And I added another song I love to my "Turn It On" collection. DD12's singing teacher let me and DD7 share her lesson, so I'm getting singing training, too! I love listening to the kids sing, and singing in the car. I'm even going to be in the Winter Recital they're doing


"Burn For You" by Toby Mac

I'm a brand new man, I'm a conscious man
I'm a man who's burnin' for you
The mistakes I've made have been chased away to the bottom of the ocean blue
I'm a brand new man in a foreign land, I'm a man who's feelin' that fire
And it's all so clear when I'm standing here at the peak of my desire

Chorus: So won't you move me like you used to
I want the world to know I burn for you
I feel revived again, I am alive again
(Burnin' for you) You got me lifted and lifted you lift me up
I feel revived again, I'm energized again
(Burnin' for you) You got me lifted and lifted you lift me up

Woke up in a sweat, those ghosts in my head
Had a grip, but I slipped on by
It's a whole new day as the darkness fades
And the sun's climbing in the sky
I concede, my love, that I need your love
I'm before you, a broken man
And it's only you, no substitutes who can renew this soul again

Chorus

You got me higher than Kilimanjaro
Got me believin' I can "save the day"
I'm up and running like their ain't no tomorrow
I'd rather burn for you than fade away
I'd rather burn for you than go my way

Chorus

Rap: I'm a whole new guy with a whole new vibe
Changed inside - more flame in the fire
Can't stop, won't stop praying for desire
Like the bunny on the screen feel so energized
Old shell gone without a trace, new face
No more shortness of breath, new pace
Live life now without the taste of fear
TOBYMAC, Double Dutch now let the smoke clear

I'd like to address this one. To gender generalize, women emote, men reason. Technically emotions and feelings are irrational. So he may feel that your opinions derive from your feelings and emotions. The solution is simple to state but may be harder in practice. When you communicate your opinions, you will need to remove the emotions and feelings and make your opinions based on logical arguments (arguments in the traditional sense, not fights!). This will require you to carefully and logically construct your opinions before expressing them.

It is hard to not always react immediately and spontaneously, but to instead analyze and ponder both the meaning and the motive before replying. Men see women as expressing their emotions and feelings and not presenting logical arguments, i.e. just reacting to the current stimulus. Again, shake up this dynamic. I'm not advising that you start thinking and acting like a man, but think about doing something else than just reacting out of emotion and feelings. You can be Mrs. Spock temporarily to achieve your goals.

If this works, you owe me a Guinness.

There are 2 recent songs that I find uplifting and resonate with me:

Seether - "Rise Above It"

Take the light, undarken everything around me
Call the clowns and listen closely, I'm lost without you
Call your name every day when I feel so helpless
I'm fallin' down but I'll rise above this, rise above this

Hate the mind, regrets are better left unspoken
For all we know, this void will grow and
Everything's in vain, distressing you though it leaves me open
Feels so right, but I'll end this all before it gets me

Call your name every day, when I feel so helpless
I'm fallin' down, but I'll rise above this, rise above this
Call your name every day, when I seem so helpless
I'm fallin' down, but I'll rise above this, rise above this doubt

I'll mend myself before it gets me
(I'll mend myself before it gets me)
I'll mend myself before it gets me
(I'll mend myself before it gets me)

Call your name every day, when I feel so helpless
I'm fallin' down, but I'll rise above this, rise above this
Call your name every day, when I seem so helpless
I'm fallin' down, but I'll rise above this, rise above this
Forty eight ways to say that I'm feelin' helpless
Fallin' down, fallin down', but I'll rise above this, rise above this

And one that particularly fits me well,

Alter Bridge - Before Tomorrow Comes

I couldn't sleep I had to listen
To a conscience knowing so well
That nothing comes from indifference
I look inside of myself

Will I find some kind of conviction?
Will I bid the hero farewell?
Will I be defined by things that could have been?
I guess time will only tell
I guess time will only tell

So don't let it be
Before tomorrow comes
Before you turn away
Take the hand in need
Before tomorrow comes
You could change everything

I curse my worth and every comfort
That blinded me for way too long
Damn it all I'll make a difference from now on
Cause I'm wide awake to it all
Cause I'm wide awake to it all

So don't let it be
Before tomorrow comes
Before you turn away
Take the hand in need
Before tomorrow comes
You could change everything

Does anyone care it ain't right what we're doing?
Does anyone care it ain't right where we're going?
Does anyone dare justify how we're living?
Does anyone here care at all?

So don't let it be
Before tomorrow comes
Before you turn away
Take the hand in need
Before tomorrow comes
You could change everything

We could be so much more than we are
We could be so much more than we are
We could be so much more than we are
Oh this much I know

I might add that both of these songs really rock!

Booka, I had always approached things from a logic standpoint, and got TOTALLY NOWHERE too much of the time. Being raised by two perfectionist parent who go over past decisions, seeing at what point they got information to make a different choice, that is how I think, too, what makes sense?

For example, and I am thinking cat won't mind me using her situation as an example, the SiL's birthday party. That made perfect sense to me, that cat decided to be at the family event instead of both the family and the adult event. Her brother subsequently cancelled the other event, and got mad at cat for not coming to the first party. Even though cat's logic made perfect sense to me.

I can think of several good reasons for cat to decline. Her H was out of town, so there was a lot of work for her to do on her own. Her DD was not invited, so cat would prefer to go to the other one, because that is part of the point of family time to her, to include the family. She didn't like that her daughter was not invited, so she didn't want to go to this one. She's just one person, and there would be a lot of people at the party, so cat wouldn't be missed. There are a lot of events to go to, so it makes sense for cat to pick and choose what she can and wants to do. It also made sense for her to decline because she was doing extra work to get out of debt, and that's a legitimate priority, too.

But her brother already decided that he thought she should go. He wasn't interested in hearing her reasons. His reasons that he thought she would go were the only ones he found relevant and rational. He was more interested in judging cat. It doesn't make sense to reason with folks when they are in Attack mode.

So I got here, and read where Dr. H says people are really simple. They want to do over and over again the things that make them feel good. That it's not about deciding together whose position is logically more sound, it's about finding solutions that make both people feel good. So that they look forward to going home, look forward to spending time with their spouse, look forward to negotiating, and so on. That makes sense to me.

It is one thing to think logically and it may be obvious to you that you are being logical along your standards of measurement. But are your clearly expressing yourself in communications in a logical fashion? We cannot expect someone to divine how logical we really are. We have to show them by example, including an example that they can understand on their own terms.

Booka, thanks for the songs! They rock Where'd you find them?

Those are songs that I actually listen to, both are played on the radio in rock and alternative formats. I have both on my iPod with another 3,000 songs or so. Almost immediately after getting divorced, I became very enamored with alternative music and have managed to become somewhat literate in it as a genre. It still resonates with me. I have very diverse tastes and you could hear these two songs along with some Beethoven any given time from my garage stereo.

I have gotten in the habit of going to concerts of some artists that I know little or nothing about and in two cases had not heard a full song from either. This tends to broaden my horizons a bit and also had the benefit of giving me the single best concert experience I ever had in 35 years of going to concerts.

But are your clearly expressing yourself in communications in a logical fashion? We cannot expect someone to divine how logical we really are. We have to show them by example, including an example that they can understand on their own terms.

Wow, that sounded familiar! So I checked the Disrespectful Judgements article to look up Thoughtful Persuasion again.


I think that I do lay out exactly why I think the way that I think. Not when the person is ANGRY , but after they calm down again. Sometimes I have to be patient, because it takes a while to get to that point. When I get some success, I'll be glad to send some Guiness your way. We always have enough around here to share LOL.

I'm more of a White Zinfandel person myself, but I'm laying off for now, because those calories are easy to do without.

That's pretty cool about discovering a whole new music genre. We have XM in the car, so it'd be easy to try without a big investment. I can't think of any alt rock stations here, just classic rock.

Both of those songs were played on multiple station formats in the St. Louis market.

Now pray tell, what is white Zinfandel made out of? I could never figure that one out. I prefer what I call Zinfandel and what you might call red Zinfandel. Trivia question, considering that a white and red wine can be made from the same grape, what's the difference in processing that accounts for the color or lack of color?

There is sure to be some form of alternative channel on XM. I tend to appreciate the angst of alternative and what they term "emo" music.

Where in general in FL are you? I used to live in Melbourne Beach and have a lot of familiarity with the Ft. Myers area.

okay, found the XM station, 44, for alt rock. Sounds good! DD12 has some emo friends who play music when they come over.

I like the regular Zinfandel, too; I think the color is from soaking the skin in the wine.

I'm on the East Coast in South Florida, outside Fort Lauderdale, a big cruise hub. About half an hour north of Miami, and 2 and a half hours from Fort Meyers. I driven through there, very beautiful.

The only station I listen to regularly is alternative rock. For about a decade, when D18 was 1-10, I quit listening to music. Then she started listening, and I just picked up where she found interest, so I love alt. rock now.

booka, since you know so much more about it than me, do you have any idea why Good Charlotte doesn't qualify as alt. rock? They're my favorite band, but our alt. rock station won't play them! You'd think with their songs like Anthem they'd be right in line with it. My other favorites are Secondhand Serenade (which is really only one guy) and LostProphets. And Green Day, just because they have such awesome drums.

And White Zinfandel is all I ever drink. Who'da thunk we have so much in common?

Cat, that's funny about the White Zin

I know this is OT, but I was thinking about the reading that I was telling you about yesterday. It also talked about how children of alcoholics look to marry a mother figure, to mother them where they had been abandoned. Thinking about that, I just realized something *really* wierd. Every boyfriend I've had, including H, was an Adult Child of Alcoholics or addicts. I mean serious, like multiple DUIs, jail time, that sort of stuff. And alcoholism isn't even a big problem down here, like it is in some places, like Russia. Not sure what that means.

I am wondering if your B was looking for you to mother him in this situation, and angry that you didn't? Just wondering. Or if that's why our spouses think we should just go along with what they decided? Because that's what mommies do, smooth over and make everything fit?

Anyhow, time to get back to the world of the functional, to spend more time focusing on the logical than digging up stuff.

I doubt it. My B took over being my father when I was 12 and my dad left. He's been treating me like a kid ever since, letting me know very clearly when I don't meet up to his standards. "You haven't been calling mom enough. You're hurting her feelings." Stuff like that. I think he's incapable of seeing me as anything but his kid. Frankly, the less time I spend around him the better.

That makes alot of sense cat, to honor your boundaries by keeping him at arm's length.

Our natural attractions pick the same type of person every time unless we override them to make a truly intelligent choice, which cuts against our instincts. It all has to do with our childhoods.

I consider Good Charlotte to be alternative, in radio, the are many sub-genres and perchance the one that you listen to specializes in one of the sub-genres. There are two alternative stations in our market and there is surprisingly little overlap in play-lists. One i more hard-rock based and the other is more pop-based. The first one is more commercial as well. The second one has greater diversity.

I'll have to figure out how to make a list of my favorite bands.

Sounds of hand clapping. Yes, the skin accounts for both color and flavor. A red Zinfandel might blow your head clean-off if you;re used to drinking white Zinfandel.

The Zinfandel grape has a very interesting history.

This comment really stopped me in my tracks. A friend of mine whose spouse is a doctor says that her husband says this all the time. There is increasingly little negotiation between them because he says that his idea is the only "reasonable" one. It's not that he is demanding his way, it's that no other options exist.

Ears, it sounds to me like your dh has a mindset that as the husband, he has the final say. You can try and convince him all you want, but I don't think he's going to budge on this.

happy do some research on Right Man Syndrome.