And I'm making this a second post all it's own so as not to detract from the BGP-esque post I just posted. (That's a lot of "post"!)

I have to admit, I don't like the way it feels NOW, having told STBXH he can't just pick up our son whenever he wants. I felt like I just took everything away from him. Like I'm out to ruin his life, completely cut him off, etc. I feel a little guilty and a lot controlling.

Nay-sayers: it's been a LONG time since I've had any sympathy for him, cut me some slack.

Although, he IS the one who made a promise to them & then later completely broke it to them, then justified it, then showed up in a condition I only know as half-way between drunk & hung over to DD's performance where he breathed fire at DS for an extended period of time. Yea, tough cookies buddy.

Moving on...

Julie,

Regarding your first post...excellent job!!! Woo hoo!! Atta girl!!! You did exactly the right thing. It is completely unaccpetable for him to just pick up your DS without talking to you first. Fantastic job!!!

As for your second post....Julie the enabler is creeping back in. Don't let the BGP's fall back around your ankles! Pull them back up!!! H created the situation. It is not your job to feel sorry for him. You are NOT preventing him from picking up DS and spending time with him. You have only asked him to clear it with you beforehand. Don't start feeling sorry for him. That will allow Julie the Enabler to come back to the forefront. You don't want to be looking at her in the mirror anymore.

Overall, great job. You really should give yourself credit for handling this the right way. Now, if he doesn't follow the boundary that you have put forth then you MUST follow-through with the consequences.

You rock Julie! Keep it up!

Mindshare

Yikes again...

Got an angry VM from STBXH only stating, "I need you to give me a call"

Spoke with the divorce service earlier & they've been getting angry calls from him as well. He wants his money back. I did not have his permission to use the service, he demands a refund, his credit card was fraudulently used.

I reminded the girl that 1) because we're married there's no fraud; 2) HE signed up for it, all by himself, over a month ago; 3) it's best for all parties involved if they hurry up & just finish the documents.

Called STBXH back, lo and behold, he wants to talk about how he's out $200 now because I responded to their emails w/o his permission. "You should have called me first, you didn't have my permission to use the service, who's going to pay for this?"

Me: "You already did pay for it, 30 days ago!!!"

He began mocking me. I hung up. I think my next move will be to file RO. That's 2 days in a row now that he's been extra rude to me & I'm now concerned he may meet me at home or something. I don't like this.

Well by the standards of where I live this situation doesn't necessitate a RO. So I will just sit here hoping he doesn't pick up the boy & doesn't show up.

dang, I am liking how you got him to pay for the divorce service! WTG!

Well dontcha remember, a month ago, he wanted out of this marriage? And so he got out, and started the process, and you were so mad at me, but I didn't notice because I was way too sad and heartbroken and almost victim-ish?

Then I splashed some water on my face, took over communication w/the divorce service, got it almost all wrapped up, and now he doesn't like it. OH well.

You know whether they cancel the service & give him a refund or not, at this point it's nothing more than a grudge match: who filed VS who gets served. I think he really wants to be the one who can say "I filed for the divorce!" When really what I want to say is "I am free from the insanity!!"

I remember! And I hope you take this bull by the horns and drive that divorce home! That is what he wanted, after all.

You should come here for vacation some day. I have several guestrooms and would love to have you and the kids.

Good morning. I could really use some support.

I just got a most unexpected phone call from DD12 this morning. A smidgen of background: Sunday she had a performance that she told STBXH about & he showed up, all seemed "OK", she then told me Monday night, sobbing, that he was either hung over or still drunk Sunday afternoon. That she could smell beer all over him & "I know that smell Mom" OH, I know it too. All too well. She was so hurt. Since then she's successfully dodged his calls. Not necessarily blatantly, as me & the kids do stay pretty busy throughout the week.

So she calls me on my way to work:

DD: "Mom, I just talked to Dad. I told him I'm not ever talking to him after today & that he can't blame you because this was MY decision. I told him why & now I'm not going to talk to him again."
Me: "OH!"
DD: "Well it wasn't fair to me for him to show up like that. I don't want him at any more of my performances and I don't want to talk to him anymore."
Me: "Well, I'm proud of you for standing up for yourself. That must have been really hard. Are you sure this is what is best for you? I know you still love him."
DD: "Yes because this isn't fair to me."

She says he didn't try to interrupt her or defend himself, as she's (we've all) grown accustomed to, that he just listened.

I think I'm still in shock. I'm not sure why. Mel, I gave some real thought to calling you but I was almost to work. Then, also unexpectedly, I began to cry. I haven't cried in a long time, maybe a month! I feel SO BAD for my DD. She's already not speaking with/taking calls from her bio-dad, she REALLY tried to trust/open up to STBXH while he was home & even after he left again, and I just feel like, there goes her childhood. What's next for her? How do you support a girl, at 12, who's got nothing but sucky, irresponsible, not-getting-it men in her life?

I'm ashamed to have PUT her in this position. AGAIN. I'm sad that she is so grown up. That she's not getting to be a kid. And while I sometimes get frustrated w/DS9's choosing to pretend this all isn't happening, at least he's maintaining the KID in himself. Gotta appreciate that. But DD, she was done being a kid a year ago. Can we get it back? Is there any hope she will be OK? I'm so sad and scared for her...and this isn't even about me!

So anyway, that's my morning. I'm so proud of her. I just wish I didn't have to be in this way.

Julie,

Your daughter is a brave young girl. She is establishing a boundary with stbxh and making it clear that his behavior was/is unacceptable. Support her 100% in this decision. When you talk to stbxh reinforce that you support her decision to have contact with him or not. If his behavior is causing her more pain then his complete absence then by all means she should cease all contact with him. Maybe this will be a wake-up call for him but for some reason I kinda doubt it.

Be proud of DD12. I know you want more for her but she has a mom that loves her very much. Just keep loving her, supporting her and being there for her. When DS goes to spend time with stbxh plan some mom/daughter 'dates'. Have some fun 'girl time'. Let her know just how special she is to you.

Mindshare

Thanks, MS.

We will do all of that. It's what we did last time, when she & I were both Plan B'ing him. It's just that I cannot be a dad for her. She needs that. I don't think I'm capable of expressing how HORRIBLY SAD I am for her that she doesn't get to have that. So sad.

I won't let her see me so sad. That's why I came here.

Alcohol is a daddy thief - many girls don't have the strength to stand up to their dads - you have raised a great young lady.

I would suggest not looking for substitute daddies right now. The lesson life has delivered up to her is to value a relationship for what she can bring to it and the mutual benefit of the parties involved.

Stephen R Covey wrote "Seven Habits of Highly Effective People" and it's where Harley probably got his "love bank" analogy from. The book talks about "The Maturity Continuum" - where someone moves from dependence to independence in the first three steps; then from independence to interdependence - the last four habits - Your daughter is nicely set up to move through this maturity continuum well.

Just watch out for her looking for substitute daddies. That's where she can attract trouble - speaking as a daughter of an alcoholic who has been through those potholes! I was a whole lot more needy than your daughter seems to be.

I agree. This is a critical time in her young life, but I have a feeling because she has such a strong mom, she'll make it. Hopefully, by the time she reaches dating age, she'll be confident enough in herself that she'll make good choices when it comes to picking the right guys. She won't be choosing guys to date that she can "fix" or as Kayla says, "substitute daddies".

I say good for her for drawing a line in the sand with STBX. That had to be hard for her but probably not as hard (and embarrassing) as having her dad show up half drunk to one of her performances.

Dang, I am in AWE. This is very good, Julie. And this is because of your influence. You took her to Alateen meetings so she recognizes the NUTS when she sees them and sets proper boundaries. I am very impressed.

Please stop feeling ashamed. I know I beat you to death with taking him back, but that was only to get you to SEE your hand in this mess. Since then you have seen it, taken proper steps, and are taking full responsbility. There is nothing shameful about that. Give yourself some credit, please.

I'm in awe too.

A few things:

KA, thanks for stopping in, it's been a while! You're right about it stealing dads & I've long had a sense that your & my childhoods were very similar. NO risk at all in me looking for a replacement dad, and I'm sure at this point DD isn't interested in that either. Last year she did tell me, "well I don't just want some jerk off the street!" in a conversation we had where she expressed to me her worry about "so am I going to have a new dad??"

PM, I think that's my concern more than anything - that she'll start bringing faulted/bad/mean boys around. Lord knows I did it. This is the time in her life where she really NEEDS a daddy doting on her & showing, telling her how truly magnificent she is. Instead, SHE had to be the lucid one & cut BOTH of her "dads" out. The poor, poor girl. And no, I don't think this will be a "wake-up call" for STBXH. There may be no such thing. And I no longer care.

Mel, it is no secret you are a big influence in my life. I wanted to call you this morning to talk in my state of shock - because you GET me, not because I didn't feel I've lived up to what you wanted. Yea you were harsh back then, but that's you and I'm glad for it. Imagine if you hadn't & we just nicey-niced our way thru another few years of insanity!! You didn't make me feel ashamed...I just...am!

FWIW, yes, I will give me some credit, eventually. She didn't even talk with me this time. No "I'm thinking I won't talk to dad anymore" or "tomorrow I'm going to tell dad how I feel AGAIN". That was a huge step for her - I wasn't even home!

RE: Alateen, yea, she's a lifer.

We're going to be OK. This was just HUGE, in my eyes.

Julie,

DD has already shown that she is mature and has a great head on her shoulders. No reason to believe that she won't establish similar boundaries with men later in life. Reinforce this lesson by telling her how proud you are of her for having the courage and intelligence to set this boundary with stbxh. Tell her how great it is to see that she is willing to stand up to somebody that is treating her poorly.

She is wise beyond her years....

Mindshare

Got the documents today. All filled out & ready to go. Will have to correct a few errors before I can file - so I'll do that over the weekend.

DD is fine. She talked a bit more about the phone call & pointed out the manipulation. "He was really quiet & just saying things like, "O..K...I'm sorry I wasn't a better dad..." and I almost caved but I kept telling myself 'he's doing this on purpose' so I stayed strong and finished what I had to say, then told him we're not talking anymore." WOW, hey!? My kid.

Good thing she is fine, and I snapped out of my grieving for her, because the attention is now once again shifted to DS9. He's fallen right back into the old habits from last year, when we were separated. He told me tonight he'll probably drink when he gets older, because he wants to drink with dad. That YES, he feels 'cool' when he yells out in class & exhibits bad behavior. And YES, he thinks it's cool when adults behave badly.

OMG. WHAT am I going to do??!!? Well, for now, I'm going to stay calm. I did bait him into the conversation, of course. And I don't always keep my cool - bad me. Just last night though, in a bit of a not-so-baited conversation, he shared with me that he's upset with his dad. That he keeps choosing to drink, thus getting himself "kicked out" of the house. But that he's afraid to tell dad he's upset with him. He doesn't feel comfortable talking to STBXH. That he'd rather pretend he's not mad at his dad. I told him that's OK, that he doesn't have to talk to STBXH about these things.

OK that was a big ol' update but that's where I'm at. Thoughts/suggestions welcome.

Good morning everybody! Had a good, relaxing weekend. DD & I went to get our nails done Sat. DS is back on the path of getting in trouble/acting out in school so I kept him home Friday to spend a whole lotta time talking, letting him vent, expressing to him my concerns & then building him up. He was with STBXH for the weekend.


Found something this morning that might humor some of you the way it did me. It's a card STBXH's mother sent him this summer.

Front: "If it's true that adversity builds character..."
Inside: "Then your character is getting a real workout! Hang in there"

And a post-script note about how she'd forgotten to send him a Father's Day card, realized it was probably a tough day for him. "You are a good son, a good man and a GOOD father."

And this is the delusional stuff I was up against. Good riddance, I say!

Hi Julie!

How are you doing?

Can you please read and post to sinkingin? I get the feeling that you both are very similar in alot of ways and she could really use your support. Who knows, maybe you will get something from it as well!

Pay it forward.

Mindshare

Hey MS.

I'm doing GREAT!

I did read her thread yesterday & agree, lots of familiarities. And this morning I did pick something up from her thread:


LOVE THAT!!!

I'll see if I can squeeze some posts in, I'm @work & this is loading pretty slow today. Thanks for thinking of me.

Excellent post Julie!! I hope she reads your thread and can identify with the similarities.

You are really are becoming stronger day by day. You should be proud of your progress. But, don't let up!!!

Mindshare