Question

Has anyone noticed the similarities in the behavior of a Wayword and the symptoms of Bipolor-II (manic state)

Have any of you had a WS that was later diagnosed as Bipolar?
(Or are you a FWS that is Bipolar?)

Gack,
my FWH was/is Bipolar. we didn't find out till he had his A when he went manic for the first "official" time. he landed in the psych ward 2x during the A. once he was medicated, and I went into Plan B, things turned around within a couple of months. he now says he is so glad he's off that roller coaster.
he also can't believe the things he did & said while in the fog.

it can get better.

hugs,
cgw

I found out I was bipolar recently and I apparently had my first manic episode during my affair. But I'm not going to blame being bipolar totally for that.

Hey Gack, my ww was diagnosed with BP. I have no idea if that had anything to do with her mental state of doing the things that she did. Especially since I really never saw much of the "manic" side of her BP. To me it seems more just like depression.

Hi Gack...

I am a FWS and my father had Bipolar Disorder (he passed away in June 2007 during a manic episode)...The similarities between an active WS and Bipolar mania are unbelievable in my opinion...My mother first thought that was what was wrong with me, before she knew of my affair...Looking back at my very erratic behavior while wayward I can certainly see why she or anyone else would have thought that...I did a bit of research on it and what I found is that people in affairs and people cycling through a Bipolar mania both experience a surge of the chemical Phenylethylamine (PEA)...I didn't do further research, but I found just that fact to be very interesting...

At this time I have not ever been diagnosed as having Bipolar Disorder - and believe me I have asked REPEATEDLY...As a child of someone that had the disorder I remain forever vigilant in watching myself...I realize that as such I have a 25% chance of having it...My counselor has told me that as much as I ask her though, it is unlikely that I do have it - LOL!

I wouldn't be too quick to diagnose your wife as having Bipolar Disorder if she is currently wayward...Really...The similarities are that exact...Also, a diagnosis like that must be made by a psychiatrist [obviously]...I will say that I do know that promiscuity is one of the symptoms associated with a manic episode...I would think this has to do with the impulse control issues that often plague someone in mania...

Anyway, hope something I've said helps...

Mrs. W

One of the reasons I asked is becouse before I found this site I was convinced my WW was Bipolar and was in a manic state.

I had been reading another site http://forums.healthcentral.com/discussion/bipolar/forums/a/frm/f/2651085
about bipolar/non-bipolar relationships.

It just seems very interesting to me that the lies, Wayword FOG and wayword babble are so similar to the lies, changes in perception, wreckless behavior, and promiscuity of BP-II

I have even heard of waywords going on spending sprees and making poor financial investments wile in an A, just like wile manic with PB-II.

It almost leads me to belive they are one in the same.

I understand Gack...While there are certainly similarities between manic behaviors and wayward behaviors, there are some big differences too...Some that are pretty hard to describe to you...There are little idiosycracies that you just KNOW when you have lived with someone in a manic state...hmmmm...Sometimes called "clang associations", people in a manic state will often get stuck on groupings of words, for instance "microphones, xylophones, ice cream cones"...Certain "pet" phrases will appear in their vocabulary often...a distinctive difference in body language...sometimes a vigorous shaking of the head to try and clear racing thoughts...This is by no means a complete list and not all people in mania will display all of these things...Bipolar Disorder is a tough diagnosis to make and other things must be ruled out first...It truly is something that a psychiatrist must diagnose...

I do empathize with your desire to figure out and pinpoint exactly "WHY"...

(((((Gack)))))

Mrs. W

Eeks, Gack. My WstbxH never once exhibited anything that could be remotely connected to bipolar and/or manic but he certainly has been going through spending sprees and poor financial investments since his A started. A lot of the other symptoms would apply as well.

Can bipolar disorder emerge later in life? Are there transient forms of it (i.e. you have it for a while and then it goes away)? I always figured it was something you were just born with but then I don't have anyone in my family or circle of friends that has this.

Yes, sometimes as late as mid 30's or even early 40's

From what I have read, No.
Once symptomes of bipolar-II start manifesting, it will only get worse. Treatment can/will slow it down and reduce the symptoms, and sometimes controll it completly. But from what I have read someone in a manic phase almost never stays on there medication becouse they feal so good.

Without treatment BP-II will worsten to BP-I, then the real fun begins.

This is an interesting writeup on how one person describes a long term relationship with someone who is Bipolar.
http://forums.healthcentral.com/discussion/bipolar/forums/a/tpc/f/2651085/m/75710961

I'm not sugesting that any waywords necasaraly are Bipolar. I just see huge connections in the symptoms of an affair and the symptoms of Bypolor-II.

There are spectrums also of each disorder- one and two. I have type two. Different people cycle differently- it's definitely not one size fits all.

I am one who knows I have to stay on my meds. Mania doesn't make me feel good exactly. I do seem to get more accomplished but it makes me terribly irritable on the down swing so I don't really care for it that much.

Getting good sleep is a primary need- for me anyway.

Looking back I probably had some episodes in my early 20's and my 30's but I didn't recognize it.

Good points coachswife! I often forget and get tunnel vision where the disorder is concerned, thinking only of my father whose manic episodes lasted for 6 months at a time and were SEVERE, usually moving into the psychosis phase...Often times resulting in involuntary commitment... :MrEEk:

Mrs. W

Ok, here is a question.

Could the symptoms of an affair be missdiagnosed by a phsyciatrist as PB?

And could BP be missdiagnosed as the symptoms of an affair?

Most certainly.

BP is one of the most commonly misdiagnosed disorders. I personally wouldnt accept a diagnosis of BP without the advise and diagnosis of several psychiatrists and only then, I would make sure it is an expert in BP.

My first husband was BP. He died during what was likely a manic state many years ago. My current H had an A and while *some* of his behaviors were odd and could possibly even be considered manic, he most certainly is NOT BP.

Its very easy to look at some of these behaviors and slap a diagnosis of BP on them and some psychiatrists do this with DISASTEROUS results. If the behvior seems transient, it is unlikely to be BP. True BP is unmistakeable.

One important thing to note. The first line of treatment for BP is generally pyschotropic meds. I personally could not disagree more. Ive seen what those meds can do to people. There is a brilliant researcher by the name of Andrew Stoll out of Harvard U that uses, as a first line treatment - pharmacuetical grade Omeaga 3 fatty acids. There is some very compelling evidence that BP and other disorders are NOT caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain as thought but by food intolerence and a shortage of nutrients.

Google him - you will be shocked.

Good info.

No wonder you think of your dad everytime BP is mentioned. That's terrible!

I do still get a tiny bit manic even with my light meds that I take but it's manageable. It's more rushed speech and some mild stuff like that-nothing drastic. The most drastic thing I ever did was the A- but even I hesitate to say the BP caused it. I don't want anyone to think I'm using it as an excuse. I've never even told my exh- because he would say I am using it as an excuse and I don't want to give him an inch in trying to take my kids from me.

Hi,this is alora.I am here to say few words about depression.The people in this forum are far healthier for you than a psychiatrist. If your depression is caused from a long standing trauma then 'talk therapy' here on the forum will do you more good than a bottle of pills that obviously aren't doing you any good.
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What an interesting topic. My husband is bipolar and it has been a significant source of problems for us. For the first five or so years we were together, his meds were under control and seemed to be doing their job. And then we went through some seriously stressful stuff (cross-country move being one of them), and his meds no longer worked for him. He tried different meds, and nothing seemed to help.

Fast forward two years, and he's still trying to find the right balance of meds, but now he thinks he's having a midlife crisis and, wouldn't you know it, he starts an email affair with a girlfriend from 20 years ago.

Yeah, I definitely think there's a connection.

His latest argument is that he doesn't know if he should fight to save our marriage because he doesn't think it's fair to me to be with a bipolar depressive who can never be happy. Maybe I deserve more. Maybe he should let me leave and start my life over with someone who doesn't have a hard time getting out of bed most days.

It seems like a cop-out to me, though. Like he's using his diagnosis as an excuse for not trying harder. He never used his diagnosis as an excuse for the affair, exactly, but it's definitely all tied up together because he often has the attitude that his diagnosis is his fate; he can never be happy because he has this chemical imbalance, so there's nothing he can do about it.

Here's my question: Is it totally unfair of me to feel that after nine years of dealing with his moods and his depression and his meds and the side effects of his meds (like, zero libido), I just don't really give a damn what the excuses are anymore? Is it totally wrong of me to think that maybe he's right -- maybe I should leave and find someone who doesn't have all these issues?

Hi Mrs9405...

No, of course it's not wrong of you to think that...You have every right to feel as you do...

Two excellent reads on Bipolar Disorder are:

An Unquiet Mind: A Memoir of Moods & Madness by Kay Redfield Jamison

Click Here

(Jamison is a professor of pyschiatry at Johns Hopkins Medical School and also has Bipolar Disorder.)

Fly Me to the Moon: Bipolar Journey Through Mania & Depression by H.E. Logue, M.D.

Click Here

(This book is actually a novel, but is so informative that therapists get C.E. credits for reading it.)

Mrs. W

Thanks for the recommendation, MrsWondering. I'm ordering the books now.

Question: Do you think they'd be good reads for the bipolar spouse as well, or just the spouse of the bipolar?

I think they would be fabulous reads for both! I just can't imagine that my father would ever have read them...He didn't think anything was wrong with him of course! :teef:

Mrs. W