Flick knew and understood plan B before I went into it, in fact I had given him a copy of the letter just before, and he took my copy of SAA to England when he went.

DOn't worry about the comment about you needing to change, he has already seen your willingness to make the changes you need to, he's just putting a dig in, hoping you'll get to hear about it. Its hard but try not to talk about him with the kids. Yes I do know that is alot harder than it sounds

Your doing great, and honestly, when I was in PB, I preferred the angry days to the sad ones...

T2L, hang in there! You inspire me as I look towards my own Plan B.
I totally get how confused you are that he could go without the kids for any length of time! I had no kids one night this week (just at home -- not gone for business) and I about lost it!
I think our kids know when we feel that strongly for them, even tho WS's get to show up and have the fun -- and then go.
Keep it up -- you are an inspiration! I'll bet your daughter is so proud of you, too -- she sounds amazingly strong!
My 12 year old is totally struggling with spending anytime with WH and is very angry with him. Do you or your daughter have any advice for a very pissed, very bright 12 year-old (betrayed daughter?)
Take care!
BestFriend439

I'm sure your intermediary team will box his ears for using a 17 yr old child to deliver a poison contemptible message and that at the rate he's going he's going to be enjoying turkey raman for thanksgiving, deservedly so.

In the mean time, sharpen up. You need to gently tell your daughter you're sorry she was used by her father this way. That she doesn't have to deliver any more messages for him - he has to use the intermediary for that kind of trash!

BF439,
Awe that's very sweet of you, but I don't feel like an inspiration I feel like my mentors and those who help me here are inspirations truly!My DD17 is quite strong, and truly I could not force anything on her. They kinda go through the natural time of things. I tried to get her to counseling and that made things worse as she felt she was not crazy so I let her work things out in her time. The 1st month we all cut him off as he was nuts!

Then we talked to him about the 3-4 month and cut off again and the 4-5month and then began Plan A Oct 3 which was beginning of Plan A. In fact ya'll tomorrow is 7 months since my life changed and I found out. I never even saw my self making it this far. But here I am. Not sure I am playing with a full deck, LOL, but none the less I am relatively ok and I have my babies and the whole world could pass away and all I need is them.

At the start of this and even sometimes now, DS10 says thank you mom for not going crazy and leaving us. I say nothing can ever tear me away from you DS10 they would have to kill me and thats not gonna happen so don't worry I will be here for you. And I think that its really really important to remind them a few times that this is not their fault because children have a tendency to blame themselves and that's even if you remind them, so I would mention it every so often. You'll know if DD12 seems like she needs more help(counseling) your her mom and no one knows better than you. But ya know what time is the best thing for the kids-maybe not for us but ya know the saying time heals all things? Well its especially true for kids, on top of the fact that kids are 10 times more forgiving than adults and I think at some point she'll get there. I would tell my son that dad loves you and he would question yeah right mom how could he when he left me. I would say son this is not your fault and dad didn't leave you he left me, this is a mom and dad problem not a DS10 and dad problem. Then I would explain to DS10 how DS10 does things like disobey mom but he would still love me and how its possible to do things that are bad and hurtful to mom but he still loved me and then related that to dad. I think it helped. Time, is the best advice for DD12.

DD17 is strong so full of wisdom,but since she has always been a lil bit of a rebel I taught her the proverbs in the bible which actually impart wisdom to them, BUT I taught her the proverbs but In terms where she didn't feel like I was teaching her the bible. Like I would say what you do comes back to you, then when she was about 16 I explained what I meant was sewing and reaping. But truly the stuff that comes out of her mouth at 17 cracks me up, out of the mouth of babes God uses the foolish things of the world to confound the wise...hilarious.

So your going to Plan B sometime soon sounds like. Well I think the thing that drove it home for me and might help you is remember that Plan A should not be looked at as a lifestyle. These WS's think were gonna do this forever. Well sorry but I am not going to live like this. Its for a purpose and time. Plan A strong so when you go to B you actually can take comfort when, days like this for me ya wanna go crazy, you can remind yourself you did everything possible to make a go at this and it comforts you while in Plan B if there is any comfort, but I know that time is going to help me too. Hope something i just rambled about was of some help. Thanks for popping in......

Kayla
Well I was kinda hoping they would run out of turkey ramen so he would have to eat chili or shrimp ramen for Thanksgiving..LOLOLOLOL....yeah I did tell DD17 hey I'm really sorry that you have been put in the middle of this you are still a kid just a bit and you shouldn't be hearing this stuff. I don't want you to have the stress.

I'm not sure if the IM's will say anything to him, kinda hope not cuz I really want him to eventually use them and it may push him away. He looks at it as in his words as his wife acting like his mother and its very unattractive, so if a correction is sent about his conversations with DD17 it will only back fire, IMHO. I think the best bet is to act as if I didn't even hear it cuz I'm in Plan B. He'll get even madder if he gets no response cuz he always expects a response from me or an apology and he's getting nothing not even from DD17 comments. No response ha haha ah ah ahaha ha ha ha....No response how ya like them apples! I keep the IM's communications simple, visitation with DS10. I figure maybe this lil part of IM'ing he may take then I can move to other things but for now I just want him to get contact about DS10.

But DD17 and H have always been really close in fact and would always talk about everything under the sun every night at bedtime, sometimes even poke fun at me. But great thing now is DD17 see's why H would poke fun at me.

I just told her to try not to listen to him when he says these things.

I don't know if he'll ever use the IM's but I keep sending the visitation availability for DS10 with no expectation of an answer cuz i know what he said to my friend who was the 1st IM so I can only imagine what the gurls heard...LOLOL. Yikes glad I'm not you guys.

Right now I am going to expect him to be angry and be glad since apparently this is good and better than indifference.

And as my Lil darling doggie says anger is better than the sad days. I hate the sad days. I'd rather have the anger it keeps me more determined to give strong Plan B.

I have not seen or talked to him in 7 whole days, not a text, not a phone cal and not email. Whooo Hooo...I guess....LOL

You are doing fine. Just keep remembering not to have contact so you protect your heart. Let the kids know that you don't want to hear anything about hubby. Hard, but necessary.

Once he realizes that you are going to stick to your plan, it should get easier.

And remember your garden - you have planted and water the seeds, now trust that it will grow.

Your DD is a big Achilles heel in this thing. We're going to have to do some brainstorming on that. I'll get back to you when I think of something.

Glad you got to go to the game, and your kids got a visit, lame and disrespectful as it was to you.

And no, we won't box his ears, tempting though it might be.

We are not boxing any ears - we are unemotional and strictly business
Pep

Mere filters, not cranial clobberers.

the emotional current flows one way only - and it is NOT flowing from your ever-ready most serene mediators

All hail the mediators

Ok ya'll, so update for all ya readers.

Apparently H is being resistant(an absolute rage filled idiot) oh sorry i forgot to turn off my translator..LOLOL.

My IM's have told me nothing but I do know my H as I have been with him since I was 14 so truly I know him better than he knows himself. So he's doesn't want email so I am trying to come up with a visitation schedule for DS10 that is set in stone so that it may be postal mailed to him by the IM's.

Man it's really hard to not doubt yourself and feel like your making things worse by the mediators. {{{{Sigh}}}} I mean I guess how much worse can it get right he lives with OW. LOL. But none the less I feel like I am probably pissing him off to no end and sealing my doom or chance of reconciling by pushing the IM's.

I know him he's a very private person about his business, so I know he probably feels I am violating his privacy by having people contact him about the kids. I mean I really need to pass more information (finances etc) but there is no way I feel I can do it. Is there anyone out there or knows someone who was in Plan B and their spouse was a angry jerk but they still reconciled?

Ok just got back from church and I'm gonna go take a quick nap since the kids ran to the park with the dogs....I need to rest my brain....Gonna work on the schedule guys after the nap....

Hi T2L

Having people whom your WH has never met does protect his privacy in a way. They aren't in his circle of friends, they aren't from his workplace, and they aren't family. He, OTOH, has violated the sanctity of your M and the very foundation of your family by having his A and moving in with the OW.

This is a boundary that you have put in place to protect the love you have for him from evaporating completely. You have "given" him what he wanted-the OW to meet all his needs. He is finding out just how much this choice will cost him if he continues in his A.

He is simply acting like a petulant teenager who has been told that he doesn't get privileges if he doesn't own up to his responsibilities and is basically throwing a hissy fit.

Hopefully he will become a grown-up again soon and figure it out.

Hang in there-for the sake of your family and the love you still have for him.

Johnstwin is exactly right. HE WANTS MORE CAKE AND HE WANTS IT NOW!!!!!!!!!!!

You have given him his freedom, won't be meddling in his life and he can do his own thing. Let him reap the consequences of his choices.

I think that is in the bible somewhere.............

:happythanksgiving:

I would also like to point out that you first tried mediators that you both know and could trust.

He opted out of that, and you had to pick someone stronger because of his bullying. He didn't know the new IM's...oh well, he created that problem entirely. It's not on you at all. He didn't appreciate how good he had it before, and now he's stuck with da Pepster.

Day 8 done, I made it. I feel okay. Feeling a bit stronger today. Actually starting to feel like even if he did come home that if he doesn't agree to my conditions that its now my choice, and my choice is buh-bye LOLOLOL.

I've already lost the marriage to the affair so why in the heck should I settle at this point. Either he wants it or doesn't. Each day just a teeny tiny bit of fear leaves and its good because for 20 years I had nightmares that he would cheat on me, he knew about them and for 20 years I tried everything in my power to be a good wife(yes I needed fine tuning and SAA has helped me) but I'm done with that. Yes I miss him and really really want my marriage back. We had many many good times. This man, I do not know, parts of him I have experienced from time to time but that's not the person I knew. HE used to have integrity, whit and humor, he made me and the kids feel safe, he was a good man for the most part-except for his moodiness(really i think depression not sure) that kicked in a few days a week.

My 19 year anniversary is in 16 days, so instead of crying I sent an email to about 10 girls inviting them to go have sushi and celebrate it with me. I am not hanging out here that night to cry! I'm gonna go have fun! Think I will have someone drive so I can have and extra glass of wine!

Anyways on to week 2 ya'll.....{{{hugs to everyone}}}

Dang I wish I lived closer to you, party!!!!!!!



ETA" your still on the roller coaster, but this side of PB is great!

Have a Tako for me, stay out of the Saki...

I am watching (reading) you go through new emotions.
Welcome them. Learn from them.

The book that saved my life is called "The Dance of Anger". It has been around about 20++ years, and it shows you how your anger, tho normal and an natural indication to you that something is wrong--anger can also be a strong poison (if not acknowledged and handled right)
I think it may help you too.

And it would be a great book for D17. Very positive.

Just dropping in to say I'm alive! I am doing fine. Had to come up with the visitation for DS10 so the IM's could postal mail it to him.

Otherwise I feel fine and determined. Everyone here is so awesome, helps keep me focused and calm.

I really feel like now if he ever does get it and come back then I truly have the choice that the power is no longer with him, which it has been for very long but I never saw it that was as he called me controlling.

I am getting more comfortable with the fact that H is probably really mad, although no one has told me, I know him. I guess right now maybe he needs to be angry, maybe it'll knock some sense in his head. I am really glad he is going to be alone during the holidays too, nice time to think(suffer)LOL so he can see what life is gonna be like if he don't get his crap together.

Anyways I'm doing well for today. Gearing up for Thanksgiving..... :happythanksgiving: