Yes, he has the original one I sent before. When he left, I told him to refer to it for a path home and how to communicate to me. I told him that I would no longer communicate with him directly. He said he knew I didn't mean it, and I said I did.

My goal is to maintain a dark Plan B. No direct communication whatsoever with WH. And work on me -- doing stuff with the kids, keeping busy, getting out, exercising, eating healthy, praying, etc. I also need to figure out a way to earn some $ that won't negatively affect me should we start D.

If something comes up regarding boundaries, I will post again for advice. And if there is ever any discussions regarding him coming home again, I will post for help. I will not negotiate with WH ever again.

And if D papers happen to arrive, then I will cross that bridge when I get to it!!

Thanks for your help.

you were right your situation is so similar to mine, except for the false recovery (I had only one). My WH has never showed interest in coming back. And he lives in his brothers empty condo, so I agree with the vacation thing. I think he loves it. No responsibilities except his job and seeing his son occasionally.

I know exactly what you are going thru. all I can offer for now is my support. Hang in there.

Well make it thru this together whether M does or not.

Here's an update since last post. WH and DDs are currently at war via text messaging. WH walked out 2 weeks ago and has made no attempt to visit kids except to send sporatic "I love you," "Time will heal all," "My decision to leave Holyheart has nothing to do with you," "Blah, blah, blah" messages.

Teenage DDs are angry at WH and are letting him have it. They are attacking the A, the OW, his lying, his breaking of promises, his intent to D, his lack of caring, etc. He, in return, is saying "I am your Father. You will respect me. I will not take this talk from you or anyone else. Blah, blah, Blah."

As I am in deep Plan B this time (Yes, Mel, I'm really doing it!), I can't respond. He did send me one text message that I read -- "U need to read what the girls sent me today. I told you not to get them involved in our deal. I won't be talked to or text by the girls. There will be repercussions for their actions." Oh, yeah, and another one the other day "You probably need to get your kids some counseling. Think they may need to deal with some anger issues." MY kids!!!

My response to first message "I do not know what you are talking about. The girls are not even home." No response to 2nd message.

Yeah...I should not have even responded. But what I really wanted to say is "What do you expect, you POS? You caused this to happen -- you and your A. You broke up their family and they are scared and angry. You did this. You lied to all of us. You have sacrificed me and our kids to pursue OW. I hate you!!!"

But, I didn't. I just want to stay out of it. I have protected WH long enough. During this year, I have tried to maintain peace between WH and the kids. But, no more.

As for the D, WH told FIL on Friday that he is moving ahead on filing. Says it will bring "closure" to everyone once that is done. Funny, during the year, he said that he kept going back to OW because there was never any "closure." Last time he broke it off with her and moved out, he wrote NC letter saying that he "could never D Holyheart and the kids." His IC said that that wasn't a good way to end it -- leaving a letter and moving out. IC suggested that he talk face to face with her, and he did. So much for following NC.

I find it hard to believe that starting D with me, and kids in a rage, and family and friends up in arms, and going against God and the way he was raised, and sticking with OW and her 3 kids and all her baggage will finally bring him closure. I will not go away quietly!

Hi HH,

Your Subject Line about Plan B being a vacation for a WS is an interesting one.

Of course it looks that way to the BS, but I'm sure that you are aware that though most WS are capable of being such "sweethearts" to their OP, they won't always be that way.

So rest assured that it won't be all roses for them.

I also understand the fear of going dark because it makes you feel like you are just letting the adulterers frolic in their "love" and solidifying their relationship. But again, as many people have pointed out to you, they are entirely selfish beings and when they start to step on each other's toes, it really busts up their fantasy.

As for looking at your WH's TMs, in plan B, you actually aren't supposed to do that, nor should you respond.

Easy to say, hard to do I know.

I am now in a type of plan B, though I have been divorced for 4 months.

Mostly because I cannot stand the person my WXH has become and the fact that he got back together with the original OW (after breaking up once for 2 months then again for about 4 months). He has been taking my DS to spend the night at her house with him for the last 2 weeks.

It's not fun at all.

So, I don't respond to his emails unless they are child related and he doesn't really contact me anymore anyway.

But in your case, in order to stop your love bank from draining out entirely, you need to get an IM and not read his TMs.

His attempts to get you to coparent and make his kids respect him is really stupid since he isn't worthy of respect and decided he didn't want to be a husband and full time dad.

I just hate coparenting with a WXH, especially when they involve the OP who helped wreck your family and now wants to take your place in it (excuse me while I vomit )....it really is awful.

Our situations are pretty similar (being with our H's since the age of 15 and them claiming they "missed out" on "oat-sowing"...bleh).

So I feel for you.

I am in the anger phase at this stage and hate that too. I just try to avoid even seeing him at all and have my mom at my home for visitations etc.

I wish I would have been less stubborn about needing to know every little thing and not going dark sooner.

It might have prevented a lot of heart ache I have experienced by knowing every litte detail (yes, my WXH liked to share with me as if we were best friends...he even said once "So when I can talk to you about my girl problems" shortly before the divorce was final.)

I pray God will give you the strength to do what HE would have you to do in this situation and the peace that passes all understanding.

Blessings,

Sara

Update on the text message war between WH and teenage DDs. The messages have stopped, but WH is really angry at the disrespect shown towards him. Yesterday, DD16's car was in the shop being repaired and WH was taking care of the arrangements. But instead of returning the car, he sent a message via IM that the car would be held hostage until Holyheart called him to discuss a "parenting issue" re: DD. I assume this means the text messages.

I had DD call him but he didn't return her call so the car wasn't returned. Today, I had IM give message that Holyheart had nothing to say and that if it was in regards to the text messages that he needed to talk directly with DD "father to daughter." WH then complained to the IM about DD's attitude.

Give me a break. All teenagers have an attitude. But angry teenagers whose father walks out on them multiple times earn a right to voice their views. Especially since POWS is such a coward that he's stayed away from his kids for 16 FREAK'IN days. What does he expect? And he thinks I'm poisoning the kids. How can I do that? They are old enough to know that WH has blown it yet again to fix the situation, that WH is selfish, and that WH is to blame for the destruction of a once normal, loving family.

I'm trying to remain as dark as possible, but it's times like this that I want to get in WHs face and scream "what a fu*$ing idiot you are. Don't you see what you are doing to me and the kids?" And my LB starts to empty......and I remind myself that this is alien WH and not H.......and then it stops.

OK -- I need to vent.

17 FREAK'IN days and he hasn't seen the kids. See what I mean about Plan B being a vacation for him? No wife, no kids, no house maintainence, etc.

And I just checked the credit cards. Seems WH had a lovely time whooping it up in Vegas with POSOW over New Year's. Nice resturants, jewelry store, hotel, etc.

OK -- I'm in plan B, but I have to check the credit cards. And if he's running amuck financially, shouldn't I stop the bleeding and proceed to Plan D? Right now, he's paying all the bills. But "paying" might mean putting on our line of credit and I don't want to get stuck with half of this especially if large chunk has been to finance the A.

And what a POWS. He couldn't even go Christmas shopping for the kids. Wouldn't even meet me at a store to pick out a gift. Didn't even buy me anything although he was living here at the time. Then leaves 2 days after Christmas and buys her jewelry!! What a show off. Gosh, I want to pull him off his high horse. Goodness know how much this 18 mo. affair has already cost us.

I've been at this over a year. He's spent about half of last year with OW and about half here with his family. But, realistically, he's been with OW the entire time. He doesn't want his family -- he wants OW and a playboy lifestyle.

I'm only 17 days into Plan B this time. And I'm trying to stay as dark as possible. But I hate him right now. I hate him so much.

Do I just need to be patient at the moment and let reality hit? Or do I at least start making appointments with As to see where I stand? I've always maintained that he be the one to put the last nail in the coffin -- file for D. I didn't want that on my conscious. But I don't know any longer. Maybe I need to change it up a bit and take control.

No, you should not be patient at all! In plan B you should protect your finances.

What is your status? Are you legally separated? Do you have a lawyer?

Cut him off financially and if that is impossible, keep a careful record of everything he spends.

Don't let your IM tell you anything about what your WH says. You should only have information from him if something really important happens.

I don't know how to handle your children. They should be comfortable speaking to you about their feelings but you don't want to hear any crap about WH. Try to tell them that you want peace at home and no wayward mess.

Plan B is not a vacation for WS, make him feel that.

HH, reading your sitch, mine is very similar except no false or any recovery at all.

My H took his OW to Vegas also for the new year and has been spending thousands of dollars since A started.

Depending on the state you live in you need to get legal advice.

Always ask first if the consultation is free. (some charge).

In my state all debt and savings are community property and you have to divide by 1/2. Protect yourself.

My D15 has not seen her father since 12/22, this is after a 2 week of being in contact with him prior and previous 5 week of not seeing him again.

For a teenager who thought her father was her hero, this has been hell. I understand how your children are feeling.

I also see your point of the H and OW being on vacation, but I also agree the longer they are put together it takes away some of the romance and more of the reality.

As for finances, WH is still paying all the bills. I had him sign something to that effect when he left another time during the year. Yeah -- it's not legal, but at least he's kept up that.

I'm in a no fault, 50-50 state, so an attorney advised me to stay married, even if just on paper, as long as possible because D would result in only part of bills being paid.

Also, due to my kids being teenagers, child support would only be enforced until 18 so it's better to stay married.

Currently, I'm unemployed (had to unload my business due to economy) but working sporadically at "pick up" jobs. I'm starting a real part-time job in a few weeks though.

I'm scared since WH told FIL that he's filing papers soon and coming up with a starting point for mediation. He said that what he's proposing will be way better than anything I could get if we go to court and use attorneys. But I know he's being directed by OW (the 2 time divorcee loser) and she's a pro at taking spouses to the cleaners.

And I'm still staying dark. But it get harder the angrier I become.

So he still pays the bills, good job!

If you believe what the attorney said, that this is your best deal, then stick to it. Otherwise do something about it. Ask people here for advice, there is lots of experience here (unfortunately).

I wouldn't believe so easily what the WS says. Remember, his loyalties are not with you anymore. Check out you options.

And stay dark, that is don't accept any information from him.

Back to finances in Plan B...

Just looked at another website with clues as to whether or not your spouse will ultimately leave you due to an affair. One big factor is whether or not family money is being used to finance the A or the OP.

He!!, yeah, WH has used tons of money this past year to finance the A and for OW. I have copies of credit card transactions to prove it. And it scares the sh*# out of me that this is happening. I've called the credit card company re: getting copies of 2008 transactions. Have to wait until Feb. to request year-end info.

Questions for you who have gone through or are going through D.
Can proof of family funds being used to support A or for OW help out the BS? WH has complained that we are in debt due to my lack of a job. But when all is said and done, the real factor is that for over a year, he's been funneling $ to OW and living high on the hog to impress her.

I've gathered whatever info. I can at this point. But during a D, will credit card statements even matter? And should I just let it go at this point because once D starts (which he says he's in the process of filing), won't all statements have to be made available to me? And then can I submit them as evidence of misappropriation of family funds? WH says he wants to go the mediation route, and I, of course, want to drag it out as long as possible to see if the fog ever lifts.

My thinking is that if I have too much information available "up front", then I speed up the process. For instance, we start the process and I mention that I feel that funds have been spent on OW. Mediator would ask for back up. We request credit card back up and then I need time to search through all the transactions to verify each one. So we would have to set up another meeting to allow me to request statements and review. Or is that not how it works?

Unfortunately, I'm a very efficient and organized person. But I'm willing to forego these traits if it drags out the process.

At the moment, I have evidence that our joint credit card has been used for hotel rooms, resturants, clothing, jewelry, gas, dentist, tanning, hair salon, and OWs business.

Do you have any way of showing when he moved out or left? Might even be good to show it each time if hes spending that crazy. It might help to establish when he was gone that way financially it will show hes been draining your finances.

Are you keeping a journal on the visits and phone calls. I know when he calls DS10 because he calls the house but I have DD17 tell me at the end of the day if he contacted her day and I log it all. I write down D called or No visit on scheduled day. You should have this 17 day no visit gap in a journal that way if he tries to get a larger share of custody it will be harder for that to happen when the judge sees he hasn't even been visiting or contacting. Please do this if you haven't. Custody also effects how much monetarily you will receive.

Please, please, please don't break your Plan B. Your H is expecting you to cave and I think its crucial in your case to really stick to your PB because of all this waffling back and forth. I think that if the OW is that much of a loser then its probably going to an end eventually but will you still be open to it is the question. Another thing I like about the PB(well truth be told I freaking HATE IT LOL) but it gives you your self respect and dignity back. It allows you to care for yourself and gives God time to work on the H while you are out of the way.

Yep, got the spiral binder to document contact with the kids. I was told that since the kids are over 13, they will be able to say which parent they want to have custody. WH has said in the past that he didn't want any, but with money being tight, and OW being a pro at D and custody, I'm sure he'll fight for some if it saves him money.

And we're now at day 21 with no visit. And I'm working hard to maintain a dark Plan B. I have been tempted to call him when I get angry -- but tonight -- after falling asleep on the couch -- I just hoped that I'd get a text from him saying that he misses me or that we need to talk. I just want him to really, really miss me.

I think that WH believes that OW needs him and he wants to rescue her. And I think he feels responsible for leading her on this past year. He's said she's had a hard life with 2 divorces, 3 kids, and being on her own for awhile. He doesn't realize that he's turning me into her. Now I'm the single parent with 3 kids who's been abandoned. I'm the one with the hard life. I'm the one who's been treated like crap for over a year. Yep -- I now need rescuing. And not just me, but his own flesh and blood -- our kids. He's dumped them, too.

And would I ever take him back? Not unless I saw Godly remorse. Godly remorse, humility, shame, and guilt have been missing during each of the false recoveries. I'm learning about what true recovery is by reading other threads. I won't be fooled again. He will WANT to come back -- not that I'm making him come back. He will WANT to stay away from OW -- not that I'm making him stay away. He will WANT to do everything under the sun to help me heal -- not just deal with his own hurt.

And his own hurt has always been the topic upon his returns. It was still "all about him" and his pain and his loss. It was never about me and the kids and our pain and our loss. That, my friend, is the key. Giving of himself instead of living for himself.

HELP VETS --

Just got served. And WH is asking of joint custody of kids he abandoned 24 days ago and has yet to see.

What do I do besides prepare a response?

Get yourself to an attorney.


Make sure you take this info with you. He could be made to pay you back for 1/2 of what he's spent on OW. Are you in a community property state?

The only reason he's asking for custody is to reduce his CS.

DO NOT GO THE MEDIATION ROUTE. If WH wants a divorce, let him fight for it. Mediation is about everyone agreeing, la la la. It does costs less in the long run, but is that really your primary concern right now?

Do you live in a state with fault divorce? Countersue him for divorce on the grounds of adultery and abandonment if those options are available to you. That's why you need to see an attorney.

Don't give up. He hasn't seen the reality of what abandoning his family is going to cost him.

(((Holyheart)))

Thanks for helping, PM.

I'm in no-fault, 50/50 state.

I did do some research re: mediation. Seems I can stop it at anytime and get an attorney and go the traditional route.

Plan to check box in response that I want him to pay for one. Also will check boxes re: 100% custody and spousal support.

Any advice as to what to say if WH calls? I'm Bing my butt off, but want to be ready with a good response -- "I don't want D, want to keep family together, blah, blah, blah..." Or do I get IM to express my disappointment at being served, and something about me fighting to save my M?

I don't want D. He's rushing it for me.

Does anyone think I should break Plan B to respond to papers? WH told his parents that he needs closure and D is the best for everyone. Oh -- and OW has nothing to do with D. He hasn't been happy in 10 years. News to me!!!

And I haven't told the kids yet. Want to wait until after the weekend.

HELP -- I need a plan.

By responding to the papers you are not breaking plan B. You are doing what you have to do. If you didn't respond, you would be SOL cause WH could then get pretty much whatever he wants from divorce.

When you speak to your lawyer, they will be dealing with it, not you. You will not be dealing at all with WH, so you won't be breaking plan B. Stay in it. He is trying to get you to break it. Don't do it!!

ITA! Let the attorneys or the mediator handle ALL communications.

About the no-fault state, Texas is a no-fault state too, YET they do have adultery as grounds. Some say it can effect the outcome of the division of property. I wonder if your state might have something similar.

Hope, I KNOW you're hurting badly right now and you have visions if you could just GET to WH and MAKE him understand that this is just WRONG that he will/might see the light. Please don't give in to this urge.

What to tell your children? The truth! (in an age-appropriate way).

Good for you for going for 100% custody. WH has more or less abandoned them. In Texas there are LAWS and CONSEQUENCES for doing that, as in those are grounds to even terminate parental rights. I've been looking at that because of my daughter's situation. Maybe there's something like that where you are.