I am going to try and keep this as short as I can so not to make you fall asleep...

My wife and I are having problems that I never could have imagined. I found out that my wife had been talking to a coworker (male) for quite some time. As she states, while we were becoming disconnected and I was not paying attention to her needs, she became emotionally attached and attracted to this other guy. She assures me that nothing has happened and that her mind is still with me due to wanting to work this out. The only problem is that she states that her heart is somewhere else. Now, we have been going to counseling, listening to marriage fitness CDs, and read many things to try to build our relationship back to what it was in the beginning and even more. Since all of this has, the other guy is no longer at her place of work and she does not talk to him. But, we still struggle to get anything back emotionally, romanticly or sexually. We have tackled our communication problems some time ago. But, as she states, the emotional connection has been damaged and will take a long time to get it back, if ever.

I am really lost right now and just feel like I am doing everything in my power to pick up my game and do what I need to do as a husband (as I didn't in the past). She has even noticed it and stated that she wishes that I had done these things all along. But, now she said that getting that trust and confidence in me back is difficult and will take time. Does anyone have any suggestions as to how I can assist further to help speed this up? I know that they say that Rome wasn't built in a day. But, I need help as if it was because I am losing my mind.

Thanks,
Mark

Have you read the material here about Love Busters? You need to know what NOT to do, so that she stays happy with you. After you've done that for a few weeks, you need to know her main Emotional Needs, so that you can be the person providing those to her. If you do both of those things, you should see some real results. But it has to be because you believe in it, not just cos they are the steps you have to take to get her back. Women are vey intuitive about such things - great bs detectors. Because if you don't really understand it all and the need for it, and WANT to be that new person, she knows you'll just stop doing all the good things as soon as you've got her back.

Thank you for this advice...just to add to some of the posting from new information...but, first, i want to express that since going to the counseling and going through the other 'help' materials, i have been nothing less of the ideal husband...i have read books on male submission, oneness (and sincerely putting them all into my daily activities) and have even doing the 'Love Dare' from the movie Fireproof...so, i am extremely sincere in what i want from our marriage...and my wife sees that...

but, to actually add to the posting, my wife has went for the past couple of weeks and told me that she sees progress and i have as well...she came to the point where she told me that she wanted me to come to bed with her and sleep in the same bed...this was a major step and made me feel awesome for the rest of the day...that night after devotionals and prayer, she told me that she was not ready which pulled the rug out from underneath me...well, the next day, i told her that we needed to have a heart to heart and come up with a plan for resolve and just discuss things...at this time, i got broadsided...she pretty much reflected on telling me that 'her mind was with me...but, her heart was somewhere else'...after she continued to talk, she told me (without saying the exact words) that she had went a little further with this other guy than she had told me...after i kept asking her if she had sex with him, she told me that she didn't want to hurt me anymore and that she didn't want to answer that...well, that in itself answered it...she said she didn't know what she wanted to do...her mind was telling her to do the right thing...but, her heart was telling her to do something else...i told her that it wasn't her heart that was telling her that and that it was the devil attacking her...he seen the progress that is on her and now is coming down harder than ever...and i know this because he attacked me yesterday telling me that i didn't need my wife and that i would be better without her...

i can't let him win...i just don't know what to do...

You probably should post this over in the other threads, the Infidelity section, where people have survived affairs. They'll be able to give you better advice on this.

Mark, can I suggest you educate yourself on the most successful marriage program I know of? I have a GREAT marriage, that survived infidelity, and we did it using Marriage Builders. It really does work. Contrast that to an 84% failure rate of marriage counselors. Most marriage counselors don't have the slightest idea how a good marriage works, much less how to save one.

And what in the world is "MALE SUBMISSION??"

Is your wife still in touch with her adultery partner?

I also agree with catperson that you should have this moved over to Infidelity, in General Questions 11. Just click on notify at the bottom of the post and ask the mods to move it to GQ11.

Mark, I am very confused by this statement about TRUST, because it seems irrational. Who had the affair here? Wasn't it HER? If that is so, then how would it be rational for you to be the one who has to regain trust?

I am not following that logic. You do understand that adultery is the ultimate betrayal of trust?

...I will check on getting this moved after this reply...

The book that i am reading talks about 'male submission'...and no, it isn't like being a slave or anything...it is more along the line of not being the dominant, beat your chest, my way or the highway type of husband...it is being a leader in the family by being fair and feeding the wife's essence to strive toward oneness as God is with the church...in the past, i wasn't quite a beat your chest husband...but, i didn't listen to anything that my wife had to say and ruined our emotional connection by falling prey to my habit of being single for so long that i tended to put my needs first...'male submission' puts us on a level playing field...that is the reason for her trust issue...where i have been practicing this for some time now and it really isn't as difficult as many would think...it does help with communication and other key areas of the marriage...now, don't get me wrong, the book does state that when critical issues surface that the man is the final decision maker...but, in other areas, democracy should play into the picture...not a dictatorship, which is how i lived pretty much...so, that is the factor that she needs to gain trust in me with...

Now, seeing as how i have gained new information, i have a whole different ballgame to get into...i have told only one person (very close individual) about this...they asked me if i still loved her...i paused and gave a sincere 'yes'...then, he pretty much told me that i knew what i had to do...i had to fight through this as i have fought through everything else to not allow the devil to defeat this marriage...i am 99.9% sure that my wife has cut off all ties with this other individual...i can't say 100% due to no one being 100% sure of any wordly thing such as this...the day after she told me (without actually saying the words) and i was at work, she wrote me in an email and asked how i was doing...i told her not so good...she asked me if i had got any sleep (slept downstairs and left early as to miss her in the morning)...i told her that i didn't know and that i was awake to turn off the alarm clock...she asked me what i wanted her to do...i didn't respond for a long time...i prayed and just layed out what i knew i was supposed to...i told her that all contact had to cease with the other guy and that i had to pray for guidance and strength...but, i wanted to continue to work toward our marriage and that divorce was not an option for me...my faith in God is telling me that this marriage can be saved and it can be better than ever...it is just so difficult to regain that trust while trying to achieve oneness with my wife...

it is so weird that our sunday school teacher stated that we would be under constant attack from the devil...because last night we went to our first Marriage Enrichment Seminar at the church that we attend...it is a seminar with around 40 people...he stated that the devil seen this coming up and was going to try to make us lose focus on it...well, he certainly has done that...but, in this seminar, the speaker made statements that i really took to heart about my marriage...he stated that marriage is not a 50-50 relationship and that sometimes it can be a 100-0 relationship...sometime, one spouse has to carry the load...well, i am trying to gain the strength through prayer to be the spouse to carry as much as i can right now...i don't know what is going to happen...this is too much to bear for an individual...but, i pray and desire for God's intervention...and as stated in the Bible, if this is so, i will receive it...

well, we just finished our second session of the Marriage Enrichment Seminar and it really has opened our eyes to alot...and we came home with a new look on what we needed to do...even so much that we engaged into making love...well, as you might have expected, without being together for quite sometime, i lasted around a couple of minutes...she became furious and stopped without allowing me to please her further...she stated that she thinks that this was the start of the problem for the distancing...i didn't get totally mad about it...but, i just told her that in the past we didn't have sex as much as i really needed to be able to control my urges and it caused for a quicker result than even i would have liked...i told her that my goal when we make love is not to be selfish and never had been...i was always trying to please her first...but, when you only make love once a week, it is more difficult for me to control than may a few times a week at least...i tried to get her to remember when we were trying to get pregnant the length of the sexual acts...but, she was too worried about the now to recall that...but, i talked to her for a minute and let her get to bed...then i came downstairs to let everything cool down...then i went back up and put out a plan...i told her that after reading a couple of things on a website, i am going to pinpoint what i need to do to help with this...but, we would have to engage more in sexual acts and not to get so mad when these things happened...she understood and seemed as if she realized that she over reacted...but, if anyone has any advice on assistance with this as well as the problems mentioned above in other posts, i would greatly appreciate it...thanks again for all of your help...it has helped greatly...

My H was actually talking about this the other day. He said that if he ejaculates, then about an hour or two later, he can go again, and will last a LOT longer. Maybe if you know you're going to get SF that night, you could...take care of business earlier that day?

Mark, are you 100% certain that all contact with her affair partner has ceased? If not, the affair is still in progress and your marriage will never improve and I am sure you realise that.

Please take care of this first using Plan A/Plan B if you need to - this has to be priority no.1.

I wish you the very best of luck my friend.

GH31

Mark,
Welcolm to MB. None of us expected or ever wanted to be here, but welcolm.

Mark, your wife cannot continue to tell you half truths about her A with co-worker. The ONLY way to R from this is for your WW to be completely open and honest about what has transpired. You, as a BS, have a right to the whole and unabridged truth as to what happened and how long it continued. You have a right to ask Q's and have them answered truthfully and honestly. If your WW is not willing to do this, then she has not commited completely to recovery and reconcilliation(sp).

Your WW is keeping secrets that have no place in a helathy M. She is NOT allowed to keep such secrets in the noble effort to "not hurt you further." The info you need to know is for you to decide, not her!!!

Are you sure NC has been completely established? Without that, this entire effort is useless and pointless. Does she still work with OM? If so, she needs to quit her job immediately!! No R will take place if she is still in contact with OM!!

As far as "male submission" is concerned, there is no democracy about what the boundaries in your M should be. Your boundaries should be firm and decisive, and come with attached consequences for not being followed( ie, NO CONTACT). Until that is established and understood by both of you, R will be impossible.

Your WW needs to come clean and unleash her "secrets" or you will never again feel able to trust her. Rebuilding trust will be her burden, not yours! It starts with complete and radical honesty.

Most don't mention it, but you should both go and get tested for STD's and HIV. Don't find out the hard way like me. Show the test results to each other when complete. It will help to know the truth. Don't dismiss it!!


All of which is probably true, but the R portion of your M is only resolved with complete and radical honesty and openess. Your WW has a part to play here, and it begins with being honest!! Trust, the foundation a M is built on, will not be restablished without it. Your WW's repentance is incomplete when honesty is lacking, and you cannot R on crumbs. It will have to be a herculean effort on BOTH parties!!!!!

As an aside, premature ejactulation can be overcome with a visit to your local pharmacy. They have condoms with medication in them that will prevent such. Read the box! BTDT .

I do wish you well and hope your WW comes to realize that honesty is the solution to this, and not more secrets. These secrets will destroy any hope of real recovery.

All blessings,
Jerry

as i have stated above, i am 99.9% sure that all contact has ceased...i would say 100%...but, i don't think that any person is at that level...Saturday evening after our last seminar session, my wife came to me and told me that she wanted me to know that she is with me and only me and will never hurt me again...she stated that she was sorry for causing me this pain...so, if i want this marriage to last, i have to forgive her...it will be a little harder to forget...but, that is where prayer and God come in...i am just praying for the strength to do so...

Has the OM's wife been informed?

It sounds like you are being sexually compared to the OM.

Do they still work together?

well, to answer the last few questions...i think that the comparison is more than just sexual...i think when we had our emotional disconnection, the lack of wanting any sexual contact with me was dreaded...i don't care if i would have been Don Juan, it wouldn't have mattered...the reason for the quick episodes in the bedroom was due to the long periods in between sexual activity...we would go over a week without even having intercourse...all this time, the anxiety would build up in me to have sex...when we were having sex on a regular basis, i could control much better and pleased her everytime...but, i just think that she formed an emotional connection with this kid and led to this...so, i think that the connection was more than just sexual...but, anyway, they are not working together anymore to answer the last...we are moving forward and going to work on our relationship in all areas...now, i have to forgive and pray for God to give me the strength to not think about this every minute of the day...an lastly, the other guy is not married...

Since all of this has, the other guy is no longer at her place of work and she does not talk to him. But, we still struggle to get anything back emotionally, romanticly or sexually.

How long has there been No Contact (NC) between your WW and OM?

Have you read about Love Busters?

What are your wife's top three Emotional Needs and what are you doing to meet them?

What makes you think that there is No Contact?

Mark,

I have great sympathy for your difficult situation. Trust me, I know what you are going through. My WW and I are also committed Christians, so I know the shock and horror at being betrayed by someone you expected so much more from.

I have to say, from reading what you say about her reactions and what she is saying, she seems like someone deep in the fog. My strong feeling is that she is still in contact, if not in person, than probably by phone or email (my WW was in contact and hiding it from me while acting very similarly to yours).

My advice: snoop around, but brace yourself. You're likely to encounter more betrayal, and you need to be ready for that. Its tempting to think that she's not capable of it, but she IS.

Case in point, this is typical fog talk. My WW said (says? dunno haven't asked recently) extremely similar things.

You may be tempted (as I have) to interpret this as "she wants to do the right thing, this is good, clarity is coming, she's fighting it, she'll come around soon"

But its important to understand that the correct fog-talk interpretation (as I found out the hard way) is: "she is telling me this only to appease her conscience and to get me to go away. But she likely has no intention of repenting and is going to turn around and do everything in her power to get her fix of the OM."

True repentance involves both the mind AND the heart. Anything less is a cheap, worthless imitation.

BTW, I'm not saying this is not genuine, it may be. I hope it is and it is the end of your pain and the beginning of recovery. But don't take her word for it. You can forgive her, but you would be unwise to trust her. She is not trustworthy! Snoop!