My W of nine years had a EA with a coworker. Once I confronted the issue she admitted to it even though she does not think they did anything wrong since they did not have sex. I now monitor the text messages so I know there is no more sex talk on there but she still works with the guy. I have told her numerous times how it upsets me to have to think about them being in the same building 40 hrs a week. She refuses to leave her job. She says they do not talk anymore but who knows. It seems to be all I think about when she is gone. Im in the process of reading two of Harleys books and reading info on the web sight but Im at a loss for what to do. This has bugged to a point of where I have considered walking out the door but I love her and we have a five year old daughter. We are to go see a counselor tommorow night I just wish it was Dr. Harley. I told my W that I think his program would work for us but she was persistent on finding a live person to talk to and not having to read everything. At what point does a person put their foot down and say either leave your job to get away from this guy so we can get on with our lives or Im done? And is that the way to handle it?

As soon as you find out you spouse is having an Affair you make a choice to either allow the affair to continue or you insist that they make a choice of who they want to be in the relationship with.

There is no other way to handle this. There should be no extra people floating around in a 2 person marriage.

ABSOLUTELY ... its frowned on here at times but an ultimatum immediately upon discovery is the best course of action to stop an A right there ... right now.

...and FWIW ... I've walked this walk.

This message was brought to you by the "Voice of Experience".

I'm here to reply today. I have pretty much signed off, but for some reason decided to check today to see what's up, and find this thread, this question.

For me, apparently.

Here is what happens, if you don't stand up for yourself today, and don't insist on her changing jobs, and forcing the issue into the light of day, right now.

I'm dealing with something that happened a very long time ago, and now is rearing its ugly head, yet AGAIN. (My reason for being on MB is that my H had a PA about 3 years ago. THIS lovely NEW little story just came up in the last two weeks. How wonderful - the gifts that just keep giving.)

About 19 years ago, my BIL was killed in a car accident. My H went to the town where he had lived, to help out, attend the funeral, and to comfort his parents and the grieving widow. I flew in for the funeral and left in just two days, because we had children at home and I had to return to our state to take care of them.

My H stayed behind to help out, and stayed there for about 3 weeks.

When he returned, he continued to get many phone calls from the widow. Many. Many. Many.

He took the calls in "private" to console her. I began to be uncomfortable with them, and told him so. He was angry with me, and told me that he was only trying to support her in her time of need. He ultimately wanted to move down to where his brother had lived, in order to help "everyone" get through it all.....only I wasn't quite sure he wanted his wife and kids to go along.

We fought about this - H said that he was needed, that the widow needed him, and that I didn't. I was stronger than she was, I could support myself, I was able, she wasn't.

I told him that if he left, he would be dealing me the exact same hand that fate had dealt her, and that I WOULD BE JUST AS DEVASTATED. And that he could never replace his brother.

He said I didn't understand. I understood completely - he was grieving his brother, and in there confused grief with love, and wanting to help with feelings of being able to replace his brother....and in amongst all that grew a fantasy relationship that somehow he could be everything to all of us.

His brother.
My kids' father.
Her husband.

and MY HUSBAND?????? no. wait......



He came to his senses.



I think in there the two of them became too close, and that there was some sort of emotional affair, some sort of fantasy thing, I don't know. It was a mixture of grief and grasping at whatever it was for comfort. He claims "nothing happened". I don't know - I just don't know. Fast forward to

NOW.


We recently had a death in the family. We called her to let her know. After the funeral, she called back, and somehow in the craziness was missed in the call-backs to be informed as to the exact day/time for the services.

Who gets the blame? I DO. Because, according to her, I "have been trying to force her out of the family for years". This is complete news to me!

She now is sending cards to my HUSBAND ONLY.

And has announced that she will attend family functions only if I am not allowed to attend.

And won't speak to me, but will speak to my husband if I am not included.


Gee. Sounds like someone trying to cut someone out.........but I'm not doing any cutting, right?





So. Your wife had "just an emotional affair".

This freaking thing, whatever the heck it was, WAS NINETEEN YEARS AGO, FOR THE LOVE OF GOD.

And no, they didn't even work together. They saw each other on a few occasions, over the years, as the families met at the grandparents' once in awhile when the cousins had summer breaks.


So your wife needs to read this. Print it out. I'm NINETEEN YEARS into a once-in-awhile relationship, and this woman is STILL TRYING.

Sure. Her other man is "no threat". Right. And the Pope doesn't wear a funny hat, bears don't sh766t in the woods, and I am really Bill Gates dinking around for fun on the Internet.


Right.

Tell me that 19 years from now. Oh, wait, that OM will probably have screwed up your marriage by then, if you DON'T push this issue.


Schoolbus

First...

You said you were monitoring the text messages and there was no more sex talk....does this mean they are still text messaging each other???

Does she KNOW or suspect you are monitoring the text messages as it's likely she's just taken the relationship further underground. The crap about avoiding each other at work is BS, especially if they are still texting each other AT ALL.

Second...

You said you felt like "walking out the door". DON'T. Don't ever leave the marital home or you will end up divorced and relegated to an every other weekend dad and paying huge child support.

If she won't quit the job...SHE leaves and you keep the home and put yourself in a much better position to win primary custody (if it ever comes to that).


Third...

Be very careful of escalating confrontation as there are many stories of dad's being removed after the WW (purposefully) escalated a otherwise respectful heated discussion such that she calls the cops, has you removed and files a restraining order effectively winning custody, de facto.

Fourth...

Read up on Plan A. Independent counseling is worthless while she's still in contact with OM (it's called divorce counseling wherein she'll gaslight you to the counselor and try to convince him/her AND you that the marriage is already over), however, such counseling can be productive in that it gives you time alone with your wife in order to Plan A her....if you choose to.

Fifth...

Independent counselors are generally worthless as marriage counselors. Don't expect much progress from them. In fact, this counselor could, one day, be YOUR witness in a custody battle if you play your cards right...if not, he/she could end up your wife's witness. At the outset try to get a feel for the counselor...as though you were interviewing him/her for the job as your marriage counselor (never know...you might find a good one). Ask about their successes restoring and rebuilding marriage. What do they consider success...reconciliation or just "happy" divorced clients? Ask him/her if they have read and subscribe to Dr. Harley's principles and indicate that's what you'd like to implement. If they are bad, you should consider finding rationale seeming reasons why YOU don't "feel" comfortable with this counselor and find another one (that's an MB advocate).

Mr. Wondering

You are not making to much out of this. If you were important to her, she would understand that you have every right to be upset, hurt, and untrusting. If she cared about you, the very fact that you know about what she said to him would be a great embarassment to her.

The fact that she thinks she did nothing wrong because they did not have sex speaks volumes.

You have every right to draw a boundary that you expect that she will begin looking for another job. Do you have copies of the messages they shared with each other? What policy does the work site have about this kind of situation. Did they send these messages on work time? Did they use work cell phones? Are they equals, or is one of them higher up in the hierarchy?

She needs to find another job.

oh yeah,

If the OM is married (or has a girlfriend)...his wife/girlfriend HAS to be informed.

No question.

Maybe SHE will make her husband quit the company, but either way she has a right to know the facts about her life.

You'd want her to tell you.

YES..your wife will be pissed (do NOT forewarn her or threaten this as she'll just go crazy with anger threatening all sorts of retribution hoping to scare you from doing it and then if you go against her and do it anyway...you've set yourself up for her following through with such retribution...just do it and then you can apologize for making a "mistake"..."oops, sorry" and move forward from there). Your marriage can survive her temporary upset...it can not survive an ongoing extramarital relationship of any kind.

Mr. Wondering

yep.

If you do not stop her A, you are enabling her A. Plan A allows for the A to continue to an extent.

You have to define your own boundaries. Any texting breaks NC. For me, NC was the requirement (and it was broken many times).

But rather than say you will walk, I would tell WW that either she goes full NC or she moves in with OM and you stay in the house with the daughter and become a single dad. If she does that, you would then go to Plan B.

To save your M, you need to make the A difficult to maintain. By leaving the house yourself, you are actually making it easier for the A to grow.

By her leaving the house, she loses your support, loses her daughter, loses any pretense of her good reputation and is forced to live with OM 24/7 and very few can survive that scrutiny.

She either leaves her job and has NO CONTACT with him EVER again or you go straight to Plan B. Fear is the greatest enabler there is. Don't be afraid, what do you have to loose? What you have now isn't a M its a pretence. Make a stand for your M.

forgiveornot,

Any progress at your end? Have you accepted that you have no choice but to expose the A and to insist on NC or are you still debating the issue in your mind.

I see you have 2 threads and everwhere you are getting the same response. Is it helping you see that its unavoidable?

Also...who told you they have not yet had sex. Her????


Expand your snooping to include a voice activated digital recorder hidden in her car. You'll likely glean better more accurate information about your life that way.

Also...don't make the mistake of inviting your wife here to the forums or leaving your computer open to MB forums. You are going to need support and if she discovers this thread she'll render MB useless to you. (also be careful what you post as there is a certain nefarious mentally-ill lurker here that will do anything to alert wayward spouses about their betrayed spouses getting help here).

Mr. Wondering

At what point does a person put their foot down and say either leave your job to get away from this guy so we can get on with our lives or Im done? And is that the way to handle it?

you never say that....

you can...and it's a perfect deflection of making the marriage issue about the OM...and NOT about long term desires and hopefully building a loving respectful wonderful thing...

you make it about the OM....and it will deflect the real issue of marriage building and create a wonderful never ending drive it in to a grave powerstruggle....all surrounding the OM...


your goal is NOT to get rid of the OM..by demands
HE is not the issue...
your goal is to create and maintain a fullfilling sustaining partnership that eliminates needs and actions towards OP outside of the covenant...

atleast that is what I always thought this site was about.....

the ultimatum is not given to her...it is yours...

you set the time line in your head and plan what YOUR actions are going to be...if she does not value you above others...

the ultimatum is yours....

not hers...

so you follow the plan...

you expose the emotional affair to her work place...to the bosses so they are aware of what financial resources of theirs are being used to waste their money....

ie...time on company email about NON work issues...
time on company money in which they use paid time to spend together...
time is money and money is time...

you enlist the HR department to assist in protecting their assets...

expose expose expose....

you change the cell phone company if possible to track texts and calls etc...(I know nothing of what you can track and not track but is your job to find out....)

you speak to her of the pain in the heart that each and every contact she has with him and how it HURTS you and the family...

you remove all ways in which she can turn this on you and accuse you of being controling and mean and not letting her have friends...

you tell her that she is free to choose whom and all she wants...but her choices are painful and have consequences...that cut you to the core.......and drain your love and respect for her...and a time will come when you will no longer feel love and respect for her....when she chooses to continue to communicate with people that hurt you...

and that in the end...all she will have left is her insistance on continued contact and nothing else

you tell her of the great risk that contact puts the whole family unit...that her acts of seeking outside the marriage to fill her needs will never ever work....and destroy many...

you tell her of wanting to build and work together in creating a union that fills each of you with the desire to better yourselves for the other person....

you tell her of your hope of her one day very soon realizing that staying there puts her family and the marriage at great risk.......and you pray that she will find the clarity and truth in her needing to leave.....

you read about plan A....
you act in plan A
you read abut plan B
you plan your actions for plan B
that is the ultimatum....

go for the knee jerk about quiting because of the OM...blah blah blah the OM. and she will fire back how mean and controlling you are...

you desire for not contact is dead on...don't get me wrong...but she doesnt care about that right now....

..HE is not the issue...the issue is your wife's actions of engaging contact with him...and NOT valueing you more than him....

ultimatums do not involve other people and their actions..
ultimatums are your boundaries.....your point of taking actions
etc etc etc....

this is about love and hope...that YOU TWO can build a marriage that is worthy of you both....
this about YOU two changing how you view and act about YOUR marriage....

this is not about stopping contact because you demand it....

she should stop contact.
she must stop contact to make this marriage work

but if she does not understand its value
or
if she does not care about the value of no contact...

then you can insist to you are blue in the face...and it will have no meaning....

speak clearly of the damage and pain of continued contact....
speak clearly that while she imagines not speaking to the OM will hurt her....make it clear that every contact is that same pain ten-fold.....

And here's the other thing...
you tell her to quit...
she says no
or
does not...
and you MUST be prepared right then and there to act...
other wise you set a precident that your words have no meaning...
that you propose but don't really mean..

when you give an ultimatum.....to someone else that insists they change or stop...you MUST have a plan of actions ready to fly...

or else your word becomes nothing...

ARK^^

I disagree. Plan B should only follow a stellar Plan A.

Her leaving her job is HIS boundary. The marriage is over until that happens.