and the OM feels angry with your W about it, it will deplete “love units” from his “love bank” for her and that will be a good thing. If the OM tries to act vindictive and revengeful after exposure it will disgust your W and deplete “love units” from her “love bank” for him and that will be a good thing too.

Thank you all for your recent replys. I have been on vacation and havent been able to reply. Suzet yours was very helpful. Things seem to be getting better little by little. She has actually referred to our future together a few times. She says she is trying to stay optimistic.

The big hurdle for us right now is passion or desire. She has absolutely no desire to touch me, hold my hand or anything. I thought of it makes her ill. And I have no idea what caused this or what it means. I think most of it rests on my weight and appearance. Which I am working on (lost 30 lbs so far). But I dont think I will be at an acceptable weight to her for a long time.

Right now she is giving it 6 months. If she cannot touch me or hold my hand by then she says "Its a big red flag for her".

She is treating me better but occasionally says some mean things. My pastor adivse to not listen to what she is saying, just continued to love her, meet ENs and avoid LBs.

I told her I think the best way to restore passion is to go through MB. My question for all of you is do you think I need to buy the course or can we just go through the basic concepts and answer questionnaires?

Right now I think my biggest job is working on myself. I'm working harder, spending better times with kids, and losing weight. The biggest improvement I need is going to be my spiritual life. Im reading the Bible daily and keeping a prayer journal. Some days I feel close to God other days miles away.


Two great passages I would like to share with you guys

John 12:27-28 (New International Version)

27"Now my heart is troubled, and what shall I say? 'Father, save me from this hour'? No, it was for this very reason I came to this hour. 28Father, glorify your name!"


Jeremiah 29:11-13 (New American Standard Bible)

11'For I know the plans that I have for you,' declares the LORD, 'plans for welfare and not for calamity to give you a future and a hope.

12'Then you will call upon Me and come and pray to Me, and I will listen to you.

13'You will seek Me and find Me when you search for Me with all your heart.