I tried to post about this when it 1st happened but it didn't make a whole lot of sense. So I will try again after some time has passed. Here goes -

I discovered (busted) A on 9/12/08. WW didn't leave or say she wanted anything to with OM. She was extremely remorseful and depressed and wanted us to work. Obviously we went through some rough times after D-day. Didn't really follow MB principles. I threatened to leave a few times. LOTS and LOTS of questions. NC was broken a few times with a couple of phone calls. Nothing major that I can see - just a few minutes. Realize now she was in a bit of the fog (I'm not exactly comfortable with that term but it does seem to apply because her attitude today is so much different).

Fast forward to 11/8/08. WW wants to confront OM for closure. Whatever that means. She basically wanted to tell him that she doesn't want him and what they had was not real. But she made a huge mistake going there by herself. We all know what happens next in this story. She has sex. She says that was not the intent but that she was feeling alone and desperate. Looking for acceptance from anyone. And the OM was more then accepting. She is not blaming me what so ever for this mistake but she says she felt hopeless with our situation. I don't want to argue if she intended to have sex or not - either way it happened and its wrong.

Today - Her attitude completely changed after the 11/8 broken NC. She no longer speaks warmly of the OM (she now despises him). Prior to that she thought he was a good person who just made a mistake. She says now that she realizes he was probably after sex more then she realized (the 11/8 incident proves it she says). I no longer hear about how good of friends they were and what a deep connection they had. And most importantly she is really trying with me. She is meeting my EN and has removed all toxic friends from life (unwilling before this 2nd time). And I have made changes as well. I guess it could be considered a plan A - but not to win her back from OM (I'm not as concerned about that - if that is what she wants then so be it) but more for myself. Trying to be a better person.

The problem is with me. Having a really tough time getting over this in my mind 2nd A. I feel like I forgave her for the 1st A (but I don't think she understandably felt that way becasue of our difficult recovery - lots of AO). So why in the world would she do this again? Its not like she stayed with him or wanted to live with him. She came right home after. It really just doesn't make any sense to me. I guess just looking for some kind of explanation for what she did on 11/8. Am I crazy for still trying to work this M out? I feel like it is hindering our recovery because I can't past this incident. Any advice would be appreciated.

No, the problem is NOT you, it's her.

I agree, this is just like a 2nd affair.

Maybe some FWW could spin this better for you?

You know it's ironic that you use the word spin. Sometimes I feel like as a BH I'm always trying to spin my WW actions into something I can live with. Not easy sometimes.

Upside-Down,

I think you're expecting too much too soon, and I think you (plural) have a bit of work to do on the MB principles. I also think you're making really good progress and that you have every reason in the world to want to repair this marriage.

You have a second D-day on 11/8. That's only a couple of months ago. It takes TIME to "move on" from a D-day. Especially when you thought you were both on board with the marriage and then you get knifed in the back again. You are just going to be hurt, that's all there is to it. And it's going to take lots of time before the hurt starts to subside.

You say "I feel like it is hindering our recovery because I can't past this incident." Something I'm just beginning to realize (I'm a slow learner) is that couples want to forgive too quickly, to forget to quickly, to move on and get past the affair too quickly. It's not surprising, the pain is huge and of course everyone wants it gone. So the couple focuses on forgiveness and moving on and getting past things. That's putting the cart before the horse. You need to instead focus on the basics: meeting ENs, avoiding LBs, undivided attention, POJA, and so on. When you focus on healthy marriage behavior, the recovery will take care of itself.

Focusing on recovery is focusing on winning the marathon without ever putting on your running shoes. If you focus instead on the basics, the marathon will take care of itself.

You mentioned AOs, and obviously your WW didn't POJA her visit to OM with you. So if I were in your shoes, I'd start with those two skills and then branch out. I'd also get your WW to write a NC letter that you approve and mail. If OM's wife doesn't know of the affair, I'd take this opportunity to inform her of it.

You and your wife might discuss extraordinary precautions and what measures you could put in place to help ensure no contact and fidelity - for example, key loggers, GPS trackers, and an offer to exchange cellphones whenever you request it. If she feels like any of these measures are controlling, explain to her that these are a means by which she can earn back your trust, and a tool to help her control herself until the tools are no longer needed or until your trust has been re-established.

Despite this HUGE setback, your WW was honest about the encounter with you, and she does seem to be seeing things more clearly now. You have three young children who will do so much better with an intact family.

Give it time, and go back to the basics without focusing quite so much on the long range goal.

Thanks for the post. I guess it's the 'knifed in the back' feeling that sometimes pops into my head and says what in the heck are you doing with this woman? And I think it happens more sometimes when things are going good. Probably a self-preservation instinct to not get hurt again. Have really tried to start applying MB principles. Have been spending more time together doing things. Less AO. She said even though she is sad about what she did she has not been this happy with us in a long time. Sometimes that makes me feel bad because I don't think I'm always as happy as her. My immediate reaction is usually to think we could have been this happy if you had just told me and not had the A. Or at the very least not gone back there. But in all honesty as much as I hate to admit it the A was definitely a wake up call. I don't know if I would have really listened to her before the A. Maybe if she would have left (not with the OM but just in general) - but I don't think she would have ever had done that. She took the easier route and had an A.

My WW called and told OM's wife everything after the 2nd day. My WW and OMW were very good friends so that was hard. My WW didn't want to tell her at 1st because she didn't want to hurt another person but finally realized the truth should come out. Kind of ironic that the OM denied the A to his wife even after my W told her. I check cell phone records and stuff. Don't have a GPS tracker. That would be an option I guess.

I guess my main issue is that even if I assume she is done and having NC and totally committed to me can I get over the 2nd d-day? I guess the easy answer should be yes because I got over all the other crap. But what makes this a little different in my mind is I really just can't even remotely understand why she would go back there and do that again. After all the he!! we went through after the 1st D-day. So I guess I'm just trying to vent on this board a little because I just can't understand it. Maybe hoping to see if anybody else had a perspective of why she might have done it to me a second time. And I know the obvious answer is because she is a cheater but I'm trying to really to figure out what the heck was going through her mind.

I think you should understand that this was not a 2nd A, but a continuation of her A. It really was. Chances are, regardless of what she told you, she had not decided she was going to stop seeing OM.

I'm not trying to be cruel, but there's a reasonable chance that she went over their slept with him and then told him she wanted him to leave his W, so they could run off. When he said I ain't leaving my W for you, voila, she despises him.

You aren't going to get the truth about this until she is done with withdrawal. I'm not saying this to rub salt in the wound or anything, but more to point out two things. 1. Don't believe anything she says right now. 2. You should be watching her like a hawk. If what's going on is similar to what I suspect, its just a matter of OM calling her and saying something like, I'm sorry, I am going to leave my W, etc, etc.

Did she send a NC letter?

Hey at this point after being burned twice I'm not going to rule anything out. I think I trusted my wife again to quickly after the 1st D-day. And I don't mind you giving your opinion even if its cruel - sometimes I think I need a dose of reality. I love this boards but unlike the movies not everything ends in a happy ending.

Couple of points about my situation - you are right - it is the same A, just another D-day. I think logically she wanted to stop seeing him because it was the 'right' thing to do but her heart may have been telling her something else. Uggghh!

I think the OM would have taken my WW in a second. In fact he is getting a D from his current W. OMW actually cheated on the OM. Could have not happened to a better guy. What a tangled web, eh? So at least in this case I don't think that was the reason.

I definitely think she was in withdrawal before the the 11/8 incident. She actually admitted to me that she told our MC that she was missing him when she went alone to MC. She says she no longer has any desire to talk to him. He tried to call a couple of times and she played me the voicemails. She then changed her cell phone number to avoid any more calls.

I do worry about the last part of what you wrote - what if OM calls and says hey I miss you or something to that effect. Will we be right back in the same situation as 2 months ago. I guess this is the burden that all BS have to live with.

I should be making more of an effort to watch her - but I just feel like if he is who she really wants - then so be it. She is home most of the day while I'm working so its pretty hard to watch her every minute. Having been busted before I'm sure she would be real careful if she wanted to see him again. I feel like I can't keep fighting for someone who doesn't want me. I admire people on here who Plan A and B when their WS leave them for the OP but I don't think I'm that strong. Hopefully I won't have to find out.

We did a NC phone call the 1st time. Obviously did not work that well. Not sure if a letter would make any difference at this time. Wife wants absolutely nothing to do with OM and says she only really thinks about him when I bring up stuff.