(continued)

The other factor that helped enormously was that WH lost his job and therefore was living home with me for almost a year. This was in fact the best thing that ever happened to our marriage. It allowed us to work intensively on restoring our marriage. We went to MC for a year and he continued IC. When our children were in school we spend several hours each day talking and crying and doing fun things together. It was very hard work but necessary. We are in recovery for 20 months now and WH has found another job. Unfortunately it is in another country so that we have a weekend marriage again but thanks to the hard work of last year, we are mostly happy again.

So I would strongly suggest that you find a way to live with your husband for several months at least and get his cooperation in actively working on restoring the marriage. Perhaps his IC can help out?

I wish you good luck and all the best. Please let me know if I can help you further.

Hi Querty,

I had to do a long distant plan A, H moved to another town to care for his dying father. It took me a wee while to get my plan A sorted, wasnt helped by H lying about his top EN's when I got him to fill in the form, but he did fill in the 5 love languages one, and with that and what I knew of him I was able to figure them out.

His top was/is RC. He came to stay 'for the kids' one weekend so I made sure we did a few family actvities, I also did some just me and him ones. I suspected that SF was fairly high so I did something a bit naughtey that resulted in the resumption of SF between us. Up to that point he wouldnt as it was 'disloyal to OW" I made sure I was always well dressed, and well presented when he was around and kept the house tidy and clean, cooked his favourite meals. I stayed with him at FIL's twice,and did those duties there, and I did heap and heaps of Ad. I sent an email every single day, even on the days I hated him. We were in daily phone contact, sent lots of text messages, and IM'ed almost as often. Except, as I say, the days I hated him

I essentially stopped my previous work aholic behavoiur and focused all my attention on him.

Good luck, it can be done, LD does make it harder tho.

RIghtherewaiting,
I am hearing you. Please keep up the advice as my saga continues.

So far I have had two solid days of plan A kind-a stuff at a distance...

Yesterday I told him all was great, "please DO come at x-mas and in fact I will go change your ticket for you at the airport here. No problem."

Today was our anniversary - I called him in the morning and did not mention it. Happy talk only. No mention of anniversary and am SURE he forgot anyway. He is BUSY busy busy working. And all calls are at home at his parents house and believe me he would not be there if he didn't need to work (he keeps an office in their basement).

In the afternoon I sent a nice e-mail wishing him a happy anniversary and telling him he has made me happy the last 7 years of marriage. Also that I would go get the plane ticket tomorrow and maybe on my way home pick up some sexy lingere... hoping to somehow work the EN for sf and at the same time a bit of admiration with him 'making me happy'. It was my best effort and written a lot better than I'm letting on here.

I came home hours later from the beach with my kids to find no response, no call on caller id. Nada. So I'm thinking maybe I went a little overboard with the sexy underwear comment since two days ago I was a whiny, needy idiot. He's never gonna buy the sexy underwear comment... and signed with 'lots of love' to boot.

So at 11pm his time, I called (on his parents land line). - also to make sure he is there I have been calling late every night. He was asleep when I called but we had a nice conversation. No mention of anniversary. Just that I had spent the day at the beach with friends and the kids, bit of car trouble, usual stuff all happy a few little laughs. I wait until he brings up the e-mail and eventually he does. He says, 'I got your e-mail -see, you wrote to me in English and I totally understand. So there's no problem, write to me in English from now on if you want'. No talk of 'sorry this is our anniversary and it sucks'... no apologies... but I didn't expect any. then him - 'are you sure you want me to come?' and me -'yes absolutely no doubt'. Then him 'I'm really confused' and me - yes, I know. Go to sleep. will call you tomorrow'.

So... that is day two of long distance plan A.

Am totally willing to go back there if I have to. It will not be easy but I can see why it's necessary.

Tomorrow I have my psychologist. This is the third appt and I am thinking I will not continue much longer and wait to do MC with WH if and when WH stops seeing OW. don't know.

What I feel I need to do now is get more of the Plan worked out in my head and or on paper. My plan at the moment consists of being nice to WH, no LB's and pushing his EN's. I desperately still need ideas on the en's but I think an e-mail or two per day will be a good start since that is something new and there's no pressure to say something improv and maybe not sincere on the phone. I can think about what to write and get it right. I also know I need to stay off the phone with him when I'm having a bad moment - because that's when I call and let him have it.

Maybe a daily update on my plan for the day or what I did that day in writing on this board will do me some good and keep me from committing LB's. Like going on a diet in public.

Other parts of my plan include me jogging and windsurfing every day, eating extremely healthy and keeping the kids extremely healthy. Getting back into tennis (not done yet) and possibly taking kite surfing lessons - am a little scared of that one but feel it would do me a world of good. I also am really trying to nurture some relationships with girlfriends - which is a challenge after 3 months away and coming back to the island in Sept in total shock - until recently I had not been able to see anyone and felt somewhat friendless here - since nearly 5 months went by where I have had very little contact with anyone here. Many closer friends back in Europe and it has been mostly them to get me through this. I also would like to do something to the house before he comes here at x-mas but don't have much time. With three little kids we have a lot of mess, and not a lot of closet space or organization and this drives WH crazy. But we also live in a place where things run on island time and there is no such thing as home depot or any other shopping - any closet that could get built would be custom designed, expensive and ready some time in 2010. I also need to be saving every cent I have for lawyers and such as I really don't know what will happen.

I suppose part of my plan as well is organizing with a lawyer. I have a friend who is a top, top, top criminal lawyer - and have asked this person to get me a divorce lawyer. So am feeling incredibly good about the quality of the legal assistance I will have because this person will know only the best - but have no doubt that it will also be expensive. If we divorce I will not accept anything less than full custody of the kids. I am scared for money but I always land on my feet. It's the kids I worry about. I could not live without them.

Re-reading this I feel that this plan is somewhat superficial and it only scratches the surface. I need to dig deeper but just am not there yet. I only discovered MB about a week ago and am just now starting to cope a bit better with all that has happened and is happening.

Back to you tomorrow...

Silda,
I saw the first half of your post and was about to send a message asking for more details!
Sounds hard and I bet you will get a lot of people telling you that you're crazy to let him go work in another country after all that happened.

Interesting that you made an appt with his IC. I was wondering as to the ethics of that - because I want to do the same. I would have to call his IC and do the appt over the phone. But I really feel it's necessary so the counselor can see what kind of a fog he is in. I will have to ask WH if it is ok with him and do that.

You are so lucky he didn't work for a year. That is the perfect situation. WH is a workaholic. The near impossibility of us having the actual physical time to work things out is enough to make me want to throw in the towel now rather than prolong the pain.

Thanks for sharing and the advice.

Hi Lildoggie,
Your post is comforting - I need those few responses where it doesn't all seem quite so impossible. (although I am not deluding myself).
couple of questions - where is the 5 love languages form? Also what is Ad?
I am new at all of this still.
Unfortunately for us he is the workaholic - not me - and does not seem willing to stop to save the marriage. It actually feels to me that he wants to work more now that he has in mind that he needs to pay for me and the 3 kids plus a whole new family. I tell you that is what I have in my head.
Your post is making me think I should call even more. I was thinking one e-mail per day. Especially if he doesn't respond. What kinds of things did you text message if I can ask?

Don't know but it does seem that the more I am present and the more he is responding to messages I send, the guiltier towards OW and more he will have to lie to OW... and I like that... does that make sense? I just cannot visualize him shooting off an e-mail to me and then one to her right afterwards... maybe it's mine that won't get responses but they will get read and hopefully cause some form of moral dilemma. assuming he has some morals left...

Thanks again.

One more issue,

When WH comes at X-mas will install spyware on his computer. I have seen mentioned here spectorsoft.com (spectorpro) which costs $99 and looks easily to install. But what I don't know is if it will send me an e-mail since I will need to get the info on MY computer and not be able to log on to HIS computer.

Any suggestions or knowledge of a good software (must be downloadable on-line and available for Mac). Or know if Sepctorpro sends an e-mail summary?

For now there is not much to spy on since he is seeing her... so nothing hidden in that - but have my hopes up that he will go NC one day... and then I'll have to spy.

So, so sad.

thx

Sounds hard and I bet you will get a lot of people telling you that you're crazy to let him go work in another country after all that happened. Actually nobody has declared me crazy yet. Except for my 3 best friends, nobody knows what has happened. I'm not a great advocate for exposure unless it is absolutely necessary. I am very happy that I could keep this hidden, especially towards our children, parents and siblings. Our children cannot have education in their mother tongue anymore so we cannot go back to our home country. We had to find an employer willing to pay for local private schooling in English here. We don't have many options: I have to live close to a suitable school and WH where he has a suitable job. I cannot check or spy on WH when he is abroad. I have no option than to trust him. He is very remorseful so I hope he keeps his promise.

Interesting that you made an appt with his IC. I was wondering as to the ethics of that - because I want to do the same. I would have to call his IC and do the appt over the phone. But I really feel it's necessary so the counselor can see what kind of a fog he is in. I will have to ask WH if it is ok with him and do that.[color:#FF0000] If your husband agrees, I don't see any ethical problems. My WH agreed that I would meet his counselor. It was crucial in our situation. It is important that the IC is on board and believes in marriage and the value of faithfulness. So before you start talking to the IC, I would suggest you ask him/her about his values.

You are so lucky he didn't work for a year. That is the perfect situation. WH is a workaholic. The near impossibility of us having the actual physical time to work things out is enough to make me want to throw in the towel now rather than prolong the pain. I agree that I have been lucky in this respect. Also, that my WH ended up being so disgusted with himself that he cooperated fully after 2-3 months. I think that commitment from your husband to fight for your marriage is essential. He will have to make time to work on it. Only you will know when it is time to throw in the towel. However, when 3 small children are involved, I think that they will always be grateful that you did everything you could to save their family. It may be a long and hard struggle. Success is not guaranteed but it is probably worth trying. [/color]

I wish you all the best.
"Silda"

Hi Querty, just call me Lil.

5LL is a book by Gary Chapman, its a sort of condensed version of Dr Harley's 10 EN's. I read it before I came to MB and it was good for those initial days, but really, MB is superior. I am re-reading it at the moment, mostly because of the section about how people 'receive' love. For instance I show love to my family by acts of service, but Flick shows it by spending time with those he loves. Its good at reminding that he loves me, he just shows it differently.
Ad is the abbriev. for Admiration, Af is affection.

I don't know if you should up the contact. I did because I knew that Flick liked to show love by spending time, so therefore he received love by people spending time with him. I just encorporated the EN's into that time as I could.

I wouldnt make any assupmptions of what WS's are and are not cabable of. I know of 3 that happily bonked both spouse and OP. I know of 2 that sent both love letters. I have memories of some fairly lurid phone chats with Flick while he was still active in his A and telling me he had a future with OW.

WS'S are insane.

ETA: here are some of the thing I sent

I am very thankful for my wonderful husband!!

You gave me a new life and a marriage relationship I never thought possible.

You often put me on a pedestal even though I didn't deserve it.

You always wanted the very best for me and encouraged me in my career choice, even though that meant you had to stay home with the children and care for the house.

You are attractive, and generous.

You are never stingy with your admiration.

You accepted me flaws and all and allowed me the freedom to be myself.

You tolerate my taste in music.

You are a good friend to me, a "safe" place to talk, heard my venting without being defensive.

You are a wonderful lover.

You have been a gift and a blessing to me.

You make the best pancakes I have ever had.

You are forgiving and tolerant.

You are an excellent navigator.

thnak you for learning how to break my back for me.

thank you for defending my right to respect as a mother from the children.

thank you for believing in me when i didnt beleive in myself

thank you for knowing how to fix the computer

thank you for being able to use the chain saw

thank you for mowing the lawns

thank you for knowing how to do *sexual activity*...and being good at it.

Thank you for being yourself

thank you for encouraging me to be more friendly

thank you for cleaning chimney and moving computer

Thank you for letting me hug and kiss you

thank you for introducing me as your wife

thank you for setting up the aerial so i can recieve more radio stations

thank you for putting the mini away, it makes mowing the lawn there easier

thank you for spending time with me.

for weering the i love my wife t shirt, it always made me feel special

for thinking of me when you bought cinnamon mints.

for teaching me about computers.

Q,

I'm glad some others have jumped in to add their experiences. We're all on the same path, but the scenery is somewhat different for each of us. Each of us has something to offer that others don't, and taken together, we create a clearer picture of the dynamics and the solutions for you to apply to your own situation.

I think anyone who's been around these boards a while can see that the MB plan is a sound one, and that there are solid reasons for each part of it. Still, I doubt that any of us has followed it perfectly, either because of circumstances or personal limitations. Yet so many of us have reclaimed our marriages despite distance, mediocre Plan A's, letting our emotions get out of hand on occasion, etc. etc.

Take Silda, for example. Sounds like an impossible situation to me. But she and her WH were given an opportunity to spend a solid year together, after years of being apart (anybody else see the hand of God here?), and she admits that made all the difference. Whether that year can carry them through more years of separation remains to be seen. I wish her the best, and who knows? They may be that one in a million exception. I hope so. But she made it clear that having her H's remorse and cooperation was vital. Many of us don't have that, at least for a long time, and when you couple the typical wayward stance with distance and an ongoing affair, well, it cannot lead anywhere but to disaster.

I still think your best bet is to use the time with your H to show him your best wifely self, without pressure or blowups (that will be hard enough in itself) and then find a way to spend MORE time with him after the holidays. Your family and inlaws may be able to assist, with child care, for example. The longer his A lasts without your presence, the harder it will be to undo the effects.

As for keyloggers, I'm not versed in that area, but others are. If they don't post directly to you, scroll through the topics in the Just Found Out, Recovery and General Questions II forums. Some are labeled in such a way that you can track the info down. I'll go look and will report back exactly where I found them.

A word of caution regarding what you say to WH during Plan A: Since he is emotionally detached from you, try to be pleasant and positve but avoid any relationship talk, including what you are planning sexually. He's seen your anger, your disgust, your pain, and then he hears you say you're planning to seduce him with sexy lingerie. No wonder the guy is confused (and quite likely to see it as manipulation). OK to just show up at bedtime in the sexy outfit, if you choose and the time seems right, but NOT helpful to look like you're desperately plotting to use feminine wiles to control him before he even arrives! Try to see how it might appear to him.

Same thing goes on the "Happy Anniversary" thing. SO painful to know he not only wouldn't remember, but that he wouldn't CARE when you reminded him. Don't do those things to yourself. Understand that he is NOT in relationship to you at this point. Expect NOTHING for now. Understand it is the NORM for our WSs to do these things, and to withhold the things we crave. For now, we must let it be.

Peace,

Right Here Waiting

Maybe I missed it, but has there been any discussion here about exposing the affair?

Hi catperson,

Yes, she has told her family and his family. WH is self-employed, so the avenue of exposing to his management is not available. She has, however, enrolled the help of another one of his employees, who has expressed her disapproval to WH.

RHW

Is there someone else who can be brought into this? These people don't seem to be affecting the A at all. Pastor? Grandparents? Best friend? Cousins?

catperson,

I'm not sure who else is aware, but the real problem is that Q is 4,000 miles away from her WH, with obligations to sort out if she is to physically join him, which we have all agreed is the most important thing she can do.

She's in a tight spot here, but is struggling with the logistics. He will be home for 3 weeks or so at Christmas time, and she is gearing up for a stellar Plan A, showing him all the changes she has already made.

RHW

Q: Sorry to be telling your tale for you, but catperson has much to offer as well, so saving her the time to read through your entire thread. Hope you don't mind.

RHW,

But she made it clear that having her H's remorse and cooperation was vital. Many of us don't have that, at least for a long time, and when you couple the typical wayward stance with distance and an ongoing affair, well, it cannot lead anywhere but to disaster.

This is the current situation - I have long distance, no remorse and ongoing affair... recipe for disaster.


A word of caution regarding what you say to WH during Plan A: Since he is emotionally detached from you, try to be pleasant and positve but avoid any relationship talk, including what you are planning sexually. He's seen your anger, your disgust, your pain, and then he hears you say you're planning to seduce him with sexy lingerie. No wonder the guy is confused (and quite likely to see it as manipulation). OK to just show up at bedtime in the sexy outfit, if you choose and the time seems right, but NOT helpful to look like you're desperately plotting to use feminine wiles to control him before he even arrives! Try to see how it might appear to him

I know - it was one of those moments where I wrote the e-mail, sat with my finger on the send button, re-read it - it sounded so nice... so sent it. But yes... going from whiny to sexy in 48 hours he's gonna figure something strange is going on and truly - yes, I am faking it. No desire to buy sexy underwear for this man right now. My other logic on this is that he is so completely unreasonable right now that probably he will not notice a bit of inconsistency on my end. Anyway, from here on in I am working on his en's and no love busters and will be more consistent. Will wait a bit on the next sexy one but not too long as I do think it's one of his important en's.

I still think your best bet is to use the time with your H to show him your best wifely self, without pressure or blowups (that will be hard enough in itself) and then find a way to spend MORE time with him after the holidays. Your family and inlaws may be able to assist, with child care, for example. The longer his A lasts without your presence, the harder it will be to undo the effects.

I think I can, I think I can, I think I can, I think I can, I think I can, I think I can...

Thanks again RHW

Q: Sorry to be telling your tale for you, but catperson has much to offer as well, so saving her the time to read through your entire thread. Hope you don't mind.

Please do not apologize. You are amazing.

Catperson - Thanks for taking the time to help. I would love your input.

Is there someone else who can be brought into this? These people don't seem to be affecting the A at all. Pastor? Grandparents? Best friend? Cousins?

I could tell his other employee, a young male whom WH respects a lot... don't know how useful but it's someone he works with every day. There are two couples in our city in Europe that we are both close with - could talk with them. One of them is a psychologist (the wife in one of the couples) - close friend of mine and HIGHLY respected by WH.

I am still hoping that his psychologist will help. As I think I stated earlier, he went last week but completely failed to mention the affair to the psych. Yeah, I know - crazy stuff. Also on that end he said he will tell the psychologist next week that he is 'thinking of having a relationship with another woman'.

His second appointment is this Wednesday and I'm just hoping we've got a good psychologist here. He was recommended by a family doctor in whom I have a good deal of trust. So keep your fingers crossed.

I also think, unfortunately, that the odds are about 50/50 he cancels this Wednesday's appt. Just have this suspicion.

Thanks

Hi Lil,
Thanks so much for that list and all info.
I am afraid I will sound fake if I try something of the sort- but maybe if I start slowly and see about his reactions... don't know.

I wouldnt make any assupmptions of what WS's are and are not cabable of. I know of 3 that happily bonked both spouse and OP. I know of 2 that sent both love letters. I have memories of some fairly lurid phone chats with Flick while he was still active in his A and telling me he had a future with OW.

Yuck... I guess since I would not be capable of such a thing I assume others wouldn't either. But just my own fog I guess.

More on the situation:

Today I have my 3rd appt with my psychologist and he warned me to assume EVERYTHING WH is doing and has ever done is all lies. I said how can he have an affair when he is working all the time at his parents house... psych told me no worries... WH's find the time for the affair. Assume lies, lies and more lies.

Psych is pretty much on board with MB principles... I told him i'm going to be nice to WH and he said, no, no, no -not nice. You are going to be respectful, no demands, no anger, true to yourself and yourself is a wonderful human being, etc... lot of MB stuff. But he believes I must not move to Europe to be with WH and in the end WH would need to come back to me because WH needs to show he is willing to rebuild -the burden should not be on me. I listen, feel conflicted as I have a few different points of view and want to consider all. I do not think psych's advice precludes me going there in the short term.

I just changed his plane ticket home for December 16th. He will not be able to return any sooner than January 8th - so we have a minimum of 3 weeks. I can probably get to Europe myself after that. Will try to make today's e-mail about the plane ticket (even though I already phoned him to tell him it's purchased) and say some positive things about that.

After talking with the psych, I am always wound up and I tend to react negatively to WH - so I called him about the ticket and told him I was going out and couldn't talk - got off the phone quickly and with a smile. If tonight I am ok to talk I will call but do not want to call when in an after psych appt rut.

Current plan is to delve deeper into his and my en's. (psych wants me to work on my own needs and he is right).

Thanks again

For my own peace of mind - I am going to try to keep up with daily updates on how my plan A is going.

Yesterday was day 3 of long distance plan A. Had my psych appt in the AM which always gets me riled up (never a good idea to call after the appt). So called him before the appt to say good morning. Also to ask a couple of details regarding the plane ticket that I would go change later on.

After the appt and purchasing the ticket, briefly call him to tell him I bought it. Tell him I can't talk now because out the door. (but real reason is I would have wrecked plan A).

Took care of myself - went jogging, read books to the kids, did a few work related things, etc. Made 3 good meals for the kids and I, grocery shopped, got my car repaired. Profusely thanked the babysitter (who is also my friend) for being here and being awesome.

Called WH in the pm (at 11pm his time) at his parents house. The psych told me NOT to do this because checking in on someone who is flagrantly seeing OW will only make me feel worse when I don't find WH at home. But anyway, that is when I've been calling him.

Told him about my psych appt. He asked if it's helping me. I said definitely yes.
He asked what psych thinks. I said that psych is mostly interested in helping ME - not really in repairing the relationship because it is psych's opinion that as long as WH is seeing OW, there is no repairing anything. So I told WH we are working on ME, getting me to move forward whether we stay together or not. Psych wants to know my needs, etc. Psych thinks that I have some PTSD. I told WH that psych said that I should consider that anything WH says to me is a huge lie and that psych said that even if WH says he's not sleeping with OW, just forget it because he is. Psych sad that although it really appears WH is working 24/7, just forget it because they always find time to see OW. WH took all of this really calmly - did not deny anything - Maybe because the way I said it all, there were no accusations, no anger. Even a smile on my face while spoke - which WH could hear on his end of the telephone.

OK and since we were on the topic of the relationship and WH seemed to want to talk about it, I gave my speech again about how OW is a drug and how (any) WH will do anything to get his fix. A text message gives a warm fuzzy, any contact at all gives a warm fuzzy or fix of his drug. Speech included fact that WH is not the only one to think he's found his soulmate... there's about a zillion other WS's out there who have found theirs too and pretty much none are happy. Speech included also that 3% of affairs lead to marriage (and usually only those that start years earlier) and that of those 75% end in Divorce within 5 yrs. Speech included fact that while most affairs do not lead to marriage, the all lead to unhappiness and many lead to divorce and suicide. So you are throwing away ANY possibility of happiness to get your fix for the next 6 months... Anyway, he has heard it all before (the 3% and 75% thing is new because I just read that... don't know if it's true but it is a great stat to use on a foggy WH). I also said that I want HIM to be happy and this is not the road to happiness. That part was thrown in there about 5 times throughout the speech.

Again, all of above was without anger - which is a first for me. Usually the speech includes a few accusations about him thinking he's found his f...ing soulmate...
So that part of the speech has been discarded.

WH DID bring up my stupid sexy underwear comment which came two days after me being all mopey - 'what was that about sexy underwear - the other day you hated me - now you want to buy sexy underwear for me-?" uh... yeah.. that. haha. I wasn't prepared to answer. So then he says, well, you're having ups and downs. I said, 'no. I am fine now, really much better'.... and that was that.

He said he is glad 'we' are not angry with him anymore and are being rational and he is happy to see I am so interested in working things out. He asked me if it is hard to be so nice. Um... yeah, hello? But I said, yes, it is hard but it is something so important to me and I am working on this 24 hours per day.

When we hung up I sent him an e-mail saying how nice it was talking with him just now and wishing him a good night.

That was day 3....

Q,

Good job on eliminating the anger when you spoke to your WH, but don't you wonder what was really going through your WH's mind as you were spouting facts and philosophy about adultery and its outcomes? If you'd actually taught him something obvious, he would've immediately said, "Yes, you're right, and I'm coming home right now and ending my foolish ways." Lecturing him violated one of the MB principles: DO NOT try to "educate" your spouse.

It rarely makes an impact, except to make him think you're pointing out your superiority to him. YOU know all the things HE doesn't, and YOU can plainly see what he is too stupid to know: that he is making a mistake.

Nevermind that you are objectively RIGHT, it is disrespectful, and he will likely run back to OW who will ADMIRE him instead. No one likes to be lectured and in this case it is particularly contraindicated. Please don't do that again. It won't help your cause at all.

With luck, you haven't pushed him more firmly toward OW. Still have a three-week period coming up to work your Plan A. But NO educating him, no matter how tempting!

Right Here Waiting

Very good job! I wish I could be like that! Keep it up, and he'll start comparing you and seeing how much...more you are than OW.

Sure, it's disrespectful lecturing him, but I see you were careful to make it more about what you are learning than what he is doing wrong. He can't expect you just to be happy about what he's doing. If you can discuss this rationally, and show that you're studying up on the subject, it tells him that you're not giving up, but you're done yelling at him. If you pretended you were peachy keen on the situation, he would have known you were lying.

I would not be repeating any of it any more, but I think it's ok to be true to yourself.