I find when arguing with a man, the man often will call the woman a b&tch, a c&&t, a wh&re, and a s&&t if she proves a point or, heaven forbid, stands up for herself. You see it in films all.the.time. I have yet to see a woman call a man 'mean'.

ETA: Look, SA, I understand your position. But you are using absolutes that are not valuable for either side. No one is telling her she is not partially to blame nor has work of her own to do. But just how long do you propose she give up all decision-making ability in her marriage? How long should she ask him permission before she goes potty? How long should she play June Cleaver before she expects something in return? Or is she not supposed to ever expect - or get - anything in return except for the gift of having a man in her home? And be darn-well happy with it, by god!

Just curious.

You said you see it in films all the time. That is your fantacy talking. Films are not real. I am talking real life relationships. The subject we are discussing is people calling him abusive. She does not have to ask him to go potty. That is being dramatic. He just wants some respect and common sense not to have a wife flirting online with a myspace profile while he is at work. If the man has to give up his life for her it is only fair she do it back and not make a fool of him instead. This guy was not going to be a sucker. For all we know there is another guy involved online she didnt mention.

She can listen to people telling her not to cater to him because they have an issue with men. When people love each other they cater and take turns catering. It's not all about the woman and whatever she does is the guys fault. When woman get to thinking that way they are lost. If she decides not to cater to him then she can go to bed with the pillow on her cheek instead of his chest. If she caters to him he might forgive her. He might want to make her happy also and never argue again. They both could realize many things or not.

And you are wrong. When a woman proves a point men will acknowledge it. They will even admit they are wrong if they are good guys. The sad part is women dont prove points often. They rely on frustration tactics to get the man to call her a bad name when he cant take his head feeling like it will explode anymore. Once the bad word comes out his mouth in the womans eyes she won the fight. And it didnt come from proving points. It came being good at pushing his buttons.

Hey Ms Anna....I truly hope you are doing ok. This stuff is so very hard and I hope you continue to come here for support. Please ignore Mr Austins one sided shallow replies. I cant understand why a person would post such negative comments to a website devoted to helping others. Just know there are people who truly understand where you are and want to help.

This is a very difficult journey, one that can bring even the strongest to their knees. There are no gaurentees that you will be able to save your marriage, but there are things you can do to definately improve your odds. First, you need to get a life. Since your H is not having an A (that you know of) then there is definately greater hope for you. By getting a life, you will give yourself the gift of self discovery. YOu will be able to find things that make you smile and give you confidence. This has the added bonus of creating mystery for your H. He will start to see the changes in you...he will wonder what has made you so much stronger. He is expecting you to be desperate and needy since he left. You were playing into that. Trust me, you need to do this. It will either help your husband see what a dynamic, wonderful, self confident woman he left or it will give you the tools that you will need to endure if he decides to leave.

Have you read Michelle Weiner's Divorce Busting? In your situation I would HIGHLY recommend it. There are wonderful suggestions on how to make a relationship work when only one partner is willing to try and make it work. I believe that the Harley's books are great as well, but still feel this is more suited to what you need.

Let your H make contact with you, do not reach out to him. He has a controlling personality so it is to your advantage to let him be the one to persue you. When you do have contact with him, make sure you are happy and light hearted....no relationship talks (for now). This will make you so much more attractive to him. Ms Anna, this truly is a test of how strong you can be. If things dont work out, please believe me when I say it is not your fault. You are the one here trying to fix things. You are the one seeking answers. No matter what, you will be the one who has grown from this. Keep posting so we can help.

She asked how to get him back. I told her. A man was called abusive. Her story had red flags. Wouldnt it be a shocker if it was my advice that got them back together? He can see her happy and confident yes but there is still the question of her not being worthy of his heart. A good man comes at a price. That price is being fair and not expecting him to live up to things that she isnt living up to.

Am I being negative or truthful? If women have behaviors they have to own up to them just like men. Plain and simple. I in fact want to see them back together. Some people here just dont want to see a man get his way. It is my hope she wants him back for the right reasons and not to pay half the bills.

What planet are you from?


From SteveAustin: Tell him you wont run in the bathroom and go number 2 right before he has to brush his teeth

You saying she has to - or wants to - 'run into' the bathroom before he brushes his teeth so she can stink up the room...which of us is in fantasy?

What did I miss? I remember her saying she opened up a myspace account for their FAMILY, not as a dating website. What did I miss?

In what way did he 'give up his life for her'? You are making no sense.

Forgive her for WHAT?

You are undoubtedly the strangest person I have encountered on MB. Want to share some more of your story so we can understand where that 3-ton pile of marble on your shoulder came from?

My ex used to time it out everyday. She could be home all day but knew what time I went to brush my teeth. Never fail when I was on my way to the bathroom she would run and beat me to the door and lay an egg. MY friends wife does it to him still. When he wakes and feels like he has to pee his pants. He hears his wife tell the kids to hurry up and run in the bathroom. Of course both our wives deny it but our brains work. I can be on the phone with him and hear the whole thing take place. Reminds me of being married. Admit it or not they do it on purpose.

Ask her yourself what you missed and she is not saying? I am on myspace and know how it is. I get dates from there. Her excuse could of been family webpage but she was trying to put herslef out there and he knew it. Whatever happened she is going to leave out any key points that will make people tell her she was wrong.

I am making no sense. I had to give up all my female friends when I got married. She gave me the games that women give when they are mad. I gave them up no problem. Guess what? She had male friends that were trying for her and trying to get her to cheat on me. I gave up my female friends for her and when her friends got out of line and asked her out I made her choose. That is fair. We each gave up our friends of the opposite sex for each other. Guess who got it rubbed in their face 19 years later? I did. I even asked her if she does not remember me having to give up my friends also. I dont want to hijack posters thread but I will talk till she comes back and updates us.

Forgive her for why he left and what we dont know that he does know.

I prefer unique. And many guys come to me for advice nowdays. A lot are being mistreated and dont even know it because they are so trained by their spouse.

MY ex wanted me to live by rules she didnt have to. And I was a dictator if I spoke out. She forgot one thing when she left me. She forgot I was a stud when she met me and that's why she married me. After 16 years of beating me down and belittling me. She forgot who I was. Now she has to realize that she left her own stud who didnt cheat for a manipulative geek. She diserves it. She should of worked off the good in the relationship instead of magnify the bad. Now look at her. She has the knowledge that my ex girlfriends are asking me out and even one of her friends. She dont know about her friend yet but we met up on a dating site. She chose to be sneaky and have a relationship when married to me. 19 years down the drain. Both our losses. At least my sex life is better now.

Question for the poster---He took his tv? When he bought the tv were you with him or was it his already? Did he have to get in an arguement in the store or anywhere to buy this tv or the size of it? I just wonder cause when my 27 in tv broke I got a public arguement in the store cause I wanted something bigger than another 27inch. It took 2 salesmen and myself to get her to agree. So I kept my tv too.

You are using some VERY unique and VERY strange personal experiences to paint all women with the same brush.
First, everyone I know has a myspace and not a single one looks for guys or girls, except the teenagers, of course. And they're single. Second, do you hear yourself? How ridiculously conspiratorial this sounds?

And I have never ever ever in my life heard of anyone but a 7 year old running into a bathroom (or telling others to) to ruin it for someone. For you to assume that because you and a friend had wives who did this that all women do this is exclusionary math. Get a grip.

Cat, honey, everyone who has posted to this thread has tried to call Steve out as one sided and judgemental. He is obviuosly very angry and instead of learning from his expirience, he tries to continue to pass on his brand of pain. The best thing you can do is ignore his post. You are just inviting him to respond with more spew. Ignore him and he will eventually get bored and go away.

Ms Anna, I truly hope these last few days are finding you better. Please post an update when you get a moment. ((HUGS))

Sure I am angry I am human. And what I learend from my divorce was it wasnt all me like the ex was saying. Believe me I learned. As far as the going number 2 stuff. It is true but obvious I wrote it for humor so look for your loophole elsewhere or ignore me. I think male and female know what I say rings true. Men have behaviors that are pointed out all the time. I simply am making the playing field even. For every action there is a reaction. We do not judge the reaction if the action is ignored.
I stand for what I believe enough to stay single if I must. It wasnt just a marriage that taught me what I know it was many relationships and viewing and listening to other people also and thousands of pages of reading material. All to often a female takes no blame when 50% is hers.

And about Anna's situation. A man does not move out on creation of a myspace account alone. I dont know the whole story. Maybe it was a certain friend on myspace. And myspace is what you make of it. I met a lot of women on myspace and it isnt me just asking them out. Myspace isnt a big deal. The big deal is she wouldnt give it up to make him more at ease. And lastly if she gets him back from what I suggested then I have helped her more than anyone. Her question was not what to do it was how to get him back. I am guessing the man isnt bad looking and can get women if he wants to. For him to make the move instead of deal with the bolonga he foresaw takes quit a guy. I only wish I would of done it also.

Anna if you want him back treat him like the man he is like when you first met him. Also if what I said doesnt work after you let him think about it there is a plan b and even a plan c if that dont work. Being sincere is the key.

Steve...

Don't Hijack this thread with your issues. I understand that MsAnna has said some things which have triggered your pain and feelings, but this is not the place to take it out on her. 2x4s are one thing... you are bringing down the whole house.

Let her have her thread... She needs it for herself. She came here just like you, looking for answers in some form or fashion. If you wish to beat on someone, there are several WS's on other threads who are looking to be raked over the coals in order to assuage some of their guilt. Go find them and beat them up.

idey, you're right. I'm just afraid someone will believe the crap he's spewing. But I'll stop. He's made such a fool of himself no one will take him seriously anyway.

MsAnna, where are you?

Do you really belive that? I think not.

Honestly, I'm not guilty of many of those things. I swore to never go on myspace, I promised to change my ways when it comes to doing what he says or thinks is right. I always have the house clean & if I need help I've asked. I've worked on my attitude as well. I've never compared or said he didn't measure up to anyone ever in fact i've told him many times he was everything i've always wanted, never withheld sex, always have make up on & a nice appearance, never in sweats, slept naked!, I probably never went #2 while he was even in the house!, had his own shelf in the restroom, guys nights-he probably could have had more, i'm not fat, i'm not ugly, i'm young & always have tried to cater to him.... he's still not here =(

Here I am... on a really bad day too...
It's been a little over a week that he's been out of the house now.

The plan was to not talk to the H for a month, til Feb 28, but I couldn't help it. I sent a text inviting him out, no response. I asked if he wanted to hang out-dinner or come over to our place. I sent pictures of myself-thinking maybe if he saw me it would spark something up, said no, he's not changing his mind. H said the pictures just make him think I'm sending pictures to other guys.WHAT OTHER GUYS!!??? He thinks that i want him to come over so we can sleep together & thinks just trying to get him to do it so I can get pregnant! ??!!!! we're in no position to be having kids & he knows very well that I was on the fence about having kids. we have 2 of our own from prev. but not 1 together.

The only other guy that was ever in this is DEAD!!! And he wasn't in it. I didnt cheat on him. the relationship with this person was over for years already.

so finally he just said to stop texting/calling that I am only hurting myself more.

meanwhile...I've been spending time with my friends, trying to keep busy, and my mind off of things-which only works for a while, then I just want to be home.

Today I found out that, he is going to be at the same 3 events coming up that I will be at as well. One place I invited him to for Valentine's-offered it as a date-to try us out...other is another event next weekend and the last is an annual trip to Vegas that we all take every year & The same trip that we got married on 2 years ago!
I asked if we could talk-like adults before it turns into a huge game and we're avoiding each other &acting like strangers in public. He said, he's going to those events, and he won't bother me & i am not to bother him. He does not answer when I call and will not reply to any text that has to do with working on our marriage.

I'm feel like Im back at day 1-hopeless & helpless & in tears
I was doing ok til I gave in & tried to contact him.

I just feel like if he had a chance to spend some time with me he will get those feelings back that he's trying to hold back

I can't sit back& watch my life fall apart. I'm a fighter. I know he's being stubborn & i know he still loves me. I just can't break through the wall he's built up.


I never posted this when i started but
me-28, H-28, he's 2 months older than me
ds-his-4
dd-mine-8

Ok Anna, you need to listen really really hard.....first thing, learn that NC= Nice and Calm. That means that you are not giving your WAS the opportunity to drag you back into that dark place. Trust me I know it is hard. I was with my H for 20 years when he walked out. I thought he was my soul mate, the one who I would grow old with....obviously he wasnt. I tried to get him to see the error of his ways, that he was destroying his family AND his son. You know what, he used these conversations as ammunition that I was controlling and evil. These moments of contact just confirmed to him that he needed to get away from me. Anna, you need to stop making any kind of contact with him. You are not going to change his mind. YOu will not show him what he is missing by texting him. The way you will get him to miss you is by NOT being in the picture. Let him go Anna so that he can feel what it is like to not have you. This is truly the only way to get him back.

Are you in any kind of therapy? If not, you need to get a therapist to talk to. You will find that your family and friends will tire of hearing your woahs quickly, but a therapist will be able to give you a path. Have you read the book I recommended yet...Divorce Busting? You need to. I believe in the filling up the love bucket theory that is talked about here, but not in every situation. In your situation I think any attempt to fill him up will be seen as desperate and controlling. WHen you change your focus to you and not him, you leave him wondering how your life could be so good without him. You also show him the person he fell in love with and it might just get him to start to reach out to you. Anytime you make first contact, you put yourself back to square one. Please let him reach out to you. Try to learn patience and what makes you happy.

I am going to be a bit honest here......it seems you R did not start out on the best of terms. He was running away from one relationship right into a new one with you. Maybe you should step back and take a look at the kind of man he is.I know you feel like he is your world, but honey, he left you at the first obsticle. How do you think he would react if it was something serious....like you becoming ill with a serious condition. You deserve to have a partner to stand by you and builds you up. Your H does not sound like that kind of man. He sounds very selfish and immature. Constantly looking for what feesl good now instead of working at making a good life. Sorry to say this, I just see so many of the signs. He doesnt really sound like he is the nuturing kind of partner, but the taking kind of partner. Think about that while you are working on NC.

I still have hope that things can work out for you, please dont take my warnings to mean they cant. I just want you to start to question where YOU are in this journey. Maybe there is alot of growth you need to go through in order to have a happy relationship. Change your focus and you will change your life.

I am sorry Anna. It does sound like you are a good wife. Trying to figure out what pushed him over the edge. Was there another guy that he knew about and told you or maybe found out and didnt tell you? What exactly did he tell you the reason was in his words? It is hard to see him leaving without being upset about another guy, or sick of argueing too much. And another woman but it dont sound that way. It sounds like he is serious.

[quote=SteveAustin] I am sorry Anna. It does sound like you are a good wife. Trying to figure out what pushed him over the edge. Was there another guy that he knew about and told you or maybe found out and didnt tell you? What exactly did he tell you the reason was in his words? It is hard to see him leaving without being upset about another guy, or sick of argueing too much. And another woman but it dont sound that way. It sounds like he is serious.

There was never any other guy...ever.
The problem he had with my ex, is that he actually knew who he was & he was popular in the music scene we are into, so it was just the fact that he actually knew him that bothered him. There was never ever a reason to think that I'd go back to him. At this point, the relationship with my ex was probably over a year+ when I met my husband. I guess its just his insecurities about my past? that he actually knew who my past was? ya know what i mean...It's not that bad when you are aware of the past but you don't actually know the face & the voice...i'm guessing.


Ultimately , I do feel that he is passive aggressive & is unaware of it, doesn't know how to deal with his insecurities, and doesn't really have a good method of resolving issues. He keeps my errors on a tally in my head & holds it against me intead of learning to forgive & move forward. I know I've made mistakes, I'm not blaming the whole thing on him, but I'm human and I love unconditionally, so I forgive & put it behind us. He's just not that way or doesn't know how to be that way.

And I wanted to say Thank you Steve for your input, I know you've been called out on here for what you've posted & have your views about women and how we are, but I hope that I've showed you we are NOT all the same & we are not all evil. I have good intentions and truly love my husband and was doing everything I knew how to do to make him a happy man. I didn't & don't mind playing the June Cleaver role at all.

Ms Anna, I truly just dont know what to say to you at this moment. You have many wonderful people stopping by your post to give you excellent advice and support. People who have been through this journey to h#ll and have found a way to find a better life. People who KNOW what you need to do in order to find yourself and your strength. Trust me, you need as much strength as possible to learn these life lessons inflicted upon us. And who do you thank????? You thank the one poster who used your thread as a place to spew his anger about women. THe one person who expected that women ask permission of from their man to deficate. Honey, why would you do that?

Maybe you need to truly step back and look inside of yourself as to why you need to please the jerks in the world. Why are you allowing yourself to be demished as a person. Anna, it sounds like you have absolutely no self esteem at all and let people (especially your H) walk all over you. HOw are you ever going to live a fulfilling life if you cant even be happy in your own skin. Please go and talk to a therapist. You do not deserve to be treated the way you have and are being treated. You need to see that you are a beautiful person that should have a partner that treats you like an equal, not a dominate male that expects you to jump when he says jump. And the fact that you are seeking approval from Steve just shows how distorted your thinking is right now. How many people have to post he is a jerk and is using this forum very innapropriately? If he wants to spew, he can create his own thread, but to hijack that of a wounded soul just looking for answers is unforgivable. Anna, look inside yourself and try to figure out why you needed to do this. It will be the first step towards a healthier you. THe only way you will EVER have a great relationship is if your are the healiest you can possibly be, and right now you are not. No relationship is going to work while you feel that it is ok to be treated the way you are being treated. Please get a therapist.

Anna, please reread idey's posts to you. They are spot on and you need to learn from them. I see two very dysfunctional people who react in two different ways who truly, IMO, are not compatible. At least not without a lot of personal therapy for both of you to remove your FOO demons.

That said, this is very true:

But all that means is that he will NEVER be satisfied with you; he will ALWAYS blame you to cover up his own fears and insecurities; that is how they make themselves feel better - by trashing and blaming other people.

The only thing YOU need right now is to learn to love yourself. And you can't do that if you're busy trying to please a man. Do both of you a favor and work on yourself. Maybe after that you can go back to him from a position of (inner) strength and set the standard for a healthy relationship.