hello all.<P>Please give me your opinion on a very soar subject for me. If you don't know me, my post is husband left me on xmas day for another woman. I recently posted it.<P>A brief overview, with my husband ten years, two and a half were married, we have three daughters, ages 2,6, and 8. My husband left me on xmas day for another woman. She has a 5 year old son. Well, my husband almost came home twice in the month he was gone. I found out that this woman, knew he was married and went after him hard. She is so proud that he has chosen her over me. I am crushed, after ten years of total committment to someone I adored. <P>Here is my dilemma, we have been apart for 5 weeks. Each time we see each other, we are drawn in. We hug, we kiss, once we slept together, but ultimately, we both agree we still very much love each other. I suspect he wants to have his cake and eat it too. Which he is. Now he wants to have our kids meet her.<P>I feel this means his relationship is more serious than he lets on. How serious can an affair be in the first month. How could he walk out of a good home and family? I feel I met all his needs. I know that sounds high and mighty, but I did. The only thing in the area of sex, towards the holidays, yes it was quite boring, but it wasn't always that way.<P>I learned he has hardly met any of my needs therefore wondering why I still love him so much. Am I just hanging on because of our kids, or because there is competition. <P>Should I send my kids, the law says I have to ultimately. Should I feel this could be a stage (hes 26, me 27). Should I just move on and see if he ever changes his mind. Until last week we always spoke of coming home one day. Now I feel he made a decision, just hasn't told me.<P>Is it wrong for my kids to have to meet this woman, or am I being selfish. <P>PLEASE Help me. I am losing my mind. I can't eat, can't sleep and I am in total devastation at all times. <P>THank you .

Lonelymom,<P>I told my W is our D under any cercumstances to <B>EVER</B> be around OB. If I find she will lose any custodialship. Right now we share custody. She doen't have any ground in which to fight this. She is breaking several laws and has a huge ethiucs problem on her hand...<P><BR>As far as your H getting more involved w/OW expect it. You're in for a long ride. If you have the patience to weather this storm, you will in all liklyhood get your family whole.<P>Learn and live all the information on this web site. Are you seeking any counceling?<BR>I suggest trying Steve Harley. He has given me a plan and I am seeing results, aldeit minute, I do feel like I'm moving fotward.<P>Bill<P>------------------<BR>BB<BR>

{{{{{{{lonelymom}}}}}}}<P>My personal opinion is that your children are at a point where meeting the OW would be just too confusing for them. Why is he in such a hurry? Or is it him that wants this meeting to occur? Maybe OW is pushing for it so she can tell herself "see, he want's ME to be part of his family." What a drag!<P>I know how hard it is to take care of yourself right now, but you need to. It is important to remember that your children need you to be strong for them too, even though it overwhelming. Have you called your doctor, pastor, or a counselor? Depression is treatable. I know, I know, you feel like hiding under the bedcovers and just staying there until the nightmare is over, but you will feel better if you do something, anything, for yourself. You will be able to know that you are the one to define yourself - not let the situation define you.<P>It sounds to me that your H is very confused right now. Ask him if this is something he really feels would be beneficial for the children (not just him and OW)? I'll bet his answer, if he's thoughtful about it, will be no - this is not right for the kids right now.<P>I'll keep an eye out for your posts and will be here to lend whatever support I can.

lonelymom,<P>I thought I would post my opinion of your problem.<P>It's too soon for your children to meet the OW. My H left at about the same time and he's never even mentioned my kids being around her. And I've said it will be over my dead body too. She is trash who had her own 2 children taken from her. Not the type of person I want around my kids!! He hasn't even moved all of his stuff out yet so, I take that as a teeny tiny sign that he's confused. (maybe that's my heart talking instead of my brain).<P>Don't let the kids meet her now. It just makes it seem as if she's part of the family. It would only hurt the kids. <P>Hang in there. This is a log ride.<P>Prayers,<BR>Mitzi

Mitzi,<P>Is your H living with the OW? I tried talking to a lawyer and he said that the judge will not take into consideration that H left on XMAS day, nor that he shacked up with OW a week after. He has "rights" to see the kids. I am heart broken. <P>William and Rollercoaster,<BR>Thank you for your replies. I am so emotionally distraught, I can't think straight. I believe one of you HIT THE NAIL ON THE HEAD, maybe OW is behind all this. Its the ONLY thing we have fought over in the month he left. I never had heard of Plan A,but I just figured, I will kill him with kindness and then he can't justify his affair that I deserve it. SO in essence, I have been Plan Aing all along, now I am really doing it, although I love to hear all the opinions and try and see where I fall in. In my case, he met her a few days before he walked out, went to mom's for a few days and BOOM she kicked out her OM and my H moved in. My H almost came home last week, and chickened out at last minute, but he did sit her down and tell her for the second time in a month that he misses me and the kids, what do you think? I think NOW she is going to try and wedge between us any way we can. I sent H a link to this site, not the forum,don't want him to know I am on it, as he'll learn my strategy, which is another question. Do those of you who Plan A, do your spouses know you do this? I would think it might be a bad thing if they did?? Not sure, just learning here. I almost think my H had a breakdown. He kept saying he didn't know why he left. Now he claims he is not totally happy, will never marry her and probably never marry again if we ever divorce. He just says its a distraction. He claims he has issues he is working on . He has said its not between me and OW but if he can come home and someday even a year from now, come home and know it will be forever. I still think its between me and OW. Or in my case, I would rather refer to her as OB for other b*tch. But I know that would confuse a lot on here!!! <P>How can I Plan A, when someone told him to hold my child support, file taxes without me(now I am going to owe bigtime), and all he wants right now is to take kids to her. He claims he misses the kids, but won't come to see them here . He said in one conversation when he was coming home, she won't let him anywhere near me. OW's mom keeps telling him to get a divorce. *nice inlaws. <P>Everyone in the family disowned him but his mom. I hear she is my exact opposite. I am like June Cleaver, and add on soccer mom, brownie mom, lovingly devoted wife. She is a party girl, few years younger, bad credit, has nothing in her home and pawns son off on people a lot. He values his time with her because its one on one, I would be "cool" too if I had no responsibilities to care for. <P>Does anyone know how to re-engage the feature that i get an email when someone replies? I forgot to check mark that box on first post?? <P>God Bless You ALL!!!!!!!<P>

lonelymom<P>First of all is your H living with the OW and her children?<P>Is he asking for overnight stays with him while he is living with OW?<P>Do your children know what is going on (or at least the eldest)? <P>While I agree he should not be introducing your children to a 3rd party right now, you may have no recourse, other than refusing to let him take them from your home without your accompaning them (and if you do end up getting a divorce this could be held against you), unless you get the courts involved. <P>While the courts would not dictate who he introduces the children to they certainly will not feel a thin piece of plaster board between two bedrooms is ample enough to shield the children from the immoral deeds. In short if you don't agree with overnight visits while your H is cohabitating with another the courts will not permitt this to take place, at least not in the state I reside in.<P>Your best bet would be to find out WHY he (if it's even him or if it is OW) thinks this would be good for the children, as RCoaster suggested. <P>I would also prepare a list of the reasons you feel it is Not in the best interests of the children to meet the OW. Appeal to his common sense (if he has any left) on the level of the hurt the children will feel when they find out OW is who their daddy is with. Like it or not the kids will see that their loving daddy chooses to live with or spend time with this OP as oppossed to them and their mother.<P>There is no easy way around this issue. If it is something that he is pushing for he will not let up. You'll have to stand strong. It isn't time with the OW the children need it is time with their parents, together or seperate that they need. If he can't understand this then his abilty to parent is certainly suspect.<P>I'd lay money on it's the OW who is pushing this issue. You might even ask your H what he would think about your kids spending time and meeting someone YOU started seeing after only 5 weeks. Does he think this would be good for the children? Some times when the shoe is on the other foot it pinches a bit, if ya know what I mean. <P>Don't feel as if you are being selfish. All you are doing is being a GOOD parent, who is trying to protect her children.<P>I know this must hurt like he!!. I understand how devestated you must feel.<P>In some ways I am lucky my girls are teens and made their own minds up about not seeing the OW.<P>Don't let the cr*p get you down. Look into the eyes of your little angels and you'll have all the reason you need to stay strong.<P>Fingers Crossed<P><BR>

lonelymom,<P>I think you really need to talk to H about if he TRULY believes that this is in the best interest of the children. He cannot honestly believe that it would be healthy for them!!!! At least my H never really pressed this matter as OW is also a party girl...any time with kids meant he'd have to give that up. He got tired of it after awhile though. Even got mad at OW for having a party at his house (before he moved back here - again) while he was gone on business out of town.<P>You may not be able to prevent the kids from meeting her, but you can make it as difficult as possible. I don't see this as lovebusting with your H, I see this as protecting your children from emotional harm.<P>Stay strong!!

Lonely mom,<BR>I think you may need to file for child support if he is with holding it. It is for the children, not for you. Also you might have to go ahead and file for custody of the children. in my state (WV), it was told to me by a lawyer that I should do that first. H could come and take the kids anytime and not bring them back because neither of us has legal custody of the kids. <P>About the taxes, if you have legal custody of the kids, you can claim them and there is a child tax credit. Of course, it depends on your income. Check into that.<P>Yes, my H is living with the OW. IT sucks big time but I'm dealing with that. I refuse to go down without a fight, so to speak.<P>Prayers,<BR>Mitzi

To answer your questions<BR>He moved in with her a week after he left.<BR>SHe has a 5 year old son who never met his dad. She sends him to his grandmas every weekend cause she works and is "tired" then H and OW get a lovely weekend for 2. My kids didn't know in the beginning, the 2 oldest are 8 and 6. Well he showed the oldest a picture of OW and told both he had a girlfriend. I asked the girls if they want to meet OW and the boy my H carries a pix of in wallet. They said NO. I admittedly asked in a GRIM way. Grandma claims she asked happily and they agreed. So I wonder what to do> H accuses me of turning the girls on her but all i did was tell them the truth. They asked why daddy left. I told them. I know it was wrong at the time, but I don't feel I should lie for him either. I live in NYS. I am very upset at the topic of them going to stay there overnight BECAUSE we are married, not even legally seperated at this point. What lunatic judge would send the kids over there anyway?? I am SOOOOOOOOOOOOOO mad. <P>He is being very nice to me these past 2 days. Promised no more fighting and will be civil. I almost wonder if he read any of the home page and is Plan Aing on me, because he wasn't so sweet the other day. The good tone in his voice hurts me and I too dream of them together every single night. I am buying time by taking kids to counselor but he is on to me. I am sure of it.

Lonelymom,<BR>A thread is any topic that is posted and the replies. Sharlene Smith posted a topic a couple of days ago. It's not too far down the list. Talk about Plan A. <P>Prayers,<BR>Mitzi

LonelyMom,<P>Seems we are having a conversation back and forth.<P>I am glad you are so active, being a newbie and all. Please check Jim's (NSR) posts under newcomers, he is an invaluable reource, and the best plan A'er in the world. I am sure he will touch base with you soon.<P>I think it is totaly unreasonable for your H to expect that you bring the kids to OW. He carries a picture of the S in his wallet? After knowing the kid one week?<P>I hate to say this, but it sounds like maybe this was going on longer than you think. And what is with OW? She throws one guy out to move have another move in? What a dirt bag. Why would H want to get involved with that? <P>He is in a fantasy world right now. He is re-living his single days when he could come and go as he pleased, with no responsibility. What does he think would happen if you do get a divorice? He would have to have the kids every other weekend, and I am sure the courts would take them away if they knew he was shipping them off to Grandmas.<P>I say hang tough in Plan A. He already sounds like he is begining to realize that this is not what life is about. GEEEEEEZ!<P>By the way, I usually don't say things like this, but that OW disgusts me! What a tramp! <BR>

Jersey Joe,<P>Thanks so much for your support. I really wish I checked the box so I could know when a reply came in. It would be easier for me to get back quicker.<P>I asked when he met her. He said she worked there since August but he "found out her name" 3 days before xmas. Yet a week before xmas he decided to have a guys night out. I asked if I could meet him after at the comedy club where they were supposedly going , he then switched that they were going to a "nude" bar.(obviously so i wouldn't go meet him. Then I found out a few weeks after he left he was spotted at the comedy club with OW.SO I believe he did in fact go out with her that week, and thats when he was acting odd too. In my heart if anything, I still believe they met some time in December. Still I have no definite answers. <P>He has told me so much things. He absolutely hates the OW son, who is five. He doesn't like that she is so messy at the house, (my house always really clean and uncluttered). He claims he lost weight because her cooking isn't like mine, but I don't believe that. But he up until last week claims he loves me. He found out I went out a few times and met someone (nothing serious, but I refuse to answer his questions on it, since he left). He was so upset, disappointed, I wonder if that was why he felt like coming home. He did say he didn't want another man sleeping in his bed or sitting in his new recliner, or playing with his kids.<P>HELLO...... why would I want OW around Mine. I feel like she is trying to steal my family. She knew he was married. She told his mom when she saw him he was just SO cute (gag me) , now he has a big head too. She knew he was a devoted dad. She has had my husband pick the little boy up from daycare while she works. He NEVER did that for me in ten years. AAAAAAAAHHHHHHHH.<P>I guess I look at it like this. If I went totally on his words, I could be sweet talked into hanging on a while. If I go by his actions, fact is, he lives with her, her brat kid's picture is in his wallet, he takes her out every weekend, (never would take me, he was "too tired"), he lives with her, sleeps with her, refers to her house as "home". Yet he says he waits for that feeling he got when he met me, or how he still feels for me , and doesn't get it. He says even when he sees me now he gets butterflies, yes I believe him because he acts like a teenager when I do see him, can't keep his eyes off of me, and staring and wanting a hug. <P>He keeps me so offbalance. One day he tells me he has regrets all the time. Next day he says he is happy for now and thats it. I can't even keep up. Actually, I just say, Ok yesterday was good, so today will be bad, and vice versa, and you know what, I can pinpoint it every time now. <P>It hurts that he thinks she is so carefree and happy go lucky. Wait til he goes golfing every weekend, or is never around once the winter is over. Wait til he starts being himself around her and vice versa. I hope their affair dies a PAINFUL DEATH. I hope what comes around goes around and they both get hurt.<P>God give me some strength to get through this and I don't want to turn bitter. I cried for 5 weeks straight, lost 17 pounds, and can't eat or sleep. Now I am so hurt I feel numb. <P>I agree maybe he met her sooner. If he has regrets still, at this point, do you think that is a sign this thing could be cooling off? Would one in an affair, have those open regrets and be able to work through them again, or does guilt eat them alive??<P>God Bless. My Girlfriend is DRAGGING ME OUT tonite . I hate going to bars, I am a home body, but I guess I need a change of scenery , since I work out of my home, this is a living hell.<P>I will sign on tonite to check replies.<BR>

lonely mom,<BR>I also hope that my H's affair dies a painful death. <P>I'm also counting on regrets bringing my H home. <P>The great infidelity diet works wonders doesn't it?? I've lost 22 pounds so far (6 weeks). But my appetite is coming back. So far no weight is though. <P>Hang in there. You are doing better than you think. <P>prayers,<BR>Mitzi

lonelymom,<P> I'm glad that your friend took you out tonight, you needed a break from holding your world on your shoulders. I hope you had a good time <P>It sound to me that your H is seeing some of the tarnish beneath the glitter, so you hang in there!<BR>

Friends, thank you for your support, Wish me luck, this is all new to me!! During Plan A, is it recommended that the betrayed NOT see anyone?? I don't specifically date anyone, just wondering "should" I meet someone. I have a feeling I know what you are all going to say. Don't complicate things. Just wondering since I am so lonely and sad. Not going out looking tonite by any means, just wondering what I should be doing on Plan A, no mention of it anywhere. When I go to church tomorrow (eeks, get up early!!) you will all be in my prayers.

Interesting thread and one that hits close to home for me.<P>My wife met OM at gym where she works out. All summer long kids were in daycare provided by gym while she worked out, so naturally they know who OM is.<P>He was over to the house at least once that I know of before I was aware of affair.<P>Since the affair he has been over once. I told my wife that I could not accept this and asked her to tell him he is not welcome in our house and I don't want hi aroung our kids. Later that week he met my wife and kids and some other friends for the gym and went ice skating with them. I very calmly reitereated my previous statement that he is not welcome in my house and I don't want him around our kids. I told wife that if she can't tell him this in no uncertain terms that I will call him and tell him. <P>By the way he is married and has kids also. Does he want me to take his kids skating?<P>Anyway, wife says he is just one of the guys as far as the kids know, bla bla bla...Itried to make it clear to her that even if we separate and or divorce, that I don't want him around the kids. Even if we are divorced he is still married - it's still adultery, duh.<P>This has caused some conflict between us (of course) but I don't see this as lovebusting, it's just me being a good parent.<P>Hopefully if it does come to divorce and custody issues the courts will be willing to consider thsi tye of behavior.

Hi <B>lonelymom</B>,<P>Jersey Joe said I'd show up...<BR>He is right... and I have to add my $0.02<P>First off... I am <B>not</B> the best <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8113_ab.html" TARGET=_blank>Plan A</A>-er...<BR>...just one week ago I told my W to "get the h@!! out"...<P>That being said... there are others who will also chime in an fill you in on the details of <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8113_ab.html" TARGET=_blank>Plan A</A>. A post I do have that might give you a perspective is <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Archives/Archive-000001/HTML/20000110-1-011323.html" TARGET=_blank>Plan A - 101</A>.<P>Ok...<BR>Now the big thorn in my side. <B>The courts and the kids!</B><P>I live in NJ... across the Hudson from you...<BR>The courts in NY are supposed to be comparable to NYS... and with that said... I have some potentially bad news to brace yourself against.<P>About one month after I counter-filed for divorce(we were still living together at the time), I got a restraining order against the OM to not allow overnights with my kids... I was happy as a pig in mud... It even cancelled a 'vacation' my W planned with OM and his kids... because mu W went with OM and left my kids out in the cold.<P>Then...<BR>In early January... the same judge revoked the restraining order! I was devastated!<BR>The entire grounds for the reversal was that we (my W and I) were <B>not</B> living together anymore... <B>that was it</B>... <BR>The judge even said...and I quote her...<BR>"I cannot bring in morals or religion into this court"... <BR>and then later the judge said... "she(my wife) will have to live with her(W's) decision to request the lifting of the restraining order"... <B>but</B>... the judge gave her the ruling anyway!<P>It was one of the most disgusting days in my life...<P>I would say fight tooth and nail...<BR>But... I fear... if the courts in NYS are anything like those in NJ... this will be an uphill battle.<P>Do practice your faith... with your children... don't give up on that!<P>I hate being the bearer of bad news...<BR>but maybe you can ask your attorney(when you get one) whether the judges in your county follow the same kind of "philosophy". Find different arguments that <B>can</B> sway your judges!<P>Protecting your kids is <B>not</B> a <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3400_lovebust.html" TARGET=_blank>Love Buster</A>!<P>If you need to <B>protect</B> yourself legally (and/or financially)... I usually make the recommendation of finding a <B>good</B> attorney. A good place to start off is at the <A HREF="http://lawyers.martindale.com/marhub/form/by.html" TARGET=_blank>Martindale-Hubbell Lawyer Search</A> site. Do a search within your county... look for only "family law" specialists(>80% in divorce/custody/etc.)... make sure they do a lot of "family law committee work"... if they know the judges all the better... You can normally find a few that will give initial counseling free of charge.<P>My prayers are with you! <P>Jim

Jim,<P>I have read a lot of your comments on the forum so far and you seem to have a lot of the same views as myself.<P>I am SOOOOOOOOOO disappointed right now it makes me SICK. When I got married, I waited SEVEN YEARS because I wanted it to be forever. I am sick to death over the amount of people that CHEAT. I know that strikes a nerve with those out there that does cheat but I fear I haven't much kind things to say at the moment.<P>I did see 3 lawyers so far. The first two, didn't mention what you did. The third, a big shot in our town, DID. I was SO SAD. He said that the judge will not bring in morals to the story that they will only PROTECT HIS RIGHTS. AHHHHHHHHHHHH. What about my childrens rights. What do they need to gain from this exposure. Especially at their young age.<P>I have three options, both not very well. One being to put subliminal, hidden messages in things that I say or do to make them NOT want to go and hope he would respect that (NOT LIKELY< HE KNOWS NO RESPECT). Or now a lot of you are going to hate me for this, but understand I am desperate. The second one, fight FIRE WITH FIRE AND TO H*LL with this LB Stuff. I am quite positive that he will FLIP HIS LID if I were to ask to expose my kids to another man, PLUS, he only gets them every other week....4 days because a few dinners here and there won't be horrible, but look at me, I get the other 26. I can imply that I will bring OM in every day and HOW MUCH HE ADORES THE KIDS. The third option, FIGHT MY BUTT OFF for permission to leave the state and get the heck out of here. I have to say the judges in this town are a piece of crap for that respect, probably since they ARE ALL BETRAYERS themselves. <P>OK I am trying to calm down, I haven't seen anyone screaming their head off here and I hope you guys don't throw me out!! I would put some smiles and frowns in here, but I have yet to figure that one out.<P>OK So if anyone has advice, plots what ever, you let me know. <P>Big development yesterday since I was on. He called me and gave me his phone number (I suspect he spoke to a lawyer and he has been sweet as can be) . I know he has something up sleeve.<P>Next development, you'll kill me. I asked about this and I swear to you all, this was by chance. When I went out last night, I ran into an old boyfriend. OH GOD HELP ME!!!!!! I have been neglected and hurt and please tell me you know what happened next.<P>Am I a Betrayer now too, or a rebounder, please don't hate me. I must say, it felt wonderful for someone to show me some care, and actually, I thought of him over the years, as he of me. Before I say anything else, tell me how awful I am and how I am thrown out.<P>Please be gentle to me, I am an emotional wreck. I haven't seen anyone admitting to this in my short searches as of yet.<P>Jim, thanks for your kind replies!!!

Lonelymom,<P>We..at least I'm not going to throw you out.<P>You do realise the ramifications of what you just did don't you?<P>You just added a whole new mix of feelings into an already emotioal mess.<P>Hang in there, really think about what you want. Then try to achieve that...<P>Bill<P>------------------<BR>BB<BR>

Lonelymom,<BR>I have a question for you, have the two of you talked about counselling at all? I think that the way to approach this is with an intermediatary party that will help your H to understand that you are thinking about the best interests of the children, not your own feelings on this matter. I would strongly suggest to him that you want the counselling to enable your children to deal with this situation in a good way. While your at it tell him it will help the two of you be able to deal with each other as far as parenting issues go and that if he wants the best for his children he will do this. I think if you present the problems of the kids meeting the OW in a non-emotional way he will see the light and while your working at communicating better for the kids it might help your marriage work out some of those bumps! I'm praying for us all today but didn't make it to church, I've got the flu, It's yucky being pregnant and sick at the same time! God Bless!