I would like some feedback on whether it's good for me to know all the details of my WH's PA. I have so many questions in my mind. I have been lied to for almost 3 yrs and now that I know the truth, I have so many questions about past events. I feel like I want to know everything, but I also know that it could give me even more horrible pictures in my head than I already have. Sometimes I think it may just be morbid curiosity and at other times I think it may bring clarity and understanding. Thanks for the input.

ldawk,

I'm a new person, so you can weigh my advice appropriately. I have had a long time to think about this because if the way I handled the A, but for me I need every detail.I am sure it will hurt, and it may mean that we can not stay married, but I know I can't stay unless I know.

It is a decision that only a BS can make.

What questions that are answered can not be unasked.

If you are a person that has to know everything then you will never reest until you do. Not knowing what happened in 1981 still leaves me wondering and guessing.

It has been said that an advantage of asking is that one will no longer dwell on what happened during the affair. Freeing them to finally move forward.

What a WS will hear will hurt, but time will help it to fade. This knowledge will not be forgotten, but fade enough to eventually not trigger on it when you recall it.

If you need it insist on being told. If you have doubts proceed slowly with your questions.

lhawk, you will have to know enough so that you have the RIGHT picture in your head of the affair. The level of detail will change from person to person. I needed GREAT DETAIL, no matter how hurtful, others need much less. That question can only be answered BY YOU by asking: WHAT DO I NEED TO RECOVER?

Another important factor is his willingness to answer all of your questions. That is even more important than the details.

[i][b]Requirements for Recovery[/b][/i]

The plan I recommend for recovery after an affair is very specific. That's because I've found that even small deviations from that plan are usually disastrous. But when it's followed, it always works. The plan has two parts that must be implemented sequentially. The first part of the plan is for the unfaithful spouse to completely separate from the lover and eliminate the conditions that made the affair possible. The second part is for the couple to create a romantic relationship, using my Basic Concepts as a guide.

I'll describe these two parts to you in a little more detail.

The first step, complete separation from the lover and eliminating the conditions that made the affair possible, requires a complete understanding of the affair. All information regarding the affair must be revealed to the betrayed spouse, including the name of the lover, the conditions that made the affair possible (travel, internet, etc.), the details of what took place during the affair, all correspondence, and anything else that would shed light on the tragedy.

This information is important for two reasons: (1) it creates accountability and transparency, making it essentially impossible for the unfaithful spouse to continue the affair or begin a new one unnoticed, and (2) it creates trust for the betrayed spouse, providing evidence that the affair is over and a new one is unlikely to take its place. The nightmares you experience are likely to continue until you have the facts that
will lead to your assurance that your husband can be trusted.

An analysis of the betrayed spouse's childhood or emotional state of mind in an effort to discover why he or she would have an affair is distracting and unnecessary. It takes precious time away from finding the real solutions. I know why people have affairs: We are all wired for it. Given certain conditions, we would all do it. Given other conditions, however, none of us would do it. So the goal of the first step is to discover the conditions that made the affair possible and eliminate them.

After the first step is completed, the second step is to create a romantic relationship between you and your husband using my 10 Basic Concepts http://marriagebuilders.com/ca/to.cgi?l=qa080103bc
as your guide. While your relationship may be improving, it won't lead to a romantic relationship because you are not being transparent toward each other. Unspoken issues in a marital relationship lead to a superficiality that ruins romance.

Your nightmares are only the tip of the iceberg. They are but a small reflection of the suffering you experienced when you discovered your husband's affair, and the fear you have that the suffering will be repeated. You have no assurance that the affair is over because you don't even know who the other woman is. You are being asked to trust your husband, who has already proven to be untrustworthy. For all you know, he could be working with her, or you could be going to the same church, or she could be
your neighbor. And since he won't discuss the details of how the affair took place, you have no assurance that another affair will not take its place.

Infidelity is not something that can be swept under the rug. While those who have affairs want to forget about it and move on, those who are betrayed must take very specific steps before they can fully recover. In your case, those steps have not been taken, and as a result, your fear persists. I will send you a complimentary copy of my book, "Surviving an Affair," if you send me your address. It will describe these two steps to you and provide you with a roadmap toward full recovery. But the path will require full disclosure of all details.

Best wishes,

Willard F. Harley, Jr.

Thank you so much to you and everyone else who posted a response to this. I really appreciate your advice.

ldawk7,

I forgot to say how sorry I am that you are in this situation. My heart goes out to you. I know what it is like to have 5 children and be cast aside for someone else.

For me, the thoughts in my head were so bad I couldn't picture it getting worse. It hurt to hear the details. Some I still stuggle with; not so much the sexual part as much as things like gestures and gifts. I'm very glad my husband told me the details I wanted to know. OW contacted me later and tried driving a further wedge between me and H by cluing me in on certain details. I already knew so it took 99% of the sting out of her comments. My husband looked pathetic, but she had him beat by a mile and in a weird way that knowledge made me feel somewhat better.

Idawk7

I agree with Mel, you should ask about those things that you will need to heal. I would think twice (now in hindsight) about asking specific details regarding their sex. I asked my FWW about their sexcapades, and she answered. What I heard shocked me literally to the point of vomiting. I've always been rather mainstream / conventional when it comes to sex, while FWW has her wild side. Before we married way back when, FWW had a number of wild boyfriends with whom she was very active sexually. However, once she was ready to settle down, she married me. I'm the good boy type that a girl would want to marry, not the bad boy type to have 'fun' with.

However, in her A, FWW returned to the bad boy type, in spades. OM is a paroled felon and a real latino casanova. Their sessions would last up to 5 hours continuous through the night, involving every position and every type of sex in the book. this went on about twice a week for almost 3 months. FWW said each of them admitted it was the best sex either have ever had.

Needless to say, that didn't do much for my self-esteem at the time. It also created horror movies in my head. For months afterwards, anytime I saw FWW nude, all I could picture is what they had done with each other.

So, as the saying goes, be careful what you wish for.

I will respectfully disagree with this premise. What a BS needs is the full and complete story to make a fully informed decision about their future. What you advocate in your post, in hindsight, is simply "sweeping it under the rug" because it was TOO painful for you to hear.

IMHO, you are blaming the knowledge, rather than the decision you made with that knowledge.

Hi Idawk7,

I struggle with the same issue so I hope you post will help me. I keep finding out more details piece by piece. I'm sure I still don't know it all. My H says there's a lot and it's horrible and I wouldn't want to know. This is not the first affair and I know there are things from the last 2 he's kept from me as well. I doubt he will ever tell all even if I ask. I think he will lie to keep me from being pushed away from him. He's into really extreme sexual behaviors and I'm sure it would be painful for me to know about all of it. However I can't sleep because I think about what's he's done and then I toss and turn and wonder about what I don't know. It's agony.

My opinion on this is that if there is something you are contemplating on asking...you need to ask.

When I was asking questions...I'd get "I don't remember" in return. By KMS doing this, the mind movies I had in my head were all over the place. Until I actually got some answers (i.e. where?...how?...how often?..positions?...oral?...orgasms?, etc...), it was natural for me to just assume the worst. If no one tells you any different than how could you not assume the worst?

Anyway, if you are contemplating whether or not to even ask the question, stop contemplating.......you need an answer. Unless you want mind movie re-runs for a long time.

Thank you. I appreciate your kindness. I'd like to know your story and where you're at in this whole process. Thanks again for your thoughts.

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2083811#Post2083811

Here is a link to my story.

Right now it's just one day at a time.

As far as knowing the "whole truth" goes...I'm not 100% certain I will ever know the whole truth (my WW lied even after OM told me the whole truth). Because of that the trust may never come back. I hope this doesn't happen to you.

I've learned that if I never trust her again...I will never know if I have the "whole truth"...trust and the truth go hand in hand.

Thanks galoot. I have to admit that what I already do know makes me want to vomit, yet it drives me nuts to think that he has private memories all his own. I think that part of the being accountable is that he has to admit to ALL of it. On the other hand, who's to say that what he would tell me is the truth. It almost seems like a no win situation. I'm either left to wonder and create my own pictures, or get the pictures from him. Either way, this whole thing sucks really bad. Have the pictures in your head faded at all or is it still to fresh. Also, you say you've seen her nude.....does that mean you've been able to be intimate with her. If so, how do you deal with the pictures in your head then? If I'm being too personal I'm really sorry and please feel free not to respond. It is something that totally scares and disgusts me though. The thought of being physical with him seems so impossible. It seems I would just be wondering if he was thinking about her and what it was like with her.....ugh!! It makes my skin crawl. I know that it is very fresh to me right now though so I do have hope that as we hopefully progress, those feelings will fade.

The private memories is a HUGE concern for me as well.

It's not so much that WW has those memories...but OM has them. He knows personal and private things about my W that I don't.

It really hurts to think about that aspect.

Your admission that these private memories are an issue with you means only one thing.......you need the deatails...just like I did.

Hi betrayedmom,

I do hope it helps you too......maybe we'll learn together I have asked my H so many questions....practically drilled him. I just got confirmation on 8/10, so since then I have had so many questions. At first he would get so mad if I questioned him. He felt like, "Well I admitted it so now let's just move on" That made me even more hurt and angry. When I first found out I told him that the one thing I definitely needed was for him to end it in front of me. He was against that at first, but agreed the next day and he followed through. So when I had questions after that he actually accused ME of lying because I had said that I only needed one thing to move forward. Now I just wanted to keep bringing up the past by insisting on talking about it. The nerve of him!! He was doing nothing to work on things...just wanted to move forward though. Thankfully, since then he has changed his thinking a bit and has answered questions. But it just seems that it leads to more questions. What I hear is very hurtful and that's why he says it's not a good idea and will just set me back further. But I feel like I need to know because I just need the truth......from him. It is hard to swallow the truth, but I think it's harder not knowing. It's kind of torture either way, but I desperately just want him to be telling the truth. Sometimes I will already know the truth without letting on and then I'll question him about it just to see if he'll tell the truth. I think it's the most destructive part of the whole betrayal.......being lied to for so long and then left to wonder if he will ever be trustworthy.

BUT...he is the last person who is qualified to decide what is your best interest. What will set you back more than anything is witholding THE DETAILS ABOUT YOUR OWN LIFE. The affair is information about your own life to which you are ENTITLED.

Has anyone shown you Josephs letter yet? Sorry if you have already seen it:

Joseph's Letter

It is torture either way...you're right. But, if you get the details, the torture you will have to endure is the making of your WH, and it should get better (for the lack of a better word). If you don't, you will keep on getting tortured...not only that, but it will be partly your WH torturing you, and at the same time a self inflicted torture.

I know I am new, and I am in alot of pain right now. But I think knowing the details is better. Especially about the sex, the betrayal aspect made me physically ill. I had assumed the sex would be wild and fantastic but the letters, which she kept, don't show that.

Also I have to say, we all have basically the same equipment, so if your spouse wants something why not do it. This may be a man perspective, since I'm a man.

I believe you misconstrue. I was not "sweeping it under the rug." There were things I wanted to know and asked about which were necessary for healing and for moving on, such as to what she felt like when she fell in love, to what extent she felt guilt or shame during the A, the frequency and location of their rendevous, and, especially, how did it end, how she felt about him during and after it ended, what was said.

However, knowing the grimy little details of what they did in bed, or on the floor, as the case may be, didn't help me. Knowing how he performed anal sex on her, or how he taught her to give better BJ's didn't help me. Those kind of things were TOO PAINFUL to hear, and they didn't help me, either in deciding what to do with our relationship, or how to heal. In fact, they hindered our healing process. Some things are better left a mystery.