I am trying to figure if I should PLAN A him now and let him have the good feelings of family life...or push him to tell the kids he wants to leave.

It is just so surreal as we all went out to the movies today as a family and it is like nothing is wrong. I know my DH is just in denial/fantasy fog land.

We were watching "BedTime Stories" and there is a line in there where the kids ask Adam Sandler if their Dad will ever come back...and he says something like "Your Dad must have some kind of mental confusion to not want to spend every minute he can with you guys"...and I wonder if my DH "gets" that.

Hi WBH...

It's not an "either/or" scenario...Exposure (which includes telling your children) IS part of Plan A...Plan A is both a CARROT (showing a willingness to meet the needs of the WS) and a STICK (allowing the consequences of the affair to fall squarely on the shoulders of the WS, ie, the fallout from exposure)...(I will go find Pep's Carrot & Stick post for you in a bit)...

But YOU need to be the one to tell the children...I know, HARD, VERY, VERY, HARD...

HOW. EV. ER.

You do NOT want your active WH telling the children as he will give it that sickening wayward spin...He will NOT be honest with them, which will only result in confusion and more hurt for them...Sadly, the very brutal task of telling the children what their father is doing must fall to you...

I'm so very sorry this is happening to you! (((((WBH)))))

Mrs. W

Here is an excellent and helpful post by Pepperband...

The Carrot and the Stick of Plan A


The carrot of Plan A

Meeting your wandering spouse's emotional needs.

Making "home" a warm and inviting place to be.

Placing emphasis on what has worked in the marriage.

Showing consistent self improvement in areas where previously lacking.

Stop lovebusting behaviors.

Communicating with a calm reassuring voice and relaxed body language, even in the center of a verbal storm created by the infidel.

Becoming the person any reasonable spouse would want to come home to.

Remaining open to the possibility of recovery.

Offering forgiveness and understanding.


The stick of Plan A

Exposing adultery where it matters most. Exposure that takes the form of a swift and sudden unexpected tsunami of truth.

Not apologizing for exposure or speaking the truth in a kind yet direct way.

Directly communicating the hurt and devastation that the affair has caused.

Not accepting blame for the infidel's choice to become adulterous.

Let the consequences of adultery and infidelity fall freely upon the heads of the adulterous.

Establishing boundaries that disallow the affair to effect children of the marriage, financal security of the marriage, and otherwise ruin innocent bystanders.

Standing up to infidelity as a beast that must be slayed for the good of the family.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Plan A is both a *carrot* and a *stick*.

Don't have any answers, just wanted to say how sorry I am.

Definitely start making phone calls in the morning. Expose exponentially - make him sweat.

Here's my plan:

We have a family dinner at the Melting Pot (fondue place) that the kids love on Sunday. We have tickets to to the Radio City Christmas show on Monday. Tuesday morning I will be calling his parents and his friend who is a lawyer and ask for help. I can very well see him not wanting to go to the New Year's Party we are scheduled to go to, but that will be his loss.

Today he made breakfast and I made sure to tell him how good he makes french toast as the kids and I were joking how bad mine was the other time I tried to make it and only Daddy makes it good.

I am already doing all the parts of The Carrot part of plan A...many snarky things I want to say, like "This will be the last time you make them french toast, you know" are staying in my head.

I am trying not to follow him around the house too much nor ignore him either.

Today I am going to go to the bank and see if he has deposited his bonus in his U.S. bank account...if so, I will take half.
My checking accounts don't have much in them and my savings is in my name only.

Mr. Wondering here (on Mrs. W's computer)


Consider taking 3/4 of the bonus

1/4 for each member of the family.

This may be the last money you see for awhile, particularly if his employer is non-US based and you can't garnish his wages should he simply choose not to pay you.

Taking either 50% or 75% is going to upset him either way...so take the most you can legitimately to protect yourself (and your children) to the greatest extent possible.

(I am an attorney...but it's always safe to check with your own in your own state first however, your husband's attorney friend shouldn't be relied upon for advice)

Mr. Wondering

I think I discovered the full name of the OW while looking on his Linked In profile. I also know somebody he works with who can put me in touch with his boss if necessary.

It is quite amazing how he can compartmentalize things. Of course there must be some guilt so he is being quite nice. We have been cleaning out the attic in preparation for the move or not move...I asked him yesterday what the plan was for today and the said to clean out the attic...I gave him a quizzical look and he was like "What?" and I say can you imagine why I look that way, and he was like we need to do it no matter what since the dumpster is here for the week.

I really don't think he has thought anything through...just a U.S. family and a Germany OW and never the twain shall meet...
oh, how are you going to pay for two houses? Of course the one "we" chose was one of the more expensive ones.

In church today the topic of the sermon was "No Neutrality in Christ" or something like that...but basically saying you can't be on the fence, you have to pick one side or the other.

Also the pastor lifted somebody up in the prayers that was told on Christmas that their husband wanted to divorce them...and that was particularly cruel...and I wasn't the person he was talking about.

Does ANY of this ring true for WH?

Then our neighbor came over to say what a surprise it was that we were moving (I had sent out a "we're moving" insert to everybody on our Christmas card list..yay me.)and my gut was in a knot and I acted like we were still going.

I tried to see how much $$ is in his bank account and either I can't remember the PIN on that debit card ('cause I never use it) or he had it changed/deactivated.

So he is so definitely sitting on the fence. We had a nice time this week doing family activities...with the kids and also with my stepmom...we didn't visit his family because they had all made plans for Xmas assuming we were going to be in Germany.

This morning I told him that he is sitting on the fence and that he had a choice to make. The choice to keep his family, to be a daily part of his children's lives...to not break their hearts, to not cause them to have a mistrust of men and have no male figure in their life. The choice not to increase their odds of teenage promiscuity and decrease their odds of doing well in school. If he chooses his mistress, then I have to tell everybody that I told that we were moving to Germany that we are in fact not moving to Germany and why we are not moving.

He says its complicated. I said the only thing that makes it complicated is if the OW was pregnant. He said that she was not, but its because of my personality. My personality won't change.
I am sure he is right..that personality he has been married to for 21 years won't change. Of course this sounds like so much fog babble. He says he still loves the girls and cares for me.
(Is that "I love you but I'm not in love with you?")
I told him that we can get through this, but he has to have no contact with the OW, give me the password to his hotmail account, and not to work with her in the future, and get some kind of counseling. I tell him that you might think right now of course I will support me and the kids monetarily but at some point the OW will start saying "Why are you spending the $ on them". At some point supporting two households will get to be too much.

But he doesn't want to make a decision right now (of course not!).

So this morning after breakfast before we took showers I have a anxiety/stress/breathing attack. He is mildly concerned, but still wants to know if I want to take the girls to the mall while he waits to turns his leased car. I told him that I am not in any shape to go to the mall.

I have been careful not to use any DJs or AOs or snarky comments.
I looked in his bank account online and he has moved the remainder of his bonus to his German bank account. I have found a lawyer who has dealt with international divorce issues.

Did he move it before or after you took some out?

wannabophim,

So sorry you find yourself here. You know the Plan A drill, and you don't have much time to do it. Your prior MB study is serving you well, re biting your tongue on love busters etc.

I do believe God tries to send our waywards messages, like the church sermon you and WH heard in church, and the pastor's comment that it was "particularly cruel" that a parishioner announced divorce plans to his wife on Christmas Day. Unfortunately, the waywards DO NOT HEAR the message. It DOESN'T "ring true" for them. Same exact thing happened with us. FWH and I sat in church, heard all kinds of "righteous" messages, but I was the only one who "got" them. Ironic.

And your WH's comment about it being "complicated." Another standard wayward line. I got that one too. It's only complicated because he wants you AND OW and thinks he can have both.

Of course, you must expose, and get legal advice, but you can also let him know you're standing for the marriage, as long as you continue to want to, anyway. As for Plan B, it looks like HE is going to Plan B YOU when he goes back to Germany. My H did the same thing to me--took a job 4 hours away and moved there. But guess what? Over time, although we went to he77 and back, we have been recovering for over two years.

Like my sig line says, "Anything is possible."

You have my prayers.

Right Here Waiting

Oh, yeah. Follow up on OW, now that you have her full name. See if she's married and expose to her BH--and connect with that coworker who could put you in touch with his boss. Your WH will be furious, but the spotlight will be on his bad behavior. As someone on these forums said a while back, "I'm not invading your privacy, I'm exposing your secrecy." That's a great retort when they bark at you for doing the right thing.

Shake up the A!

Right Here Waiting

He moved it before I could take any out.

I have taken some actual action (yay, me) and called and made an appt. with Jennifer Harley Chalmers for 8:00pm tonight. Hopefully he will join me on the call.

Then MY next step would be to visit an attorney, before he deletes the rest of y'all's assets.

He agreed to be with me on the call to Jennifer.

I have savings in my name only, as well as a modest amount of inheritance money.

to both these things!

Let us know how the phone call goes.

Now THAT'S proactivity! Good for you.

We each took turns talking to Jennifer. We talked about exposure, but that I didn't have to be in a hurry to do that. If he leaves for Germany without a plan for us to join him, I will start exposing to his parents.

She said that there are 3 scenarios:

1) He doesn't leave
2) We all go with him
3) I go with him and the kids stay here

But that for it to work extraordinary precautions have to be taken.

I want to give him a little time for things to sink in as that is the best way to work with him. Plant a seed and let it grow.

I am to continue Plan A as long as I can...until I start getting resentful.

Stay with us. Could be a bumpy road ahead. We've all traveled it in one form or another, so we're here for you.

WBH, I wanted to let you know that I've read your thread and, while I don't have anything to add that these other wonderful MBer's haven't said, you are in my thoughts and I wish you the best.

What a time for everything to happen. Things will work out for you.