I am spending quite a bit of time on MB going through threads. Getting back to my orig question for a moment; does anyone know of any good threads that talks about going through plan A when WW has left the house?

My WW is gone and I am not sure how to proceed. I am not sure when she will come back or under what circumstances. This makes it hard to do the Carrot stuff.

I am wondering if I should be sending her text messages (or not doing that). What positive things can/should I consider doing during then next few days while she is thinking through stuff and deciding if she wants to go NC with OM or if she is not willing to do that (or say NC but do it anyways, which sounds like it happens quite a bit). Or should I just wait for her to contact me.

I am not sure if she is with OM or not. She says she is not, but I don't believe. Should I try to verify that now? or is it not worth verifying since she never said she would be without OM. I could verify if she is lying or not I guess [update: i verified that she is where she said she is tonight].

How is your exposure plan going? You are supposed to do it all at once, within a couple hours, if possible, so they have no time to spin a new story that makes you look bad. Gather up all the phone numbers, addresses, contact info and have it all on one piece of paper, and just go down the list.

You might want to write out a little speech, to keep you on track when you call/see these people. If they might, ask for their help in saving your marriage and getting her to stay away from the OM.

Who are you exposing to?

I would be gathering proof, just in case you end up divorcing. Can you afford a PI? Do you have phone records you can print out, texts, etc.?

Plan A, just take care of yourself and the house, talk it up with the families, be a great guy. And find some other things to occupy your time/mind with. You do NOT want to be that guy who sits on the couch next to the phone. You will be more attractive to her if you start exercising, going out with friends, doing sports. The more you look like you can't live without her, the more she likes it. She needs to not like it the way it is.

88,

First off, I'm not here to blow any sunshine at you. You are in a very bad situation and the odds of it turning in your favor are not good at all.

BH and WW scenarios are very different from WH/BW situations and not nearly as salvageable. Once a W goes Wayward, especially to the point of admitting to the A and leaving the marital home, and if there are no children involved ... the best advice is to prepare for divorce. They simply aren't worth the pain and effort.

In the past 15 months, I've learned a lot more about infidelity than I ever cared to know, but two things have stuck out above the rest:

Paraphrasing Dr. Pittman:

"A WW's immediate reaction upon discovery of her A is the greatest predictor of recovery success"

Paraphrasing Dr. Laura:

"American wives have systematically been emasculating their H's, and then using that as a reason to leave them"

The first quote doesn't bode well for your situation, since your WW's immediate reaction was to leave and likely go to OM.

The second quote also seems pertinent in your case, since you effectively enabled her to continue in her A by not enforcing a strong boundary.

BEST ADVICE at this point ... contact the attorney in your area with the reputation as the meanest SOB and hire him before your WW does and proceed to Plan D.

klabshire, it gets confusing when you post your situation in the middle of someone else's thread. I'll start a new one for you.

Trying2live is doing an unbelievably great job. mgolfer did a spectacular job with exposure. Kickme took a while to catch on but I think is getting better. 35andfailed is having a very difficult time understanding and implementing the concepts.

OK, so did I screw up here? I spent hours on this site trying to dissect what everyone was saying and the advice given. I had gone with the advice about giving them "a few days" before enacting the exposure. Thus far it has still been under 48 hours since D day. I did not have a list all ready of people to call before I even had the conversation with her.

I had the conversation. I let her go, i really had no choice did I? Forcing her to stay here, forcing her to agree to something she is not ready to do will only drive her away - that is what i thought and the advice i had read on these message boards. Giving an ultimatum does not work - that is what i read; and i dont think that would work in this case.

Instead I was enacting the first part of a Plan A, once again what I read to do. Confirm it and confront the WW. I did that, step 1. Do all the carrot items. Give a few days, if nothing then go to Exposure. Implement the stick only when she agrees to go NC with the OM.

During the last 48 hours I have tried to be as civil as possible. I have shown her my love, my desire to work on things. Last night she was going to stay at that friends house (one I verified she was actually at) and through texts i was able to get her to come back and spend the night here. I did not trick her or blow smoke up her [censored].

But, as you would probably suspect she is not coming home right after her class tonight. She is going to have a couple beers. Says not planning on seeing OM, but 100% clearly a foggy lie.

So, is the consensus to just said f it and file for D?

I do think she loves me, I do think she is in the fog. I do think she is not sold that we are right together after all our problems, lack of closeness from every regard and drifting apart. I have no idea if it will work out, I like most people feel it is a slim chance. The question is how much is it worth to me to fight for that 5% (or whatever it is) chance.

PS - her first reaction was not to just storm out and run to the OM. I can't really explain how she acted and what she gave off, but she genuinely felt terrible and she said she did not want to hurt me. She has continued to tell me that she does not what to be with anyone else but me. I don't know why she is saying that because it is not true. I am not trying to act like it was hunky dory. It sucked. She left. She says she did not go with OM, i don't believe her. but it was not without feeling and emotion. She is in the fog. There is no way she will ever have a real relationship with OM - I can guarantee that; even if i were to go to plan D myself today.

88

I have verified that there has been contact with OM over the last 24 hours via phone and text. There was a flury of 1 minute calls outgoing to OM right after my last text before she came home and ending right before she got here. texts and phone calls today during breaks at school. Not happy that the contact is there, but i had 0 doubt there would be no contact. I wonder why the flury - there may be problems in fantasy land?

There are definitely problems in fantasy land. I'm just not sure whose - WW's or yours.

Doesn't matter what the contact is about. Doesn't take long to say ILY.

Any contact is bad for you.

I am/was expecting contact. 10 calls in 10 minutes, seems odd to me, maybe OM was just not answering or had his ringer off accidentally? seems more likely then some sort of troubles in paradise.

I agree that i am probably grasping at straws LOL.

I think you all think i am a moron or that i am living on false hope. I feel like I am doing what everyone preaches in the early stages of Plan A.

I think you need to stop giving a second thought to what WW might or might not be saying to OM. It is totally irrelevant to your purpose and nothing but a distraction. What you should be focusing on is your Plan A. No I don't think you're a moron. I've been there and know what it is like. And from that experience, I'm suggesting to give no thought to the content of the calls/messages. It does you more harm than good.

Is there anything I should focus on now outside of planning Exposure? I am assuming she will not break contact with OM, and the next step is Exposure. I am very hesitant to do this (as many seem to be). Please post links to any success stories around Exposure. I need to be persuaded.

Look at my own story. I exposed fast and furiously. I got OM fired and deported. FWW's family reamed her a new one. When OM continued contact from afar, I exposed to his family and friends. Contact dried up immediately.

I did get to see text messages and emails between FWW and OMwhile they were still in contact. Each time they nearly derailed me and pushed me to give up. It is hard to see your WW expresing undying love for OM and not ask yourself what the heck you are even bothering for.

What you have to understand is that everything WW and OM say to each other is still all fantasy.

Don't try to overthink all this. Plan A is pretty simple.

I am really starting to screw up now. I am panicking. no contact since this afternoon. texted a few times (mistake), no reply. resorted to Googling and myspace to try to figure out what the OM's last name is. waste of time, energy and pain but cant stop

I think you are confused. Plan A does not have sequential parts.
Plan A is:
Meet ENs
Avoid LBs

Exposure is not part of Plan A but is done upon discovery of the A.

The "stick" part of Plan A is mentioned frequently on here because many people mistakenly think that Plan A is about "being nice" and "not making WS angry". That is not the case. Plan A is about meeting ENs and avoiding LBs. There is nothing in Plan A about not sticking up for yourself, your integrity, your boundaries, and your expectations.

The carrot and stick are not sequential parts of Plan A.
Plan A is:
Meet ENs
Avoid LBs
The stick part of Plan A is to make sure you don't become a doormat and loose your b4lls while meeting ENs and avoiding LBs. The stick part is done along with the carrot part.

Of course not. But by now you do.

Who have you already exposed to?
Who are you going to expose to?
When are you going to complete the exposure?
Remember, it should be done without warning, all at once.

You are correct. You cannot force someone else to do anything. Attempting to do so would be a selfish demand, one of the Love Busters. You have read about LBs, haven't you? They are half of Plan A.


What are her top ENs?
How have you been meeting them?

It is generally recommended that you make no major decisions (i.e. divorce, separation, legal agreements of any kind) for six months after d-day.

Also see Runnerboy's thread.

88,

One thing is for certain ... BH's who do NOTHING to stop an A wind up in Plan D (or worse, which is remaining in LIMBO HE11) whether they want it or not.

As for the above quote, that is one of the myth's perpetuated around here, and it does not apply to WW's. WW's NEED a wake up call, and I am a firm believer in ULTIMATUMS. They work "IF" you have a WW worth keeping.

If this is an abhoration of her normal character, and she still has love for you ... ULTIMATUMS WORK. IF this is just who she is, or her love for you is already gone, then it doesn't matter anyway, as your M is toast.

FWIW, I still think the best advice is to "Lawyer Up" with the meanest SOB in your area. This can also be a form of "wake up call" that is effective with WW's ... again, "IF" there is anything worth saving.

Your biggest challenge however, is to just do SOMETHING other than just reading and looking for things that will justify your continued INACTION.

Ultimatums only work IF they include consequences that you absolutely are prepared to follow through with.

i.e. IF you see him again, I will file for D.
She sees him again - you HAVE to file for D.


Ultimatums cannot carry a second chance or escape clause.

th,

Thanks for filling in that missing piece from my previous post. You are exactly right ... ultimatums are really just another word for boundaries, and both are worthless unless you are willing to defend them.

Make no mistake, this is serious stuff ... don't throw something out there that you don't mean, but if you want results (rather than remaining in LIMBO HE11), then I am a firm believer in the effectiveness of presenting yourself as a strong BH who will no longer tolerate this level of disrespect.

Draw your line in the dirt and then defend it with everything you've got ... you will KNOW very soon whether you have a WW worthy of your efforts.