I take my chocolate-holding responsibilities very seriously.


erp

Ok ya'll computer problems resolved...off to church back later....

I thought we had the good stuff, but now I wonder if we did. I always thought our love was special, ya know having been together since 8th grade and all. Guess we all think "our" love is special huh? We used to laugh so hard the next day we would call each other and start laughing all over again.

Funny thing about exactly 1 year before I sat on his chest and said are you happy? He responded of course I am happy I wouldn't be here, why? And I said well just want to be sure I'm doing all I can(Pre-SAA didn't even know about the principles of the book). But of course he rewrote the marital history and told mutual friends he hadn't been happy for many years.

I don't know what to think anymore. Did we have the good stuff or not. I mean may have thought it was the good stuff but since he's a major pessimist he may saw it differently. I don't even know if it's only that he was a pessimist, but that I think internally he had more going on than I thought. He had a nightmare childhood, as did I, but I think it did more on him than he thought but he doesn't believe in counseling or therapy so truly he never worked through his childhood issues and never really learned to love himself, where I did. As the saying goes you can only love others to the degree that you have self love and acceptance.

Now being in Plan B for 18 days I wonder if I could even forgive him and be able to go into recovery. I struggle with hating him immensely and still clinging to tiny bits of hope and love that I have left. IDK guess you don't have to be in Plan B to have that tho LOL.

Otherwise dark Plan B day, all is going as planned.

Back later to catch up, computer issues resolved...

I think I may have worded it wrong.

Let me put it this way, do you KNOW that your husband is BETTER (inside better) than he is behaving right now?

Do you know that because there was a time when he was the person you know he CAN be - or have there always been some "ifs" in your mind?

I'm wondering this - I've been here for a long while. I've seen people recover their marriages and people grow into these wonderful humans that just happen to NOT be married anymore.

I know Neak knew her fwh was better, and I feel that Pep "knew" Mr. Pep was better than he was behaving...do you "know" this about Mr. T2L?

I'm trying to get a grasp of the kind of person the Mr. is.

It really sounds like he WAS a good person - and maybe is mourning his fall from what he held dear. I know for the Wookie even ADMITTING that was one of the roadblocks in our recovery. From what you've told me, the Mr. sounds like he is cut from similar weft and weave.

Praying now for your Mr. to find the real him again.

All my love,
Kimmy

T2L, glad you are back, full-throttle. I check your posts every day and they really help me!
I think sometimes we hope so much that cutting ourselves off from WH in Plan B will kick things into gear and they will come back. I think one poster said that they were in Plan B for only 16 days -- I thought "great, the nightmare will be over soon!" But, it might not.
We had the good stuff, too. My WH was a good man, and I'd like to think that he's still there deep inside, just as you do, but I am starting to get that our work during Plan B is not just fighting the urge to contact them, but to do "our work -- and not in relation to spouse." I don't know about you T2L, but I've been with WH so long, I'm not sure where to start unless its in relation to him.
So on the one hand our actions are to save our marriage, but on the other hand we have to let go of our well-known role as wife to do so. It has me feeling a little lost, but also thinking a lot about who I am regardless of who is in my life.
I really envy those of you with a clear-cut faith, because you always have in your mind (perhaps) the role God has for you. For those of us who struggle with that part of ourselves too it seems to be harder...
BF439

BF439,
Yeah I think it was Lildoggies H that came back after 16 days. I knew my H would not deep down inside. He is very stubborn, and after going thru Thanksgiving I see that the holidays mean nothing being away from the family. I have set a mini goal of trying to keep going in 6 month increments as its more attainable. April 23rd was D-day. I hope to God I can make it to that date. I truly struggle between hating his with a burning passion(which i haven't dealt with til now) and sorrow. Honestly after Thanksgiving I have cried at least 4 days. Mostly in the shower and when the kids can't see, don't think its fair for them to see it.

My 19 year anniversary is coming up on Tuesday, I am dreading it, but have planned lil girl night out and so far about 8 girls are going with me. Gonna try to have a good time, but no it'll probably be impossible to not think about it a little.

Yeah I have been with H since we were 14 years old, so I understand. It's hard to see a different future that the one you saw in your head of growing old with H.

How are you doing emotionally? Is Plan B hard for you?

It sounds like our WH's actions towards some permanent life away from us makes it much harder to picture R. Yours staying with OW and mine in his new bachelor pad. Knowing my WH, I imagine that the longer he goes, the more he can add weight to his argument that it wasn't the affair, especially if OW doesn't want him anymore. The sick thing is, I think he would try to find anyone else ASAP for the "experience" and then to say, "see, I'm dating, I don't love BS."
Anyway, for the most part Plan B is good. There is something to look forward to everyday with my kids and I don't have to deal with him, except when he picks them up. Last night was hard for some reason; he had the two youngest for an overnight, and I just cried and cried in bed. My anxiety started to creep up and I thought "he's going to take my kids!" But I talked myself down enough to sleep.
I relate to how you feel about him (and her?) I just hate them both some days so much its all I can do to not go to her job and blast her or scream at him for all he's done. But I know that won't get me anywhere. I try to picture who do I want to be in this process and I think, "the classy woman, who, though betrayed, came out of this the stonger one that her kids love and respect."
My WH looks stronger because he doesn't show feelings and I struggle with that, but I can't beleive that someone who cheats and lies and leaves is strong at all. That's been his twist to this that he's strong now because he knows what he wants and is going for it and know we will all be better in the long run. I hate that "logic" line! -- that's what he feeds his family to justify what he's done.
We'll, I'd better get some work done...Thanks for posting back. It helps so much to know that others are going through what I am and are being strong, too. Inspiring!
BF439

My H moved into his bachelor pad in April. TO me I feel the longer it goes the less hope I have. He fought me every step in the beginning when I told him to leave. When I set up separate times for us to spend with our son. Now I kinda feel like he is getting used to it. I think he likes being a part time dad.

And he is also very stubborn so I just cant see him admitting that he was wrong. He LOves to say that it has nothing to do w OW and that he doesnt even see her anymore, its just that he doesnt want to be with me. then the cell phone bill comes 2000 minutes with OW (yes 2000) 200 text messages.

Okay keep telling everyone it has nothing to do with her. I know he doesnt get to see her too much. but he keeps saying he wasnt seeing her at all. and I keep finding out he is.

HE used to be a very good person. No one could beleive he left us. But maybe they just slowly turn into this other person and it takes them that much longer to turn back. and by then have we (BS) just givin up.

Yes, I feel like he is liking the part-time dad thing, too. I'm starting to think that its not just what issues there were in the marriage or the affair, but that he wants to be single. I'm seeing this trend with particular WH's and they are all close to 40 -- mid-life crisis driving this?
My WH will I think not choose to come home because what he has gotten in a single life is so less stressful. No house to clean (only small apartment), can work as much as he wants, see the kids only twice a week; don't have to do thier laundry or plan b-day or holiday parties (his mom will do that for him), and he can have sex with whomever he wants. I think once he made that leap, the importance of being married and caring for me doesn't matter. That's the thing that hurts so much is that he made the decision to change his life to being a single-part-time dad and that's what he got. I don't feel like a part-time mom at all -- in fact, I always have one of them since DD12 won't go with him because he's a cheater!

So, I feel like I am still a wife (in Plan B, but still married, so I don't date) and still have the burden of my job and the house and all of that with 50% less help.

I'm feeling totally screwed over and taken advantage of and the thought that "he has to live with his choices and someday the fog will lift" is absolutely no comfort. So I get to take the high road and just have all the crap we had in our life before, just alone. Feeling like a victim all over again and I am tired of feeling that way!!

I guess it hurts that people assume he valued being a dad and in a family, but I don't think he did. How could you so easily walk away and assume that two homes will be better than one?
Do the ends justify the means? How do I craft my life to be what I want it to be with such a selfish person in the picture. So much last night I thought, I just want to file for D, take full-custody so I don't have to deal with this BS of him choosing when he's going to be a dad.

Any thoughts out there? I feel like I am on a total negative sprial and have no hope for R.
BF439

ST8126 and BF439,

I was wondering did your H's affair down? Is the OW a loser? I mean I guess its obvious, but my H affaired down.

The OW is somewhat over weight, a bar fly partier and she has been married before and was engaged at the time of the affair(which I exposed to the fiance).

H told DD17 several months ago that it wasn't about looks and when DD17 asked him so like what are you going to live the rest of your life like this he responds {{{pause}}} uh, no.

I don't believe this OW can hold a candle to me in any way shape or form, and i mean it in this humblest way possible. I guess that makes it even harder. I mean if she was a super model or freaking super successful or rich Gawd it would help ya know LOL. But she's none of them, and it makes it that much harder.

I truly think my H's self esteem issues were much deeper than I had thought. I knew he had them and saw them but never talked about it because he was a man and I just didn't think it would be right. But I think he has the hero complex and was trying to help this girl then the EA started which led to the PA. I'm not sure what is harder to take the EA or the PA. Just know that H probably said things about me to another woman just kills me. I think a good part of this A is him trying to feel good about himself and in general. It's like we had many many happy moments but there was always that underlying thing of unhappiness. I am the opposite. Positive and happy, for the most part, I get frustrated just like everyone else too.

I don't what to think anymore. I know that just before the sun comes out it's the darkest hour. I feel like I'm in my darkest hour, sure hope the sun comes out....

BF439,
I can totally understand your anger as I feel the same. I read this book before I found SAA and it helped me and continues to help me to try and hold on for a bit longer. Its called Divorce Remedy by Michelle-Wiener Davis. She explains how its worth at least fighting for the marriage for several reasons.

I mean if you must go the divorce route at least you can knowing you gave it all your effort and as much time as you could to give it a fighting chance and if you have to walk you can do so knowing you did everything you could. Imagine having to look back and think the dreaded "what if...". By you implementing SAA and giving it time you are giving your marriage the best shot. That's one good reason to not divorce quite yet.

I also read online somewhere that many women were polled on this website for betrayed spouse the top 10 to consider. One of the things they recommend is do not make any life decisions for at least a year. I think this is even recommended for those going through a death. I think most people are to vulnerable to make decisions on a life level before then. We could make decisions not based on wisdom but based on hurt and anger and that's not always the best choice.

The book also explains that most people think "just get a divorce and it'll be over". But she says a divorce is not always the short cut, it may actually take longer, and the truth is it will never be over since you share children. You will have to deal with spouse for the rest of your life.

I have been with my H since i was 14 that's 24 years. I have 24 years vested and its worth at least trying with all my might to give it a little time. My grace is diminishing daily and I know at some point I will no longer be able to do it. I hope he comes to his senses before that. April 23rd is D-day. 2nd goal make it to that day. That will be 1 year. I don't know if I can do it but I am going to try.

But i do understand what your feeling. They have no responsibilities and I do wonder too if my H has gotten the taste of the single life. But I acted like an idiot 1 time to his face at one of the games we both 1st attended. Guess what I could not stand how it made me feel because I'm just not that way. I always take the high road. I believe even if someone hurts you deal with your pain and keep it in your own backyard instead of re inflicting it on the person. So I couldn't stand my behavior and called him 5 minutes later and apologized. Take the high road you will be glad in the end no matter the outcome. Plus I found the more ammunition you give a person the more they refute in their mind your ammunition. But when you don't give them ammunition they have nothing to think on but their actions. I'd rather H think on his behavior than argue me in his head all day LOL.

BTW someone sent me this a few months back. Take a look at it. They have a very interesting story...http://www.rejoiceministries.org/

I dont know if my husband affaired down in looks. everyone tells me NOW that they had seen him with someone such and such a place a year or so ago. THey didnt share it w me till after the affair was exposed. but anyway they say shes overweigt and stuff. but i truly think they are just saying that to make me feel better.

I dont know if i could handle seeing her and dont look forward to that day. i am the type of person who would obsess over comparing myself. but insidewise i know for a fact i would never and i say never have knowingly carried on for two years with someone who was married and with a kid. Especially after the wife called me crying sayin she was desperately trying to hold her family together and please stay away (before MB i was a mess)

I was in the same marriage and had alot of oppurtinities to cheat I did not go that route. My DS was so important to me I would not even give it a second thought.

And my husbands mother cooks and does his laundry too. I mean i also feel he has left me with everything. but i just have to keep thinking i am doing this for my DS he needs me. I could walk away too but I guess we just have more integrity than WS. He left his wife and little boy crying and begging him to stay . I wouldnt be able to live w myself if i did that.

I feel like he has the life now why would he want to come back.

BTW trying2live thanks for the book and website i am going to look into them.

In Plan B, you have no idea what your WH is going through when he lays his head on his pillow at night. When my DH was gone, I also thought he was just living it up all the time, no responsibilities, no pain, just fun in the sun. In truth, it was the opposite. He tells me now that while he was gone, he was tormented all the time by what he was doing. He "tried" to live it up and have a good time but it was always colored by that little thought in the back of his mind, "What the heck are you doing?!?"

My DH tried to bury those thoughts in alcohol, it just made it worse.

So even though they may "appear" to be having the time of the life, the reality could be completely different.

But you're in Plan B so you don't know, nor should you care.

IN the beginning before MB. Oh how I wish i had found MB sooner.
I so many times acted like and idiot. There was such strong feelings it seemed as if I couldnt control myself. I have never felt such pain in my life. And I didnt know where to put it so I acted like a crazy person in the beginning.I felt so out of control of my emotions

But now I feel that without letting them out I am just stuffn my feeling w food. which is NOT helping the situation at all.But the pain is so much less now with time and MB. I did feel so alone and like a failure. but got some good info here on how to deal with it.

You are so right. I do have a hard time with the not caring part. but i am working on it.

With the caveat that the men who come here to MB are probably more evolved and self-aware than the typical man out there, I firmly believe this is at least possible, if not probable, of most men. They go from being taken care of by mommy to being taken care of by wifey, and really don't want to get any deeper than that. Why do you think one of men's top ENs is recreational activity together? It's because they want to keep playing, like they did when they were kids. Being adult and taking care of kids and issues is no fun. Why do you think college boys' places reek of stale beer and pizza while college girls' places are at least non-toxic? Because we're raised with the responsibility gene. Also why most men's ENs are all about us women making things fun and happy and exciting for them, and patting them on the back, while most women's ENs are all about accomplishing things and feeling safe and secure.

Day 19 done and nice and dark. It's not really hard staying dark as he lives an hour away with the Sea Hag Toad. Funny thing, I have been in Plan B for 19 days right? Well he's seen his kids 3 times in 19 days. He's called about 11 of those days for the kids which I guess is not bad. During plan A he was here at the house about 3-4 times a week spending 6-8 hours here sometimes more.

Well last week he deposited money in the bank but not much so I had to send a message to the IM's letting him know that it wouldn't cover some of the needs( i knew it would be as he has to pay his half of the rent for the Toad's den). So I guess he talked to DD17 yesterday and complained to him about it being sparse-no eating out for the kiddies LOL. So he deposited more money in, not that he's doing me any favors. DD17 said he felt bad, whatever! But luckily he has provided for us through this entire mess and I haven't had to file LSA.

He called and said where is your mom and she knows to tell him IDK per my instructions. So she says IDK he says well can you tell her i put more money in, and DD17 knows not to pass any messages to me while on the phone with him so she says I'll let her know. Well I guess tonight he texted DD17 that he's not gonna listen to any IM's and that its probably a fake email I set up. DD17 says how dad when our computer was broken? H then responds well I'm still not talking to an IM and I don't know what the bills are for the month.

I then say DD17 you text him and tell him that it is too stressful for you to discuss the household needs and ask him to look at the emails from the IM's and to at least read them because you do not want to be in the middle of the bills. DD17 told him dad the IM's sent you an email with all the needs for the month so at least read it even if you don't want to respond. All the attorney fees and stuff is in there too(we are working with Attorneys to save our home). He then responds what attorney fees....LOL...hope is scared him LOL.

Anyways IM's I think he may at least read them now.


So here's another thing, what do you guys think about this. So H hasn't made any effort to visit the kids. DD17 tells me today I told dad how come he visited 3-4 times a week when he was talking to you and now he doesn't. Guess he gave her some lame excuse which she didn't like LOL.
What he wants to do is take the kids Sunday morning. Okay, well the our family has gone to church for 15 years every Sunday morning, except of course if were on vacation or something. DS10 has been in church since he was 21 days old and DD17 since she was 3. H knows how important it is to me to give my kids a spiritual heritage and raise them in a Godly environment. He kinda at times dislike me about this. So of all the days he wants to visit any guess on days and times? Yup Sunday morning.

So I said to the kids you are free to visit after 1 PM for the most of the day. Is that being unfair to H? I know I probably shouldn't care, I'm just weird. IDK. For the most part the kids like going to church, occasionally they complain like most kids, but even DD17 started singing on the worship team with me again. And DS10 loves the Pastor and the Pastor always makes time when DS10 comes into his office.

No tears today, that's a good thing, still fighting the anger and hate thing. I knew that I would have times of sadness but I really wasn't prepared to hate the dude. I guess its all part of the range of emotions, hopefully that will even out.

DD17 said mom I was talking to dad and he said he's gonna add extra money for the Christmas presents so it should be a good Christmas. DD17 says mom I told him, "uh yeah IDK about that". She thought it was funny.

So the kids and I discussed what they wanted to buy there dad for Christmas and they said nothing that Sea Hag Toad can benefit, so no clothing, cologne, restaurant gift cards etc etc So we thought of things creatively. Some of his favorite things. Slippers, travel coffee mug, sunflower seeds, chap stick, Chocolate and a family picture DVD set to music. Then DS10 says the funniest thing ever. He says mom we can get dad a T-shirt that we have printed but we turn it inside out so he can't see it. Then he can put it on and he can see the front that says "I hate Sea Hag Toad". Oh man I laughed hysterically and said DS10 you are so funny!

Well your all updated...

Well,

I believe the correct name is "Toad Hall". But I also think "Toad Dorm" and "Toad Fort" are good monikers because it clearly shows the emotional level of the occupants.

I really feel sorry for your DD. She is telling you what is going on in her life- and reacting with her dad is a huge part of it now. (I teach high school- and ALL teenage girls, like, spend sooooo much time talking about this,, and like, that) but this IS still keeping YOU looped into WH nuttiness.

I don't know if that is good for you.
I don't know how to put a stop this, tho. She wants to support you, but she is now the "mediator". Hmmmmmm. Not her job. And it would be IMPOSSIBLE for a child to edit out information that to her ALL seems important.

P.S.
Have Pastor call, email or write your WH a note saying he really looks forward to seeing the kids at church EVERY Sunday morning. This does not have to be a condemnation, just a friendly reminder of good priority making.

You do not have to be part of it, either.