Nope, I didn't really support her. I just did favors, ran errands, bought groceries, alchohol, helped her with part of an old used car and camper. I probably spent somewhere around a fifth to a tenth of that total, and the money came from a trust from my Dad that was not community property. Nevertheless, it was the sneaking and lies and betrayal and destruction of trust and running away from my wife that was so devastating to her and to me, not the money I spent. It wouldn't make any difference if I had not spent a penny on OW. It would have been every bit as monstrous and criminal. Nevertheless, a post-nuptial agreement would be a way of restoring some measure of trust and a sense of safety for her. I am so confident of my intentions to restore this M and remain faithful, that I would not hesitate to do a post-nuptial agreement like that. It presents no real risk to me.

One thing that I have re-discovered is how simply incredible my W is in every way. To think that I have hurt her in this way and jeopardized our M and future for that low-life, manipulative woman is simply inconceivable.

You're right, it's NOT about the money. It's about doing whatever you can to make her feel safe and to prove you're serious about changing your behavior permanently.

I wouldn't bother trying to convince her. I'd see an attorney, get it drawn up, and give it to her as a gift. When you give it to her, tell her you know a marriage is more than the financial aspects, but you're trying to show her in every way possible that you're serious about protecting the marriage.

I hate to harp on this, but this thing all just tastes wrong to me.

I don't believe that a 6 year affair with 'love' being thrown around ends 90 days ago only upon discovery, and a wayward has this instantly remorseful a response.

Sorry GM, but I think you are using that brain power and dominance to game your wife on this board. You are saying all this stuff to her in person, no doubt, with dubious response. Saying it on an anonymous message board she reads doesn't give it more believability. Hemming about a lie detector was also a flag.

I think this is a 61 year old wickedly smart guy who is in comfortable retirement and doesn't want to see half his assets walk away.

PS: I've been on this board nine years and maybe I've had this feeling twice in 500 cases...

If I was your BW reading this, I would ask the community to help her compile a list of questions of you about the affair.

Then I would get you to put full, complete answers in writing and sign it.

Then i would go to a polygrapher, and if there was a millimeter of falseness in your written answers, I'd serve you right on the spot.

I am trying to be polite here, Mike. Your suspicions are understandable but are a projection from your personal experience. I am looking for support and guidance, not discouragement.

Your recommendations are something I would follow if my wife asks for it. Then I would have no problem with it. There is an awful lot about our 26 years together that you do not, and cannot know, and you cannot know the feelings in my heart or hers, only the bitter taste of your own experiences. The sadness and pain my wife is feeling are more than enough to fuel the kind of suspicion you are advising. She does not need your interpretation to achieve a lack of trust in me. In fact, she would write the exact same thing you did right now.

We will work this marriage into success using the methods of Marriage Builders and drawing on the support of everyone here, not on the discouragement of some. In time, you will understand that you misinterpreted this, and we will be friends on this forum.

Why was this not community property???

EVERYTHING in a M should be community property. Please make this change NOW. The ATTITUDE that comes with the idea of "community property" vs. "non-community property" is helpful in derailing a M and is very indicative of selfish beharior as well as IBs.

Get started on the post-nup even if your W is not currently "on-board" with it. Once it is drawn up and she sees your sincerity, she WILL appreciate it.

GM,

You are probably right, they are a projection of my personal experience. But they are also the experience of reading here since 1999. In my opinion and experience, waywards don't turn on a dime like this unless they are still juggling the other affair, or have a sudden whap about the financial reality of divorce.

Plus, some of this just doesn't add up. You were buying OW small items like alcohol but only drawing that accounting from a personal trust? Amazing integrity for someone in an affair. She was using you for sex and financial support, but when pushed you said there was little or no financial support? So she was using you for sex? Oh, narcisstic men hate that. She's such a dirtbag!

Maybe you're a data outlier or amazing at masking your feelings. But you are very smart.

I'd like to hear your wife's side.

Actually, let me amenad that is case I'm being a jerk.

If you would be willing to take all the community property and sign it over to her in an ironclad post-nup including a lot of triggers like contact with OW and any hidden contact with other women, and take the lie detector with all the questions in advance, I'd believe your sincerity.

That could all be done by Wednesday.

Something tells me there would be stalling and weaseling there, tho.

Mike_C may be jaded but his observations are valid.

Green, how come you didn't go through all the fog that all other WS's go through? How come you were able to stop cold-turkey this 6-year affair that you said was true love? If you have an addictive personality, are you experiencing withdrawal?

Did your counselor diagnose you as NPD? Because I thought a true narcissist would almost never admit to being a narcissist... unless of course they admit to being the best narcissist ever! LOL

Just in case you are sincere... don't let our skepticism discourage you. Prove us wrong.

My husband had three affairs in our marriage, that I know of. The middle one lasted about 4 yrs...on and off.

We have recovered well and I don't think he will be tempted to get involved in another affair.

I believe that you are sincere and that you really want to have a wonderful marriage with your wife from here on out. It is possible but not without lots of work and attention given.

MB weekend and counseling as has been advised. You can do this, GM. Don't let others dissuade you.

OK GM,

THIS quote right here is BS...and I don't mean betrayed spouse.....there is NO FREGGIN way you only spent $10,000 to $20,000 on a 6 year relationship.....NOT POSSIBLE.....my H was in his affair for only 6 months, and if you want to throw out the rent on his condo he moved into for that time and the money spent on the business him and COW were going to do together, the bill still runs around....$10,000. So you cannot begin to convince me that you only spent $20,000 on this woman.....

Also, a trust from your dad IS community property in a MARRIAGE. That quote is going back to your "slave/master" ways you have done this marriage thus far, and lets remind you again "How did THAT work for you???".....

So, EVEN IF your wife says the money doesn't matter (which it may not at this point in time, BUT it may come up later....you wife is only BEGINNING to put pieces together and looking at this.....) do the post-nup yourself. This will go a long way to show your sincerity, and if the money issue comes up later, you two will already have this issue dealt with.....

That being said, I may have been hard on you BUT at this point in time, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt....but you will be 2x4'ed when needed...

not2fun

GM, turtlehead's post was perfect and I HIGHLY recommend you take in every word.

Early into recovery I went to an attorney, and with his help, put together a post-nup agreement. In this agreement my wife receives 100% of the cash value of all our assets and 100% of the cash value of all my business/trust assets.

It was never about the money for my wife, it was about providing her with some form of security if I were to ever have another A or leave her again. She knew I would never take this step if I were not sincere. Thus it also restored some of the trust I had completely destroyed.

There are only a few outward signs of sincerity and just compensation that can be shown to a BS. So anything available that can aid in restoring trust and security needs to be acted upon by YOU.

Keep in mind, drafting a post-nup may require upwards of a month or more for an attorney to research and complete, depending on where you live. This is not a common document and the case law is fairly new. I also recommend that your attorney work for your wife as his client, representing Her interests only. It does matter!

Jeez, I don't know if I'd spend a month of attorney's fees.

I'm not an attorney, but it would seem to be that this agreement would be easy to attack on fairness and whether it was signed under duress (threat of divorce).

Here is an interesting link:

http://marriage.about.com/od/agreements/a/postnuptial.htm

If I were Mrs. GM, I would have him sign something slapped together ASAP, then fine tune it later.

See if he signs...

Jayne, Dr. Harley say's many affairs end in a natural death and there is little or no fog or withdraw as a result.

My own affair ended like this.

When I read greenmiles wife's thread, It was obvious to me that his A was nearly dead upon discovery.

Mike, attorneys have back logs, other clients, research and fine tuning to do BEFORE they complete a document. Unless they want sued for malpractice they execute the documents perfectly the FIRST time.

tst, no matter what is now said, his first post said it was a six year affair that "ended on discovery three months ago".

Yes Mike I know. What's your point?
His A was nearly dead upon discovery! And his wife confirmed this on HER thread.


Mike, why are you so critical of greenmile?
He is here for help in becoming a FWH and you are attacking him instead of leading him to marriage building resources.

Ok, everyone but me seems to know who his wife is :-)

I've explained my skepticism here. And I'm not someone that jumps every wayward. I just get the feeling his posts here are to spin his reading wife, not ask for help.

EDIT: Ok, figured out the W. Have to do some reading.

nope, I don't know either.....

not2fun

"I do not trust this man, he lies too easily and too well. "



Reading her story, I think the guy just checked her cache and followed her to this site to continue his control.

Oh, and NC wasn't three months ago, he kept in contact until a month or so, as far as his poor wife can find out.

And according to her he spent a TON of money on OW. AND gave BW gonnorhea. AND basically the OW was more of a wife than her.

I'm not sure if I'm breaking some bizarre board confidentiality but he is reading his wife's thread and she is reading this so I'm not sure what the charade is worth.

This one is a whitewash if you read the facts on the other one. So for anybody to defend him here is to not have the picture. He wants the community to defend him here based on his version of history and give hopeful advice for his BW to read and re-think her own advice and instincts.

Well, anyway, I wish the poor woman wisdom and strength. But this thread is BS and I don't mean betrayed spouse.

Actually irrevocable trusts don't work like that. They can't become community property because they don't belong to either party in the marriage. They are owned by the Trust document as designated by who created the trust, in this case my dad. It is actually remnants of his IRA, but entered the trust on his death. The trust documents make if for my "benefit", but I don't own it, so it cannot become community property or my wife's or mine.