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None of these things made me do the things I've done (before and including my A.) Those bad choices were mine, and they WERE choices.
But if any of these things could stand in the way of, or become a focus of, drgnfly and I getting your aid, then I'll throw them out there. Apparently they will stand in the way of. My only reasoning (as I see it) for posting any of that was simply to show that I have a history of lying and manipulating people to protect myself. Cowardice, I know. And it needs to change, I know. But if I'm to open up (to drgnfly and anybody who offers assistance) I think it important for people to know that's who I've been. Call it an anti-manipulation technique. Perhaps its redundant and implied because I'm a WS. I am well aware that the A was my choice and not a product of my history. If that history is getting in the way of you becoming the person you should be, go see an IC. Nobody here is qualified AFAIK to psychoanalyze you and nobody really cares. All I see is someone whining and making excuses and trying to garner sympathy. Many of us have been here for a while. We have seen you come and go time and time again. You are no different than any other cheater posting here. Why is it that all "unique" people are all alike? Some day if you stay around long enough you will be able to look back on this and see what we can all see so clearly. Right now you can't. Any or all of us will be more than happy to try to help you but you have to take that first step. And that first step is admitting that, at this point in your life, you are a loser. So what is your plan to pick yourself up, dust yourself off and start this journey you say you want? What is your plan to convince drgnfly to stay in the M? I don't know your financial status but would you be willing to take a lie detector test every month or two? What do you think you need to do to reestablish trust? What can you do to protect drgnfly's feelings?
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Skald,
Your rational thinking is in a HUGE battle with the irrational. Listen to the rational. Anytime you crave a fix (contact) redirect your thinking to something more healthy. Shut off the computer, turn off the phone and put it where you can't get it, go for a walk, picture the look on Drgnfly's face when you told her about the latest contact. That look should be embedded in your brain by now. Look in her eyes, see the pain all the way to her core and envision it any time you think it's OK to break NC.
Like I said in an early post, I bet the fix made you feel like crap afterward. Am I right?
LC
Last edited by lifeschoice; 12/03/08 07:56 AM. Reason: typo
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Originally Posted By: skald911
I'm willing to do whatever she asks me to.
Are you really? She ASKED you to eliminate OW from your life... and STILL you called her "maybe 4 times" last week!
Not seein' the money where the mouth is.
Tlll your words match your actions, I'd advise drgnfly not to let you anywhere near her heart.
Right Here Waiting
Me BS 61
Him FWS 63
Married 40 years
D-Day 6/30/06
Still can't believe it.
6/08 Recovering nicely. Anything is possible!
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So far I'm writing a NC letter which will be sent tomorrow. I've opened my cell phone records to her, and gave her my cell phone. She already had my login information to any email addresses I have. I'm opening everything to her scrutiny.
I'm asking for help. Are you willing to post your NC letter here for us to help you to edit and give feedback??? I hope you will! A NC letter needs to also be read and approved and mailed by your wife!
Recovery began 10/07;
Meeting my wife's EN's is my "thank you" that refuses to be silenced.
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It would behoove you to LEAD this recovery...Not just sit there waiting for your wife to tell you what to do...
Remember that feelings follow actions...When you begin to do good, you will feel good...
Volunteer for things like a keylogger on your computer, a GPS on your car, a polygraph [you set all that up yourself]...
...YOU call and make an appointment with one of the Harleys...As I said, LEAD...and if you are a praying man, spend time on your knees with God and ask that He guide you through this...
Mrs. W Go back and re-read this post. Mrs. W gave you some great insight and ACTION steps that will speak much louder than words.
Recovery began 10/07;
Meeting my wife's EN's is my "thank you" that refuses to be silenced.
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I'm willing to do whatever she asks me to. Please. There is zero sincerity in those words right now. You couldn't even go a few days without NC. Let me ask you since you like to blame how messed up you are on your history, how do you think your BW feels at this very moment? Give me a description.
BW - me
exWH - serial cheater
2 awesome kids
Divorced 12/2011
Many a good man has failed because he had a wishbone where his backbone should have been.
We gain strength, and courage, and confidence by each experience in which we really stop to look fear in the face... we must do that which we think we cannot.
--------Eleanor Roosevelt
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severely emotionally repressed
manipulate
lie
hide things to protect myself
charismatic
Intelligent
stubborn
Is this your resume?
What in this list makes you husband material?
You better come up with a different list - and do it fast.
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Why did you call her?
Why did you (again) choose OW over your wife?
Why did you hand over the power in your marriage to OW?
Why did you disrespect your wife that way?
Do you have any idea how disrespectful and degrading it is for you to constantly choose OW over dragonfly???
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I just wanted to tell you that I am hopeful for your marriage. Coming here and posting is scary for a WS, I'm sure. My FWS did it a little more than a year ago. He is tst.
He had hurt me to such depths I thought my heart could never recover. He said words that shredded my soul and were pure lies about our marriage and our beautiful 23-year history together. He left our home (me and our 5 children) two different times last summer, and made it clear to me that he did not want to be married to me.
When he came home last fall, he took every step he could think of and every step suggested here to help my heart heal. He knew that he was responsible for the great suffering that I and our children had endured, and he made it his goal to heal us all...no matter what I chose about our marriage.
That's the key to becoming a man of integrity, Skald...HELP YOUR WIFE HEAL...no matter what she chooses to do with the marriage. It is the right thing for you to do. She has every right to be done with you. You can turn that around by CHOOSING everyday to love her, to put her first, to repair to the very best of your ability the damage she has suffered.
Please listen to the people here. tst and others on your thread are FWS's who have returned to their marriages and have rebuilt something beautiful. You can, too. Do what they say. Come here and talk to them OFTEN. They will help you through the difficult times, the painful times, the scary times.
You CAN have a great marriage that fulfills you both.
Happily married to HerPapaBear
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You cannot go back and undo breaking NC, just like you cannot go back and undo the affair and all the destruction it has caused.
All you can do today is turn your eyes forward and decide to be something better than that man.
Our past does not make us who we are and does not bind us in chains. I can choose today to lie and be a liar. I can chose today to be honest. I can choose today to be selfish or I can choose today to be generous. It really is that simple.
It's all about choices. Who are you choosing to be, Skald? Do you choose to be an adulterer...a cheater, a liar, a deceiver? Do you choose to be a faithful husband, committed father, worthy man? Those are two completely different people ONLY because of the choices they make.
Start over today and decide who you are going to be. Then take the ACTIONS to be that person.
Happily married to HerPapaBear
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FWH - My story (posted in small parts) More like WH - My story (and why I am still a wayward)I'm willing to do whatever she asks me to. I am not your wife, but I bet the most basic thing she would ask, and already asked is Step oneNO CONTACT WITH THE OTHER WOMAN!! And I'm open to any suggestions from the members here as well. Study these http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special_relativityhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_dilationhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SpacetimeBuild this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DeLorean_time_machineFix the whole problem before it starts!! Cant do that, go back and re read step one. Here is the most honest, heartfelt advice I can give you. END YOUR AFFAIR!!! DO NOT CONTACT, OR ALLOW TO BE CONTACTED BY, THE OTHER WOMAN!
Me 34
WW 30
Abandoned Feb 17th 08, D-Day Aprl 27th 08.
Returned home Jul 7th, OC born 12/30/08
The FOG is clear, and we are in recovery.
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Our NC letter:
"I'm writing this letter to you to terminate our relationship. What we did was selfish and wrong. I wish I could go back and erase it all. I realize now that our whole relationship was an illusion based on lies that we made to ourselves and to each other. My marriage with drgnfly is real and I can't believe I hurt the only woman I've ever loved. She and DD are everything to me and I am 100% committed to making my marriage work and making it better than ever before. My wife deserves the best and I want to be that for her.
I am issuing this letter to state that there will be NO CONTACT for the rest of my life. To enforce this I have deleted all my personal emails, permanently blocked you on my work email, asked my co-workers to screen the calls coming in and so on. I do NOT want to see or talk to you EVER again."
Any suggestions or advice for changes?
We were thinking it would be better for skald to hand-write this so she is certain that he sent the letter and not me. What do you think? Is it good or bad to be more personal like that? Drgnfly and I worked on this together. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
"Battle not with monsters, lest ye become a monster, and if you gaze into the abyss, the abyss gazes also into you." - Freidrich Nietzsche
Living Happily Ever After with Drgnfly
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Sounds good. Have your wife send it.
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Our NC letter:
"I'm writing this letter to you to terminate our relationship. What we did was selfish and wrong. I wish I could go back and erase it all. I realize now that our whole relationship was an illusion based on lies that we made to ourselves and to each other. My marriage with drgnfly is real and I can't believe I hurt the only woman I've ever loved. She and DD are everything to me and I am 100% committed to making my marriage work and making it better than ever before. My wife deserves the best and I want to be that for her.
I am issuing this letter to state that there will be NO CONTACT for the rest of my life. To enforce this I have deleted all my personal emails, permanently blocked you on my work email, asked my co-workers to screen the calls coming in and so on. I do NOT want to see or talk to you EVER again."
Any suggestions or advice for changes?
We were thinking it would be better for skald to hand-write this so she is certain that he sent the letter and not me. What do you think? Is it good or bad to be more personal like that? Drgnfly and I worked on this together. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Dr. Harley suggests something along these lines: [from SAA, pg 58] OW, I want you to know that out of respect and love for my wife and children, I have come to realize that I must never see or talk to you again. My relationship with you was a cruel indulgence that Drgnfly did not deserve. While I cannot completely repay Drgnfly for the pain I caused her, I will do my best to become the husband she has been missing. I care a great deal for my family and I would not want to do anything to risk their happiness. I will not make any further contact with you and I do not want you to make any contact with me. Please respect my desire to end our relationship.However, I do like the bulk of your letter.
Recovery began 10/07;
Meeting my wife's EN's is my "thank you" that refuses to be silenced.
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Your NC letter needs to be handwritten and the envelope needs addressed by you. Make sure your wife is the one that mails this.
Recovery began 10/07;
Meeting my wife's EN's is my "thank you" that refuses to be silenced.
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Our NC letter:
"I'm writing this letter to you to end our adulterous relationship forever . What we did was selfish and wrong. I wish I could go back and erase it all. I realize now that our whole relationship was an illusion based on lies that we made to ourselves and to each other. My marriage with drgnfly is real and I can't believe I hurt the only woman I've ever loved. She and DD are everything to me and I am 100% committed to making my marriage work and making it better than ever before. My wife deserves the best and I want to be that for her.
I am sending this letter to make clear that there will be NO CONTACT with you for the rest of my life. To enforce this I have deleted all my personal emails, permanently blocked you on my work email, asked my co-workers to screen the calls coming in and so on. I do NOT want to see or talk to you EVER again." I think this letter is great! Did you write this mostly yourself? I ask because if you did, it's a great start at helping Drgnfly to begin some healing. I noted in red a few minor changes I suggest. To enforce this I have deleted all my personal emails, permanently blocked you on my work email, asked my co-workers to screen the calls coming in and so on. I don't know if I would include this. I think it has more impact when the OW tries to call the cell and finds the number has been changed. If OW tries the cell and can't get through, then tries the email and it bounces and tries the work number and is screened out, I think it has more impact on HER that NC is in place and you are serious about it.
Happily married to HerPapaBear
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Stay the course Skald - if you find yourself getting antsy and anxious- come onto MB and ask questions. Especially seek out TST - he's been a blessing to many men in your shoes.
We really do want your marriage to be a success -
Blessings upon your marriage
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The NC letter is written and will be put in the mail tomorrow!
Thank you all - your words are a great help right now.
I haven't had an opportunity to search through the site tonight - could somebody please point me in the right direction to as much information as possible about this fog?
"Battle not with monsters, lest ye become a monster, and if you gaze into the abyss, the abyss gazes also into you." - Freidrich Nietzsche
Living Happily Ever After with Drgnfly
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The NC letter is written and will be put in the mail tomorrow!
Thank you all - your words are a great help right now.
I haven't had an opportunity to search through the site tonight - could somebody please point me in the right direction to as much information as possible about this fog? No post office nearby? You could drop it in the mail tonight. Charlotte
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It's 1:30AM and drgnfly is going to drop it in the mail on her way to work tomorrow. It's in her hands as I type this.
"Battle not with monsters, lest ye become a monster, and if you gaze into the abyss, the abyss gazes also into you." - Freidrich Nietzsche
Living Happily Ever After with Drgnfly
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