I haven't been on here for a while because my H and I have come a long way in the recover from his EA. Over the past several months, I have finally been feeling what I needed from him for the past 2 years.

Well......We just got back from a long weekend away with many members of my aunt's family...cousins, spouses, etc. These are local relatives and we see them several times a year. The first night we had a great time. The second day, something very strange hit me when my H held back from walking with me to talk to my cousin's wife. No big deal until a short while later, something strange hit me again when he made a comment to her to not forget her gloves. I would have likely ignored the first instance but the second one just made me feel like there was something different in the way he said it.

Later that night, we're in the kitchen and, while she is talking, I notice him staring at her for a long time. The conversations end and everyone except her leaves the kitchen. My H turns around and goes back to talk to her for a couple minutes.

Eventually, a member of the family wants to gather some of us together to play a game. He and I get up and cross the room. "She" doesn't come. He tells me he's not playing and to please not give him a hard time about it. He says he'll watch. I ask him to sit beside me but he won't. I ask him a few times. Another family member asks him and he again refuses. A short time passes and "she" comes over and says, come on...you and me, meaning that they should both play. Without hesitation, he comes over and sits beside me.

Later, "she" goes to her rented condo next door to get more beer. While she's gone, my H says that he's going to go to our condo to get more wine. I stalled him so they went separately.

The next day, he makes a comment that he doesn't see her in the ski area.

My stomach has been in a knot for 3 days and I've made myself sick. The last time I had an instinct this strong was over a year ago and, after 5 days of lying to me, he finally confessed that he had lied. I haven't asked him about this yet because, if he denies it, I will have no way of knowing the truth. I sense that he had an interest in her and I have no way to know unless he tells me.

We are home now. What should I do? These could be innocent events as well as something to watch out for in my opinion. Does anyone have any feeling one way or the other?

You need to let him know that these events bothered you and 'triggered' old feelings with the past. And he needs to not talk with this 'other women' since it bothers you.

Be honest with him so he will have an opportunity to STOP doing the things that make you uneasy. I agree he is being sneaky and your instincts are giving you warning signals. I would also start doing some serious sleuthing.

How many affairs has he had?

Hi Melody,

I'm glad you're here. I remember you from my previous posts.

I only know of the one EA. I did confront him about this last night and, as expected, he became very defensive and irritated. I don't bring up issues very often because we are making progress, but when I do, he is ALWAYS defensive and irritated. This time, however, I did not tell him the details I told you. I just asked if there was anyone (that day) that he felt an "interest" in and I did not tell him who I suspected. I was afraid that, if this was real, he would be able to hide this from me in the future. I did not sense anything coming from her. He said there was and is no one he has an interest in, and that he has "tried so hard" to show me that he only wants to be with me but that I "always think that he is looking for something else." Well, that, of course, is not true but my antennas ARE always on the lookout for unusual behavior. This is why I have trouble separating what might be a triggered anxiety or a real instinct.

He insisted that he had not done anything and later told me that he "will never do that to me as long as we're together". He sees these discussions as arguments (because he always becomes angry) and says that he is tired of arguing. Issues do not come up often, but when they do, I always end up feeling worse in the end because he becomes so defensive. Later, he will cool down and then apologize. This is how our night ended last night.

I want to think that I imagined all this, but if that's true, then I have had a major setback. What do you mean by sleuthing? If you mean snooping, I have never stopped and have never found anything.

Since this, imagined or not, has now reached into my family, I am extremely uncomfortable with the idea of being around them again. My H has taken the extreme road and says that he will never go to functions with my family again so I am not to ask. This was during the time that he was frustrated.

I don't know how to determine what happened here. I tried not saying anything so that I could observe. But I made myself so sick that I could not continue. There are no future plans to be around her for a while so I'm left to sort these feelings out, but I really don't know how.

It has always been my experience that if someone gets overly defensive, they have something to hide. Considering your past experience with him, you have every right to be sensitive to suspicious behavior. Don't allow him to make you feel "crazy," or that your feelings are not legitimate. He should be lovingly trying to prove that nothing is going on with another person. HE is the one who did wrong and it's kind of like relationship cancer; once you've had it, you have to question any ache or pain, no matter how small, for the rest of your life.

Do you think that there is something to be suspicious of based on what I've stated? Or do you think there is a chance that I am overreacting? How do I tell?

I'm not sure if you're over-reacting but I sense that your FWH is becoming/has been very frustrated and may be thinking that you're NEVER going to let this go. I read some of your earlier posts and it seems like you've been dealing with this for quite some time.

I think a time has to come when you begin to let his past remain in the past. You can't have a marriage where he feels like there's a hammer hanging over his head ready to drop the minute he crosses over the line.

You need to decide for yourself just how much is too much. It sounds like he WAS flirting with your cousin's wife but has become immune to your complaints because he hears about it so much.

How about sitting him down one more time, telling him what triggers you, and then LETTING IT GO. If he continues to do these things with no regard for your feelings, then you know where you stand. You have to decide what to do then. You can't MAKE him do the necessary work. You can only enforce YOUR boundaries.

I recognize myself in you. I was all over the map during the first couple of years of recovery (from PAs) and it seemed like I could always find SOMETHING that I didn't like that he was doing (even if it WAS innocent). I almost lost my marriage AGAIN.

I'm not saying to put up with it. I'm saying to decide once and for all what your boundaries are, relay that to your FWH and then go from there.

SoLost,

Nothing you said sounds odd. His defensiveness and anger speaks volumes. If I wasn't doing anything with anyone, I'd react with disappointment, not anger, that my W was still afraid I was longing for someone else.

But I also think you should be open with him. He has poor boundaries, from what you describe.

Princessmeggy, you're absolutely right. He does frequently say that he feels like he can't make me happy because "there is ALWAYS something". That was repeated last night. That's my dilemma.

I feel that I have pretty much let go of the past - that being the EA. But what I feel so hung up on is the fear that he will lie and/or cheat again. I explained this to him last night. I think this may be an ongoing issue with me, because he blatantly lied to me for 5 days over a year ago when a woman called his cell phone - I was later told that she had come on to him & wanted him to come to her house. Yet...short version here...he would not "end" contact with this woman until I made him. He wanted to "do it his way so that I didn't take over". One week later, when he had done nothing, I took over.

If he leaves me one day, then so be it. What I cannot take is being lied to. I feel like I have PTSD in that area.

This event hit me so unexpectedly that I didn't know what to do. I don't want to end our M if the problem is ME. Our good times are very good now. I had felt a positive change in his over the past several months until this event. He still treats me the same but now I have this intense fear in my heart once again.

In this instance, I don't know what my boundary would have been. I don't know what he was talking to her about and if it was innocent. I'll think about what you said. I know that I have myself to work on most but I am not as strong as I want to be.

Pomdbd3, I also agree with you. If I wasn't doing anything wrong, I'd maybe feel frustrated but also disappointed, definitely not angry. I'd try to convince and convince and convince him of my feelings and why my heart was with him and why I want to be with him. I guess I expect and want these things from him but I only get frustration and anger. I tell him that I can progress SO much further and quicker if we have an adult discussion - doesn't happen.

So that's why I'm still here. We remain on the roller coaster and I want off - with a happy ending!

Hi LnH,

So sorry you find yourself back here but it is good to seek out other opinions and advice and this is a good place for it.

I read your first post twice and I would have been very bothered if my DH had behaved like that even pre-A but after you have gone through the agony of infidelity together,it is even more thoughtless. The actions without the defensiveness would have been bad enough but defensiveness to the hurt feelings of someone you are supposed to love is always a red flag to me.

How about a simple, "I'm sorry for acting in a way that hurt you or made you anxious." It does not sound to me as though he is willing to do whatever it takes to help you to heal from his unfaithfulness. Has he been cooperative about R? Has he been willing to go outside of his comfort zone to help you to trust him again? Transparency? Counseling? MB principles?

I think the answers to those questions will help you decide if he is just dense and thoughtless or "looking."

God's Blessings,

Say

He has definitely made changes for the better. Transparency? He doesn't like me looking at his phone or e-mail behind his back. Of course, I do it anyway! What's the point in him watching me watch him?? But I haven't found anything suspicious.

If he reacted the way you say, we'd be in a very different place right now. He can be sensitive to my needs when it doesn't involve him. When he feels anything coming in his direction, he goes to defensive mode. The discussions become about how much he's doing and I keep finding something wrong. He has never addressed the pain that I am going through at the time or how I can look at the situation a different way or anything! I think he's uncomfortable that he's caused me this much pain but his defensiveness gets in the way every time. Once he calms down, he can be sensitive but the frustration is still there.

Unfortunately, a lot of the changes he has made became temporary. He's good for a while and they slowly slip back to the way they were. I'm referring to things are not necessarily bad but would help me heal. He is definitely not 100% committed to "do what it takes". He is willing to do what he is willing to do. When he slips back, he has an excuse.

But all in all, he has cooperated and dealt with R. Just not perfectly.

His personality seems very similiar to my DH. I believe that our M is fully R and is even better and stronger than it has ever been. He has a problem fully embracing MB but he is doing very well with his modified version. I have already decided if I see any signs whatsoever of reverting to pre A marital conditions, we start C with the Harleys. Can you afford to do that? Would he agree?

God's Blessings,

Say

I believe he would go to counseling. It's me that has been turning away from it because of failures in the past with counseling efforts in areas involving our children. It seemed to be a big waste of time and we got nowhere. I'm sure it would be different with the Harleys.

Personally, Harleys aside, I feel that I get much more help here than I would with a counselor, and I get it when I need it - not a week later.

I say his behavior is suspicious.

1. Maybe he was putting out feelers to see how your cousin's wife would react to flirting. If so, she didn't come right out and say "knock it off".

However, that's a pretty ballsy time to try and establish a new sexual relationship with a member of your wife's family. Barring mental disorders, any flirting between them points to an affair that has been ongoing...long before that particular family function.

2. Maybe you are out of your mind. Get out your tin foil hat so the aliens can't download your brain.


What bothered me most about your post was the fact that your H wouldn't even sit next to you, but CW (cousin's wife) asks and he's right there like a well-trained dog.

I'd watch him very closely. It sounds like he can probably cover his tracks well enough to make you believe you have full transparency.

Get a keylogger.

DO NOT fall for the "That's SICK! She's FAMILY!" act if you mention it to your H and he becomes defensive.

So_Lost,

I think I agree with Krazy on this one.

There seems to be more involved than just family relations.

It seems from what you posted that the "she" did not seem to be adverse to the attention and at times made herself available for it.

Where was your cousin, while this was going on? Where was cuz when "she" went to the condo for the booze?

And when she volunteered to play, so your H would sit by you, seems a little telling.

Does she live in the same town as you? How is cuz and "her" marriage going?

Did any of the relatives raise an eye-brow at the relationship? (if there was one) Did you happen to have any discussion with the family members about this?

Unless we are seeing this through "your paranoid eyeballs", you should stay alert.

Maybe keep tabs on the cousin's wife too, if possible.

IMHO

kirk

I believe your H is the one that needs the help! Is he coming here asking for ways to make you feel more secure and to reestablish trust in your M?

God's Blessings,

Say

My cousin was not there that day. He did not arrive until the next day. I did not tell anyone in the family about it, because I'm still trying to figure out what to do. They have had M problems in the past but I believe everything is ok right now. They only live a few miles from us but we have not been to their home. We usually see them at only family gatherings.

I've never had the feeling, and still don't, that there is a "relationship". The only feeling I got was that my FWH may have developed a sudden interest in her. I feel like it's possible that it's my paranoia at work, but I can't get rid of this gigantic knot in my stomach. That's what concerns me so much. I've been able to control my paranoia for the most part but this is different. That scares me!!!

I tried before to get my FWH to join us here because I would love for him to tell his side and to hear feeback from others on both sides. I believe it would help him help us. He did it one time a long time ago, wrote a fairly short post, and basically got nothing back. So that was the end of his attempt. He doesn't have an interest in searching on his own for ways to make things work. He thinks he's already doing everything and that the problem is me. I tell him what I need. He does the parts he agrees with to an extent. He prefers to hide his head in the sand.

When I approached him with this issue, his response was *sigh* let's get it over with. I'm sorry but that is not comforting.

Right now, we're both pretending nothing's wrong. I don't know what else to do. He has been VERY affectionate for the past 2 days, but this is also part of his new self. This is one of his ways to make things better (I'm not complaining). If he was honest, I could be ruining our recovery. If he was dishonest, I consider it a coverup. I'm 50/50 because I have no way to prove it one way or the other.