As a frequent reader but rare poster, I would value your input on my dilemma...

The short story – I discovered my W’s LTA in Jan 05 w/ a former friend. I planned A’ed well and she went NC; however I did find a very desperate email to him six months later (Jul 05); after I confronted her on this, she said she felt it relieved her of the withdrawal symptoms and she was over it. She's since sworn NC and I've believed that.

Fast forward to now, four years after D-day. She is planning to attend a multiple day conference out of town in a couple of months and, after investigation, learned that the OM is a sustaining member of this professional association (my FWW and OM are in similar professions). I don’t know if he’s going to be at this conf or if my W knows of his membership in this group.

So... I’m wondering if this was coincidence or coordinated btwn the two of them? Should I ask her or let it ride and see what she says after the trip? My W is taking a girlfriend on the trip (near a resort), so that would seem to indicate a coincidence but we have not been getting along very well over the past year, just sort of co-existing, and that would lead me to think she’s reverting to past bad behavior.

Appreciate your thoughts on this, I'm not sure how I want to handle it.

Thank you,
No Way

The MB plan is that the affairees should NEVER see each other or talk to each other again.

It may not have been planned, but is not a good idea.

Have you discussed your concerns with her? Do you follow the policy of joint agreement?

How did you let this happen? Don’t you value your marriage enough to look after it? After what has happened to you in the past you should know better; she should too.

Regardless, you can trust your senses on this one. You should be concerned, very concerned. I also might suggest that you tell your wife the FULL nature of your concern. I don’t think that this is the time for you to get fancy. You are either “F’d” or you’re not. If you’re not then you need to consider how you can negotiate a way to keep her from attending and still stay married.

Mr. G

First stop what your doing and fix your marriage!!! My mom used to say...marriage is like a plant and as such needs to be watered everyday. It took me 20 years and 1 divorce to fully understand what she meant. Keep dating your wife everyday!!!

Second, this friend that she is taking....is she a friend of the marriage, one that she would not cheat around??

Well, I was dubious until I got to the above statement; now I am alarmed. One of the biggest elements of recovery is building a romantic relationship. This is part of affair proofing the marriage. What happened with that?

Dr. Harley: "The plan I recommend for recovery after an affair is very specific. That's because I've found that even small deviations from that plan are usually disastrous. But when it's followed, it always works. The plan has two parts that must be implemented sequentially. The first part of the plan is for the unfaithful spouse to completely separate from the lover and eliminate the conditions that made the affair possible. The second part is for the couple to create a romantic relationship, using my Basic Concepts as a guide." Requirements for Recovery from an Affair

I find this to be a very curious comment ... one that has me shaking my head.


Why do you believe her?
Based on what evidence do you believe her?

Thank you all for the replies and advice. I did speak to her last night about it (she suggested we go out to dinner). She seemed genuinely surprised and disappointed this OM had joined this asso. (unk when) She'd already booked the reservations and so has her friend. This led me to believe it was a coincidence. Her GF is a neighbor, who I trust, and has a strong M. Right now I'm going to let her think about it and try to guide her towards not going. I don't think there was been any contact over the last 4 yrs b/c I have my eyes open (as evidence I found this connection) but really, after the deception of the past LTA, who can be certain.

As for the "just existing" comments - you are all right and I recognize that. Valentines Day is almost here and she's been my valentine for 22 yrs now. There are times that she's warm and caring towards me and others when she's cold and moody, I guess that's not uncommon? It just takes more effort to break through that chill that I haven't given it my best effort. She did say she was sad that the remnants of her A still remain for me and that perhaps I should go back to IC, or we should go to MC. I told her the A was tremendous emotional trauma, I think it's a form of PTSD.

V/r,
No Way

no way

if your wife says "we should go to MC" after a discussion like that .. then THAT probably is a call for help.... where is the shining knight to run in and 'save' her and the M to you?????

Guess what .. that's YOU

She obviously knows you both are drifting... she sounds like she wants to do something about that .... just maybe do you think you both should arrange to speak to the Harley's???

you both have been careless ... maybe there is contact .. maybe not ... well its the perfect opening to see the best in the MC business and make sure as well as maybe find out how to protect your M.

get moving noway.

Go to the conference with her! I wouldn't let her out of your sight...but that's just me.

My WW went to a work related conference...and convinced her OM to meet her there for a hook-up. Granted, seemed strange that my WW was going to this conference alone...never had done that before

I'm not saying your wife is looking to hook up with the FOM, but man, if I had just said, "you know what, I'm dropping all my stuff and going with you on this conference" my life might be a little different right now.

DNU has a great idea...... go with her .... make it a romantic time as well... nothing like filling the bank with love deposits

And don't give us the "it will cost too much $$$..." line. How much are you willing to pay to keep your marriage in tact? Ask me 6 months ago and I'd say, "well..."

Ask me today and I'd say "I will give you penny I have!"

I wish I could have stopped my WW's EA from becoming a physical affair. But can't change the past. Only move forward.

Aussieswife,


Yes, you hit the nail on the head and I think she'd agree. We talked a little bit about this last night and she says it's b/c we both lead busy lives (who doesn't). We're not making the 15 hrs time together and the result is complacency. Admittedly, I'll get things moving towards a better place and plan to put some time in this weekend. It's tough breaking through this wall of complacency and maintain momentum. Right after Dday, it was easier for us to work on the M b/c we were in a crisis but eventually one gives in to the daily grind.

I'd love to go w/ her but she's got a GF going and someone (me) has to stay home and run the kids around.

V/r,
No way

It is because you never recovered your marriage. Have you considered doing something to recover?

DNU1,
Thank you for the perspective and I'm sorry it came to that. I've thought I'd like to have that "little flashy thing" from the movie Men In Black, to erase my and her memories, but that would wipe out some of the valuable life lessons we've gained through this process.

V/r,
NW

ML,
Appreciate the question, yes, we went to a number of MC sessions shortly after Dday. They were very helpful but our MC retired and we didn't go back. Unfortunately, her A is something that is never far from my mind, I'd figure it would have receded some after 4 years but it hasn't. My W's suggestion that we try MC again is probably right.

V/r,
No way

No Way, why not try something that WORKS? We went to a Marriage Builders weekend and it was very effective. They can teach you to build romantic love.

My friend, words don’t mean a thing unless they are backed by the supporting actions. Now you find yourself in this current situation and you want to profess your love? Well, “That dog don’t hunt.” You are FOUR years past D-day, this is not like some newly discovered drama in your life. If you had a loving engaging marriage, your predicament would be so much simplier.

Here are your options:

1. State your concern to your wife. Perhaps she will voluntarily elect to cancel in which case you will have made a HUGE withdraw from her love bank to calm your own insecurities. That withdraw combined with your past year of “indifference” towards the marriage should give her pause to rethink her relationship with you.

2. Of course, she may tell you that the trip is booked, her friend is counting on her and that your concerns are misplaced. In light of your past year of indifference this is the result I would most expect. Hopefully she will stay in regular contact with you to help maintain some sense of calm but really, why should she in view of the past year?

3. You can accompany her on the trip and deal with the logistical nightmare you will likely create with flights and room reservations not to mention making her friend (the innocent bystander) the likely casualty. Ugh!

4. You can do nothing. Let her go. Tell her you love her. Ask her to call you throughout the day and night because you’ll be somewhat of a basket case. You are generally placing yourself at her mercy. In this scenario you can have an advanced discussion of what she will do if the OM happens to make an appearance. Will she call you (yes). Will she remove herself from the situation (yes). Will she talk or say anything to him (No). Get the picture.

The first three are love bank withdraws; the last option is no prize either. But, there they are, PICK!

Oh yes, make the visit to the marriage counselor BEFORE the trip.

If you come out of this unscathed then you should promptly fall to your knees look up and profess your thanks and gratitude. And for goodness sake, decide if you want to be married or if you just want to be a passenger in this marriage. If you choose the latter then she wouldn’t do bad to divorce you.

Mr. G

Mr. G,
Your 4 options are correct but the premise that the indifference is all mine is not - it's been a shared thing and I'm not the only passenger.
We did a Marriage Encounter weekend a long time ago (2000), well before Dday, when I sensed sometime wasn't right. It was OK but we considered (at the time) their techniques of daily writing tiresome. She wasn't forthcoming back then and had I known the LTA was likely underway, we would have taken steps towards recovery back then.

V/r,
No way

Valentine’s Day is almost here and she's been my valentine for 22 yrs now..... so your gift is .....a Marriage Builders weekend ... and a nice simple red rose

someone please correct me but isn't a Marriage Builders weekend something entirely different from the marriage encounters seminars??????????

I thought ME was done by the Catholic Church world wide and was a more holistic thing.... NOT that for general malaise its not a good way to go ....

BUT ... adultery requires specialists. I don't care what anyone says. Though they may not need to be MB based the ones that seem to work have very similar ideas. At least ours did.

noway stop with the excuses mister... go book the course.

look read up on them in the info here above. I mean will you wait UNTIL there is a OM??? or maybe a OW for you???????


you have SUCH an opportunity here noway... can't you see that????