Just a note...

I remembered something my W said yesterday. She was going to call and see me on Xmas Eve but couldn't bring herself to come back to the house.

She has only visited our fomer marital home once and that was whilst we were trying again and I was living with her. She told me that made her feel REALLY bad and she felt that way for quite a while afterwards. I agreed with her and told her that I didn't like being there either and may look for another house for myself early in the new year.

Seems like this house harbours some pretty awful memories for her.

I have no clue what the 'Love you to bits' means. Doesn't even make any sense to me. WS tend to babble anyhow, so I would just ignore it.

I will say that looking at the actions is usually the best method of figuring things out. Here, she kissed you and invited you for a night out on New Years Eve. If you are in Plan A, and it seems that you are, then I would go to the New Years thing and be fun/lighthearted. Allow things to develop as naturally as they can, cause she has left the door open to you and is giving some good signs.

Another point for me is the marital house. I would not give it up unless it is what you want to do. Selling yourself out can be as destructive to yourself/the relationship as anything. I did that very thing 5 years into my marriage when she left me the first time. It felt she took my manhood away and I spent years dealing with that. I can not imagine that there was such abuse that the marital house would cause such issues? For my WXW, it was simply manipulation and game playing.

Thanks Grindnfool. I will put it down to babble as you say. :RollieEyes:

With regards to the house, I don't think I have much choice as my business has recently failed and the Inland Revenue (UK Income Tax) are taking steps to bankrupt me. They will take the house anyway and the chances of me getting somewhere when bankrupt are a lot slimmer than now.

There was no physical abuse here, but I do believe that she was very very unhappy here and there is a lot of emotional baggage associated with the place. I feel it too, only been here 4 years and never really liked living here. I honestly think that she ran away from "the sitation" first and found that the only way to survive was to have an EA and then "check out" emotionally from us.

Ah well, onwards and upwards!

The first thing that comes to mind is that she is involved with someone else. I hope I am wrong on this but you might do well to prepare yourself for this eventuality. It sounds like she needs to make peace with you so that she can better rationalize the involvement of another person. If she can just get you to accept the separation then the other person becomes OK.

What I don’t believe is that she wants to live alone purely for the sake of it, because she is tired of being married. I don’t believe that. Were you such a poor husband that she does not even want to be around you, I don’t think so. Where we might relish the times that we get an “alone” day or two, people (most of us) quickly become lonely without someone in our life.

You will soon know what motivates your wife to seek separation. Part of the picture is certainly poor marriage practices of the past but I highly doubt that that is the full and complete picture. There is more. You will know what it is because you are watching and if she is hiding something she will grow weary of keeping secrets and you will see it.

In the meantime, your Plan A efforts continue to be the order of the day. Do the small things that don’t appear to her as if you are chasing around her like a wounded puppy. Remember too that you are doing these things to save your marriage, not to make her feel good about separating.

Mr. G

Thanks again for the words of wisdom Mr G.

I know that there WAS someone else, that there was at least an EA. I have myself grown tired from thinking about this too much. She told me that it's been over for at least 4 months, but it was an intense R that they had (up to 10 texts per day) and I know they met in person more than she has admitted to me. Do I believe her that it's all over?. Truthfully, I'm unsure. I cannot fathom ANY other explanation for her behaviour though.

In the meantime I will continue to Plan A my butt off.

Oh, one other snippet that you may find interesting. Her new friend from work, the one that is married but goes out until 4 am with my wife, and on holiday with her last September is the one we are going out with (along with her husband) on New Year's Eve. The invite I got was that her friend had suggested that as we were still "getting on alright" that we should go out.

Now my wife knows that I do not really like this friend, she has enabled the EA my wife has had, was there on several occasions when they met (during her nights out) and has continued to supprt my wife in ALL her decisions. My plan is to take this friend on board and show her as much friendship as possible as there is no way that my wife will ever stop being her friend.

It's actually a strange thing, because a while ago I suggested us all going out together and was told that this friend was hers and hers alone and it was nice for her to have friends outside "us" that we weren't both involved with. (Red Flag, I know, but I missed it)

That's OK, almost everyone misses the obvious. It is always hard to believe that the person who is supposed to protect you is the one who has betrayed you.

Things are different now. You see more than you saw before and you are becoming wiser.

Your wife's girlfriend is certainly not your friend.

Mr. G

SO is my being friendly with her and her husband for the night a bad thing? Am I compromising my position at all?

I need to Plan A and feel that accepting this offer is helping. PLEASE tell me if you see it differently.

I have to journal something that has just crossed my mind.

I have been so involved with my failing business over the last 12-18 months that I have neglected my wife and her life - in total. I remeber she told me she was thinking of finding her own place and leaving, guess what I told her - "you'd better go then". How stupid was I. I made my own mess and am now trying to clean it up.

During our telephone call the other night, I mentioned to my W that I was a little bothered that she had send me a Christmas Card and singed it with her real name and not her "pet" name. I said that she was always "pet name" to me and always will be. She said that she didn't want to give me any wrong ideas. I confirmed that she wouldn't.

The present I got from her for Christmas was a book about Eminem, she know I like the guys music. A lot of thought went into choosing that, coupled with that was the card on the present was " To Pet name, Love Pet name."

That was nice and although there maybe nothing in it, I feel better that she is comfortable enough to use the names.

Man, I've been an a$$ for the last few years, time to wise up and be a man again, but carefully

Just had another call from my W. She is at work and wanted to wish me well for tomorrow. (I am going out with a good mate for a few drinks, he is her cousin as well!) as she won't be able to call me tomorrow as she will be sleeping (tonight is a nightshift for her)

The conversation was all happy and nothing about us, she also thanked me for going to her house yesterday for a meal, it was a nice day!

Baby steps, maintain composure and be friendly. Feels good.

Don’t be too hard on yourself what is most important is for you to continue with a Plan A that shows a thoughtful, considerate man who loves his family above all else. You’re going to WOW her one morsel at a time.


How would a thoughtful considerate man behave? You can be civil, engaging and classy even to someone like your wife’s girlfriend. I don’t think you are compromising anything by going out with them. Just be sure to keep your “road rage” in check.

Mr. G

Lol, thanks Mr G. I will do that

Journalling.....

Just spoke to W again (I rang her). She sounded really upset on the phone but put it down to lack of sleep and having a sickness bug. All I wanted to do was rush over and give her a hug. Stayed with the PMA though and gave her a virtual one instead.

She told me that her girlfriend had a big fallout with her husband (wondered how long that would be as she has been enabling the "single" life my W has been living) and would not be going out on New Year's Eve. She said that if I had anything better to do than be with her then she wouldn't mind. I confirmed that I wanted to be with her and so we are still for the night.

I have felt pretty bad all day today and so has W. It all seems so silly that 2 people can't live together but can't live apart either.

Keep it up, you are doing fine.

Thanks again Mr G.

It's nice to know someone is rooting for me

Well, knowing my W would be at work today, I sent a short email, hoping she was feeling better and telling her I was thinking of her. She replied when she got time, said it was very thoughtful of me and she was feeling much better. I signed my email with my pet name and an X. she did the same.

I was going to reply back, but thought about it and decided not to. Just leave it at that. I will be seeing her tomorrow anyway.

Just in case I never mentioned it before, tomorrow is my 50TH Birthday. Half a century down, GO ME!!

I need some advice from people on here, again. :RollieEyes:

Today (New Years Eve) I am going to be spending with my W and now only her. We will be visiting a few pubs and having a few drinks. (I will NOT be overdoing the drinking)

In her mind, at this moment in time, the marriage is over, "we" are over and she "wants to be alone".

Now, I never did get all the facts about the EA (PA?) she had from Feb 08 - Aug 08. I still have a lot of unanswered questions. On the times it was discussed, I was told that I should "move on" and dragging up the past was NOT the way forward. Not being fully conversant with the MB principles I only explained that I needed more information to allow myself some closure and didn't really push the point. I have been told 3 things -

1. He was "just a friend" and it was someone who had been through a separation.

2. He was Gay. (Never thought about point 1 at the time I was told that)

3. "When you have referred to it in the past few weeks it has made me feel sad, angry and frustrated that I felt the need to talk to another person, at the time it was an escape, now it is just a bad mistake I made and again I am sorry it happened, don't really know how many times you need me to say that. I feel at times that you are attempting to punish me. But punishing me for it is never going to be the way forward."

I still have no certainty that it was not a PA, I am not 100% certain it has FULLY ended.

So, what I was proposing to do later today, was to sit down with W, agree that in HER opinion the M is over. Then request full details of what has been going on, quoting a thread on here relating to the policeman at the door saying that the S is dead and that's all you need to know.

Given all I have said prior to this, do you think that is a one way ticket to D, will further alienate her (she currently is being friendly and ALMOST affectionate even though we are separated. OR, should I just continue my Plan A and try to fulfill her EN from a distance when we are apart and fully when we meet?

I know you may consider this to be waffling, and backtracking but I feel stuck between a rock and a hard place at the moment and sometimes feel like "what's the worst that could happen, the M would be over, it already is in her eyes" and then.."be strong, be considerate and Plan A like mad"

Answers on a postcard please.

There is very little you in her decision whether or not to D you.
Waywards are in a world of their own.

Sometimes, “less is more”, this is one such instance, you made the correct decision.


Happy Birthday, you’re officially old, feel better?


That is what you should be doing now. She is not ready to discuss relationship issues with you at this time. Your time is coming, that is for sure, but for now it’s ALL Plan A for you. By pressuring her for answers that she is clearly unwilling to discuss, you will risk the advances you have made thus far. Clearly your wife is enjoying your company. You should try to determine what it is that she is enjoying and why. If you pressure her she will likely interrupt it as you pursuing your selfish interest at her expense. You will merely reinforce her negative opinion of you.

Resist the pull of demanding too much, too quick. It is a recipe for disaster. You should be concentrating on the query, “How do I become a better man?” It is the question whose answer you should peruse regardless of how your marriage shakes out.

You may find that she surfaces the issue when you least expect it. You will eventually get all the answers but tonight is your opportunity for Plan A only. Of course, if she asks something specific, then by all means answer in the most gracious and courteous way possible. If you feel that you can’t bear to be around her without engaging in a heavy relationship discussion, then you should thank her for her efforts and excuse yourself.

I would imagine that acting in the way I have described, on New Year’s Eve, on your birthday, in the midst of possibly losing your wife and with a drink in your hand, will take all the courage and resolve that you can muster to keep the conversation light and with a smile on your face. Be prepared and be astute for just how difficult it will be. Cliché time: “Been there, done that”.

Best of luck to you,

Mr. G

Thanks again gang.

Mr G. I have no illusions that tonight will hurt me some and then probably some more. That I suppose is why I posted the previous question. A cowards way out, force an answer and then deal with the consequences. No, I will remain strong and resolute in my plan. Thankyou for your words of inspiration.

I got a call from my W earlier today, wishing me Happy Birthday. I had to laugh a little to myself though....

2 days ago, it was "If you have anything else to do but be with me, then it's OK"..W feeling sorry for herself and a little down.

Today it was "You still want to go out tonight?, I don't have any other plans so we can if you want" W feeling more in control of herself and confident.

It's not really the words that were different but the tone of voice and inference. A totally different approach.

Flip Flop and Flip again. It's all been seen before on here and sort of makes me think they all have the same WW "manual".

That really made my mind up, stick to the plan (that and your input Mr G)

I like you, keep up the good work.

Mr. G

P.S. Yeah, things change and flip by the nanosecond.