Two days ago I accidentally discovered an instant messaging chat session between my wife and another man on her computer (I was turning off some lights and her computer had been left on in the corner), where the man was apparently masturbating while she was IMing to him. I downloaded the chat archive and started sifting through the hundreds of messages. Based on the texts she has been apparently stripping naked for other men on nights I am working late and the kids are asleep (she has a cam, I don't). She has even talked about meeting up with some of them. I strongly desired to confront her with the evidence the next day but kept quiet and went to my job as usual. I have a burning need to talk with someone about this, but I don't want to talk to her yet because I don't think I'm ready.

I attached a keylogger to her computer to grab her password. When she next goes out I will install heavy duty remote monitoring software so I can get a complete picture of what she's doing on an ongoing basis.

Our marriage has not been that great lately but I did not suspect this. I already had a plan to try to improve our marriage, which I have been and was going to continue to implement. I was going to try to spend more time with my wife and try different things to see if more of a connection would develop. I still have a heart to do this even though I'm stunned.

If I can stomach it, is there any case for continuing to work on my marriage and not telling her I know about her nasty chat sessions, while I monitor what she's doing to see how deep she is the the cybersex? I mean if it becomes clear that she has contacted/consummated something with someone in real life I would immediately confront if I had proof.

Right now I feel like my knowing about her cheating, and her not knowing, is an advantage that I don't want to let go of yet. I think I want to get some individual counseling before I make my next move.

Is there a case to be made for not running in and confronting her? If there was a way for our marriage to be healed I would prefer that. If she does not turn away from this I will have to divorce her eventually, but I don't want my accidental discovery to force the timeline.

Up until I made this discovery I had been pretty pleased about some limited progress I had been making in having a better time communicating with my wife.

Leader, I would confront her sooner rather than later. This could easily evolve to a physical affair while you wait. Nor can you fix your marriage unless and until the truth comes out. There is no point in gathering intel if you are not going to use it.

My suggestion would be to develop a plan for recovery and present it to her at the same time you confront her with the truth. For example, the conditions that led to the affair have to be elminated. That means that you stop working late and focus on building a romantic relationship with her. It also means removing her means of adultery, ie: getting her agreement to stay off the computer unless you are with her.

If you want to do this right. I would suggest either going to a MB weekend or getting phone counseling with Steve Harley. They will assess your marriage and teach you how to FALL IN LOVE. Falling in love will be the best protection against an affair.

A good book that will help you understand the dynamics at play here is Surviving an Affair by Dr. Willard Harley.

Here is my favorite article by Dr. Harley about what it will take to recover a marriage after an affair.

excerpt from Requirements for Recovery from an Affair[/b]

"The plan I recommend for recovery after an affair is very specific. That's because I've found that even small deviations from that plan are usually disastrous. But when it's followed, it always works. The plan has two parts that must be implemented sequentially. The first part of the plan is for the unfaithful spouse to completely separate from the lover and eliminate the conditions that made the affair possible. The second part is for the couple to create a romantic relationship, using my Basic Concepts as a guide.

I'll describe these two parts to you in a little more detail.

The first step, complete separation from the lover and eliminating the conditions that made the affair possible, requires a complete understanding of the affair. All information regarding the affair must be revealed to the betrayed spouse, including the name of the lover, the conditions that made the affair possible (travel, internet, etc.), the details of what took place during the affair, all correspondence, and anything else that would shed light on the tragedy.

This information is important for two reasons: (1) it creates accountability and transparency, making it essentially impossible for the unfaithful spouse to continue the affair or begin a new one unnoticed, and (2) it creates trust for the betrayed spouse, providing evidence that the affair is over and a new one is unlikely to take its place. The nightmares you experience are likely to continue until you have the facts that
will lead to your assurance that your husband can be trusted.

An analysis of the betrayed spouse's childhood or emotional state of mind in an effort to discover why he or she would have an affair is distracting and unnecessary. It takes precious time away from finding the real solutions. I know why people have affairs: We are all wired for it. Given certain conditions, we would all do it. Given other conditions, however, none of us would do it. So the goal of the first step is to discover the conditions that made the affair possible and eliminate them.

After the first step is completed, the second step is to create a romantic relationship between you and your husband using my 10 Basic Concepts http://marriagebuilders.com/ca/to.cgi?l=qa080103bc
as your guide. [b]While your relationship may be improving, it won't lead to a romantic relationship because you are not being transparent toward each other. Unspoken issues in a marital relationship lead to a superficiality that ruins romance."

How long married? Any children?

Married over 12 years with four children all elementary or preschool age.

I am drawn towards the idea of confronting my wife and at the same time having a plan. I have been reading so many marriage books over the past year that my head is spinning. I don't understand all the concepts and some concepts of MB may conflict with others I've read. I feel like I've been told I have a surprise final exam immediately.

I've made mistakes but I honestly love my wife and want to work on stuff, and I guess part of me is afraid my wife doesn't want to, even when I confront her she will not agree.

How do you build self confidence, and decisiveness, when you are at a low ebb? Maybe confronting my wife will not work and I'll feel like I screwed up my last shot.

I love my wife and our kids so much despite all the difficulties. In a way I wish I did not, it might make doing what I have to do easier.

Leader, it is my opinion, based on experience and research over the years, that the Marriage Builders program is far and away the best plan there is. The reason is because, unlike the others, it focuses on a logical plan based on logical solutions. It makes sense and it WORKS. It does not get lost in feelings like the others. It really does work.

Your wife probably will not want to work on your marriage initially. That is because she has fallen out of love and is emotionally detached from you. That does not mean it can't change. But you have to demonstrate to her that you would be willing to meet her needs if she ends her adultery. But you won't even have the opportunity unless you talk to her about it.

Be assured there are no quick fixes, though. It has taken your marriage a long time to get to this poor state and it will take hard work and time to turn it around. Many here have done it using this program.

I strongly suggest you try phone coaching with Steve Harley. He can assess your situation, give you a logical PLAN and is a genius at persuading reluctant spouses to give it a try. He DOES NOT believe in counseling you together, most good counselors DO NOT because it causes more harm than good. What he does is coach you alone the first time, after you answer his questionaires. Then he will share an hour with you both; you for 30 min, her for 30 min.

But, confronting your wife is the first important step. This is going nowhere until the truth is brought into the open. No matter what her reaction, your marriage will still be salvagable.

You can expect her to be FOGGY right now becuase she is high on addiction of her internet infidelity. Her mentality right now is EXACTLY THAT of a falling down drunk. When you confront her, you can just expect some very foggy reactions so don't let it alarm you. It won't effect, in any way, the outcome towards recovery. It is sort of like turning on the lights in the crack house. The crack heads are disoriented and befuddled until they can sober up. But it doesn't mean they can't sober up even though they are a little loony at first.

Also, you really should click on "notify" at the bottom of this post and ask a mod to move this to General Questions 11. that is the busiest forum with the most experience and the entire website is SLOW on weekends. You will get lots more help if your thread is over there.

And most of all, don't despair. No matter how dark things look today, we have seen some horrendous situations do complete 180's. Yours is not even close to a lost cause.

p.s. and make plans NOW to stop working late!!

You mean you are going to wait, and possibly let her hook up with these guys? I think you need to read what Drscott did? First off, she doesn't work? If she doesn't, cancel all credit cards. Close off her access to any joint bank accounts and open one for you and one for her. Let her find out, she has no access to your money. When she asks you why. Tell her that since she is stipping in front of cams and arranging to go and screw other guys. You feel that you should not have to pay for this. Take a hard line. Don't be a doormat. You have the proof, confront and get into MC. Don't get use to her cheating.JMHO

ouchthathurts, he is not anywhere near the point where he needs to cut off credit cards, etc. He needs to confront first and take it from there. The hard line is for when she gets rough, and he is not there.

Again, JMHO. If necessary take the computer and lock it in the trunk of your car. I would even take the other car away. I would confront her once. This appears to be mostly sexual and not emotional. I may be more delicate if it was an EA.

Another question of opinion, I just want a view on an additional issue.

OK, so background of course is that I found out that my wife is taking off her clothes for other men on internet cam. In the past, she has had the appearance of being a very private person, and has always been upset about giving out personal info on the internet. She has always emphasized that I need to be very cautious about whatever (and protect our children) from online predators, internet porn, etc., so I have very complex and hard-above to-maintain filters on all the computers except the one that she uses ,"only she uses her computer, so there is not a need"

A. I think if she were ever to find about my post above on this forum she would honestly say she was angry for "invading our privacy" :RollieEyes: Does anyone feel that what I've shared breaks my anonymity in the online world?

B. I have half a mind to march home, and after the kids are asleep, install yahoo instant messenger and in full view of her (she can see most of my screen from where she sits, I can't see hers) start doing something naughty to gauge her reaction. How can someone be such a hypocrite?

I know I'm acting like I just fell off the turnip truck or something.

Of course you didn't break your anonymity. No one knows who you are here. My concern here is that she finds your thread. Then you are scr*wed because you will lose this forum as a resource.

It's standard Wayward Operating Procedure®.

They must read a manual or something as they ALL act that way when you out them. They blame shift to try and divert the accountability, then it will go one of three ways.

Either she will deny to the point of calling YOU insane, break down in remorse or she will go absolute nuclear.

They usually start off denying everything, to blaming BS to threatening divorce because BS "humiliated them" and "broke their trust".

1. To my knowledge she never visits "improve your marriage" forums.
2. I created this screen name today for the purpose of this post.
3. I don't intend to read threads while she's around.
4. My own thread will be buried after a few days, and I can check back on it from time to time.
5. I don't think I gave enough details for her to think "yeah that's me", except maybe she could clue in on the length of time we haven't had sex and that I still love her.

Leader, waywards usually find this forum by tracking the history of the visited URL's or by placing a keylogger on the BS' computer.

And I would be careful about posting anything that might flag your identity. This is a very popular forum and as such, seems to attract some real pro-affair losers who hate what we do here.

We have had 2 instances where sickos reading this forum used personal information and ALERTED the affairees to the poor betrayed spouse's thread. One very sick, twisted individual [hi A."Friend" ] from this forum actually warned a WW about this forum and sent her an email through her therapist telling her all about the BS's thread. The poor BS lost this forum as a resource and the threads were used in legal proceedings against him to try and take his kids from him. There is a lot of blood in the water here, which seems to attract sharks and other bottom feeders.

I personally would contact her after leaving a keylogger on her computer.

You could say that you've had word of her camshots on the internet. (All you need is a her picture and a grotty picture of some dude you took it from).
Ask her if she is missing something from your marriage. Share that you want to improve the marriage.

Get the Emotional Needs form off the site here and both of you should fill it.

Don't talk of the lack in the marriage, rather how you are going to amend it!

I recommend not telling her about the keylogger until you have recovered your marriage. I made the mistake of telling my wife about the keylogger because I felt guilty but now I wish I never would have told her about it so I could know what is still going on....

My wife was also INTENSELY private. Makes sense now. She had a lot to hide.. She met her OM on the internet and I wonder what else there is that I don't know about now...

Don't reveal your intel and how you got it. Let her know you know, when you do confront, but not HOW you know. This will let her think that you simply discovered something accidentally.

Keep your sources secret.

Doesn't mean you shouldn't confront, just that you should keep your source quiet.

"Up until I made this discovery I had been pretty pleased about some limited progress I had been making in having a better time communicating with my wife."

I know you said YOU were pretty pleased about the communicating has been going - but have you asked your wife about how things are going?? I mean really asked - not just "so what do you think" and leave it at that.

This may have been covered in other posts, but women and men communicate and think differently - DUH! I know...basic men/women stuff here. I recently went through a similar period of "communicating better" with my wife - or what I thought was better communication between us. Things seemed to be going well in my mind, but I wasn't really asking my wife how she thought things were going.

You need to make sure what you're saying is what your wife is really hearing and vice versa. There's a Christian marriage study called "Marriage on the Rock". In it they talk about how women and men communicate. That sometimes women say one thing and we hear something else. It's not a stereotype - it's real and something that can get very negative if we aren't careful.

So I would suggest really nailing down your communication if you think it's going well. Talk to friends, your pastor and on here of course.

I'm new on here and was very close to a divorce with my wife as well. If you've read the Harley's book, you will see that confrontation may not be the best way.

Make sure you keep praying - God can heal anything!! I'm living proof of that!

wisereader, by confrontation we mean bringing the truth out in the open without lovebusters. That is something Dr Harley very much advocates. He can't very well address the problems in his marriage if they are not confronted openly and honestly. Confrontation is the only way.

Welcome to Marriage Builders.

Put a camera in the room that she does her thing in. Then tape her day and night as she strips in front of men online. Make an appointment with a marriage counselor and tell her it is for you two to get a simple "marital checkup". Bring the video there with you and display it on a 55 inch screen. Make her and the counselor watch what she does with these other men. **edit**