Hi, BC!

I completely agree with you!


Very true especially in abusive M. I see a pattern of passive aggressive mixed with aggressive-aggressive behavior. All of which is freighting to us on lookers...I fear greatly for 2m2l as well as her children.


I don't think that anyone has condoned this relationship...we have tried very hard to get 2m2l to understnad the danger that she is in...some of which she has listened to and she has tried to get some help but has been denied...we just ahve to keep pushing her to keep seeking the help that she needs to change her life and the kid's lives around for the better...

Taking that first step is the hardest and scariest step for most women, was for me...and sometimes, unfortunately that first step is repeated several times...

I know for myself, I didn't want to end up being a newspaper article saying something like "Woman and children killed by Husband!" reading something like this:

"Yesterday following a disagreement between S4B and WS where S4B wanted to end her marriage becasue of his A and violent behavior. WS shot and killed S4B at her workplace, also injuring some of her co-workers. WS fled the scene and went to the children babysitter's where WS picked up the kids, brought them back to the home and killed them! Following the murder of the kids, WS then shot and killed himself!"

THis was my biggest fear, unfortunately 2m2l can NOT see how real this can be for her too...all that blood shed...why? because I wasn't strong enough to break the cycle...

I DON'T THINK SO...I couldn't do it for myself but I cared enough for the ppl around me to do it for them...Today, I care alot more for myself!


I don't think that you do either! It's my belief that you are trying to help just like everyone else on this thread. I can just tell you from my own (which was certainly not as dangerous as 2m2l's) that it's not an easy process if you ahven't lived through all of the games, manipulatation, etc....

It's easy for us to see but harder for her...it's a state of denial that most women won't to believe the position...it's the "this is not happening to me" thinking...


This can be very frustrating...it can be for me...like KA was saying about her watching me all those months...it's heartbreaking sometimes...

I appreciate your presence on this thread...the more help the better!

Rin

I know I said the last post was the last post, but I have one thing to add about something someone said.

I know what a marriage is not. I also know what a marriage is. My (paternal) grandparents loved each other very much. They knew each other 9 days before they married and were married 40 years.

They showed me what a marriage is. What 2M2L has is not a marriage, but a master-slave relationship. Thank you all in advance to my REAL last post.

Lets just return to the metaphor of the little green frog in the boiling water.

It has taken 2m2l a long time to gradually arrive at the situation in which she now finds herself.It may be better to gradually make changes in order to escape rather than using unpredictable or challenging tactics.

It can be seen that sudden changes in the situation are a trigger for H to assert control using very unpleasant tactics.

There is now a much greater awareness of the dynamics of N.P.D.than even two or three years ago.Previously all the information said get out ASAP Now the number of books on Amazon relating to the problem have increased dramatically and there are even a couple with suggestions of ways that it can be dealt with plus more and more internet coverage (VerbalAbuse.com is a similar forum to this)

An AVO can be a red rag to a bull and the police cannot be in attendance 24/7 there are equally horrific stories of what happens to divorcing wives who dare to get out of control.

You have come a long way 2m2L an Affair+extreme abuse + 2 small children + a full time job is a huge eventuality. You are intelligent and are adapting to a reality which is worse than could ever be dreamed of.

Keep on searching for as much information as you can. Knowledge is power you cant have enough of it

hi 2m2l! We're still here supporting you!

How about an update? Several of us are concerned about you and your family!

Hi everyone,

Thank you for reading, for your kind words, your harsh reality words and your prayers.

I am still living in the holding pattern and today he wants a divorce. I folded 2 nights ago and when I couldn't reach him on the phone as he left the house, I called his cell and it was busy. I called OW's number and it was busy too. Needless to say I got really mad, depressed, sad and confused.

I was happy being ok, but the cake eating really sucks. He wants more and more and he wants me to comply and be happy when he graces us with his presence and not put any pressure on him. He really thinks that is trying to repair our M. I am so far from wanting that before he fixes himself and yet he is so self righteous and still believes this is all my doing etc.

He asked if he could come to my next counscelling session so he could tell my IC how f'ed up I am.

Anyway, today he asked for D papers, again, and it's getting old. I've signed them. All he has to do is lie about our separation date and pay the money. He is just jerking me around again.

WOF - I remember your words about the visiting dad hurting the children. When I got upset last week my almost 4 year old daughter said "we can go to nana and bapa's house. It's a safe house mummy." It broke my heart and I hate that she knows so much. Happy family times cannot fool them. She assumes daddy is coming home each night and that he'll be here in the morning and I hate imagining this as my life sentence.

I hate where I am.

I truly believe that if it weren't for my beautiful children, I would be overseas by now on a plan B vacation and moving on. I hate this holding pattern of fear.


This is exactly right Myopia, thank you for being my voice. I get so confused and dizzy (Karmarose - you're not blocked) that I can't explain.

Agreed. I have been unable to call them yet to register but I will. I am interested in the forums.

He has said a number of times that it would be nothing more than a challenge. That might be his fear veiled as a threat, but I will not take that chance. On three occasions the police has taken over 45 minutes to arrive at the house. That was after they heard WH in the background making threats etc.

Sometimes I am just so sick of being strong. I just wish there was someone to hold me and tell me I was doing ok. No one really understands. My kids mean so much to me but I just can't fix things. I can't give them a happy home with mummy and daddy and it breaks my heart that I am here in this mess.

I have lost my marriage and the hopes and dreams I had as a girl of how happy I would be in life. I really thought I had everything and I'm trying so hard just to keep my head above water. My love bank is empty and nearly negative and I really wish I could see a better future. I just don't think WH will "let" me have that and I can't see it happening with him unless God's performs a miracle.

I was supporting a new friend on Sunday and we had coffee for 4 hours. She is a beautiful woman, inside and out and has an abusive wayward husband and 2 children and is fighting the same battle as me.

I hate that life can go so wrong and be so nasty. This isn't fair.

Over the last 3 days I have cried so much again. I was in such a good place but talking with her on Sunday and digging back into my life really hurts. I don't feel strong at all and I am worried about WH. Will he cycle down from here or escalate?

Mum had an epileptic fit at work yesterday and that's extra pressure too. I don't want to bother my parents.

Post for positives...

Work is busy and I hope, NEED, to sign up some new clients.

Tomorrow I am going to a friends house for a spray tan while WH visits the kids.

My sister is coming to stay on Friday night and I am going out with people from work for a night out.

Sunday the kdis and I are off to the zoo for a family work function. I am starting to get used to my 'family' of 3.

Crap, sad again.

2m2l, I know it doesn't seem like it right now, but a year from now, 5 years from now, you'll look back at this period, and wonder what took you so long to get so smart. He will never be anything but misery for you. And you deserve so very much more than that. Like I tell D18 about her abusive exbf, he will spend the rest of his life miserable, angry, looking for the next 'fix' of putting someone else down.

But you - you will find a peace you never imagined possible. You'll wake up in the morning and rejoice that your kids are with you and love you and need you, and that you can all find happiness and excitement and hope for yourselves...and a future.

You have no future with him. Nothing but misery.

And you deserve better.

PLEASE go to www.unitedway.org and ask them to help you find the toughest, meanest, smartest lawyer you can get, to protect yourself and your kids.

PLEASE!

Hi Catperson and thank you.

I would love to imagine that kind of future but I cannot see one where he will not try to control me and "let" me have my own life. I honestly can't see a way out and will always have him in my life as a co-parent. At the moment I feel like working on the marriage will be an easier choice.

I am in Australia and cannot use United.org. I have contacted other organisations but find it a struggle to hear anything past - get an avo. It's like they don't even hear me. I don't want to be in anymore danger.

I'm in survival mode a day at a time but I hope to graduate this phase soon with more knowledge!

Please don't think this. You have a whole life ahead of you. A whole life! He will NOT try to control you forever. Once you move on, it will cease to matter to him; because he'll be on to the next victim. I promise you. I know a LOT about abuse. This is what they do.

But it takes YOU making the first step.

There is a poster in GQ called DTP. Please go read her thread. It shows how she methodically planned her escape, disappeared, and resurfaced. He had moved on.

I know it seems like you are the sole focus of his life. But it's not true. For now, sure, because you put yourself out there in front of him. But once you do the steps to protect yourself, you will be more trouble than you're worth.

Please! Don't settle for him just for safety today.

I can't stay away from here. I'm sorry.

It is a sad day when your four year old has better sense about a dangerous man than a fully grown woman.

Out of the mouth of babes comes wisdom.

Please, 2M2L...please, PLEASE, STOP THIS! STOP ENDANGERING YOUR BABIES!

Maybe begging will help...

I think you fear that once the D is final, you will go into an unhappy life. You will be divorced, your children will be unhappy, you will be sad forever.
but that is just NOT true!
Your life will improve a lot. You will finally put a bandage over your wounded heart, and begin the healing process. Right now, you have a huge, open wound, and every time he makes his childish threats, he picks the scab off the wound. Your wounded heart is not healing. That is why you have had 3 more days of crying.
But when you finally tell him "No more, you are NOT picking off my scab again. I am taking control of my life" you will finally start the healing process.
You CAN have a happy life, and happy M. But not with this guy.
He tells you he will get into anger management classes as soon as he can, but they don't start until May? Load of crap. If he was finally sick of himself, and his bad behavior, he would do whatever it takes to get healthy. He could spend money on counseling right now, today, if he truly wanted to. He just doesn't want to bad enough. He wants to string you along as long as possible, cake eating.
The fact is this: When you finally break free from him, for good, and let him know that you are no longer available to him, he will find another OW. Someone else who will put up with his crap. of course, in the beginning he will treat her like a queen, shower her with gifts,and tell her that she "understands him SO much better than his W did" and "She is his true soul mate"
But eventually, that relationship will fall apart too. When his true self starts to show. You think that you are married to a truly good man, who is just acting badly right now. But that is not the case. you are married to an abuser, a controller, who is only looking for a woman to make him "feel good about himself". He doesn't care about your EN, he just wants you to take care of his. But in real life, even in good M's, people sometimes have bad days. Sad days. Days when they just feel bad. No spouse can make you feel 100% good all the time. And when this man feels bad, he lashes out,and blames you. And he will do that to the next woman too. He will act like a Prince in the beginning, and slowly he will go back to his true, controlling self. If she has 1 bad day, he will yell, scream, and call her names. And she will wonder what SHE did to make him so angry. Just like you are doing right now. And she will wonder what SHE can do to turn him back into the prince, just like you are doing now. But the truth is - he is not the prince. And by then, you will have moved on with your life, and you will feel sorry for her, but it wont be your problem any more.
Tm2L- have you finally come to understand the depths of his sickness? The man has carried on with a teen age girl! He has robbed her of this past year of her life, when she should have been hanging out with boys her own age. I don't want to hear about how she is "mature for her age" or "that is the way it is with band members"
Your H has spent the past year giving this girl the impression that the two of them are a perfect match. Just look at how this girl cried, and became depressed when she thought their relationship was over.
I have a 17 year old step daughter. If some almost 40 year old man starts coming around and hanging out with her, just the two of them, and calling her mobile, I will rip him a new a$$! Mark my words. 17 year old girls should be doing 17 year old things. Not hanging out with creepy older men who should be home with their W and children.
if your H continues to rob this girl of her child hood, you need to tell him what a sicko he is. Your own little girl will be a teenager some day. do you want her putting so much time into a relationship with another woman's H?

I don't think he will ever truly file the papers. you have signed them, you gave them to him.
Pull yourself together, and file them yourself. He will freak out, but so what. File the papers, and put the house up for sale. I can not imagine that you will ever be truly safe there - and it sounds like the kids are not really happy there. Sell it and move. Start building your own life. Dont give this man one more day of your precious time. You are NOT helping the kids, by staying "married" to a man who acts like he is single.

Thank you. I read her thread and it does give me hope. Now I just have to find my strength. Having 2 kids under 4 means it is so much harder, but I will find a way. I have to.

He's making my life hell today. I'll fill you in.

Thank you WOF for taking the time to write this response to me. I want to read it over and over. Fear is big on my list. I'll fill you in...

Tuesday - he emailed this:

"2M2L,

PLEASE MAKE ARRANGEMENTS FOR OUR DIVORCE TO BE FINAL. THIS IS NOT A JOKE AND I WISH YOU TO TAKE IT SERIOUSLY. I AM HERE CRYING AT MY DESK AND HARDLY ABLE TO WORK BECAUSE OF HOW UPSET YOU HAVE MADE ME AND CONTINUE TO. eg: THE OTHER NIGHT.

YOU TWIST THINGS AND CONTINUE TO WISH ME TO CHANGE MY MODUS AS PER HOW YOU ARE FEELING AND HOW MESSED UP YOU ARE. I WILL NOT BE CONFUSED AND HURT BY YOU ANY MORE.

I AM SO ANGRY RIGHT NOW THAT I COULD LITERALLY WALK OUT OF HERE AND COMPLETELY LOSE IT. THE IM [color:#000000][plan B] THINGS HAS FOR SOME REASON HIT ME ONCE AGAIN WITH FULL FORCE, IT HAS HIT ME SO HARD WHAT YOU DID TO ME OVER CHRISTMAS WITH HER THAT I CANNOT RECOVER. MY [censored] TEETH AND CLINCHED RIGHT NOW AND I FEEL AS IF I AM GOING TO VOMIT."[/color]

Just now, Friday morning, he emailed this:

"To Acid. I find it perplexing that you have 85 people that you would gladly invite into our home? 85 people that can now see and clearly identify my children. I will not ask you again to remove them from your Facebook, I have made changes to DD's photo with Michael Buble and I think after up to 10 pleas it's enough.

Funny how you requested to be exBoyfriends's friend. From lunch in one of our darkest times in which you cared less if it hurt me or not to now befriending on Facebook. Every step is only making me hate you more.

Also my daughter would not say the things she says such as this morning if not being fed by you. I and my mother and brothers and father know that you are behind it because that it what you have shown in the past. That's what you do. I will be talking to some people today about finalizing the divorce, I would be extremely suprised if you had not made your own enquiries in order to control the situation and hurt me as per usual.

I didn't think it possible to add hate to how much I already have for you but you are making it possible. What you did to me over Christmas concerning my children with IM is unforgivable and I grit my teeth and fight my shaking everytime I go there. I [censored] HATE YOU FOR THAT PERIOD, YOU ARE ACID."

Last night he came to see the kids as arranged at 7pm. He arrived, I left and went to mum and dad's and then to a friends for a spray tan. We had a great time and a glass of wine and he didn't try and call me.

I got home at 9:15pm and he was eating my chips on the couch. I sat with him and shared the chips and asked how the kids were. Small talk, but nothing about me or my night.

He left at 9:30pm but said no to my request to return a dvd to the video store on his way home.

This morning DD called him (usual pattern) and passed me the phone saying "mummy, daddy wants to speak to you. He's going to be nice and he loves you".

I asked him if he told her to say that and he said no.

She knows his calls make me upset sometimes and in his remorseful moods, he tells her to "tell mummy I love her"

He blames it all on me though and tells his family and they all think I am evil.

He has the signed divorce papers and I am happy for him to file. Because we have not been seperated for 12 months we will have to lie about the date of separation and that is why I will not file. I am happy to divorce, but not to lie. He and his family will find a way to hold that over my head forever and I guess it will be through the children. I wont give him that satisfaction.

I have been civil to him each time I see him or speak with him but he would have hated that I was not all over him last night and that I had the signed divorce papers ready for him to take with him last night. Today's email is his retaliation of that.

I am acting strong. He texted me last night about Facebook and called today to tell me to take off my kids photos. He says it's a privacy/protection thing but I know it's about control. I told him I cannot access Facebook at work, but the friends on my Facebook are all people that I would invite into my home and show photo albums so I don't know why he's upset. He found a reason, exBoyfriend.

I am friends with exBoyfriend's sister and they added to me just last week. I haven't had any contact with exBoyfriend since September last year, but he maintains that my one lunch catch up was more poisonous to him than the 7 months he has spent lying about his relationship with OW.

I have given up trying to educate him or retaliating. I just want peace and quiet.

Oh, in case you forgot me mention before, "Acid" was the cute little pet name that OW and WH called me.

I don't know if I can sell the house. We are almost both on the title and stopping that process will be difficult and costly. We are going to save over $700 per month on the loan by refinancing as a couple and it seemed like a good idea at the time to make him accountable with his payments to me.

If we divorce, it will take up to a year with asset division and compulsary mediation.

The anger management group does only start in May, but you are 100% correct that he could have gone for counselling elsewhere.

I asked him last night if he wanted the kids all weekend next weeekend as I have a 3 day course for Landmark. He said no, it will confuse the children. He just loves to throw my words back at me after I told him that he confuses them by staying then leaving etc.

I am on a rollercoaster ride again.

Lucky tonight is my night off to have a drink with friends. WH would not sit with the kids tonight either so I asked my sister.

I guess I should be happy that he is respecting our visitation agreements.

Save all these poisonous emails from him. Trust me.

When you realize what a mistake you are making staying in contact with him you'll know what they are for.

I keep everything. I might be extremely paranoid and although I never want to use them, I feel peace knowing they are there.

He just sent me a text saying he is at BMW and our contact has gone to Mercedes. WTF?

Now I assume he has a day off or is out of the office. He was on email from work this morning but why did he feel it necessary to tell me about a car contact? It would be interesting if we were talking and he wasn't threatening me.

I am DIZZY, wah wah, wah wah

So, it's 10:57am. He called:-

"Hey, guess what? I just realised a way that I can hurt you. It's going to cost me a lot of money but it's going to hurt you really bad. Are you typing this out?" Hang up.

Yeah, he can come see you after he scratches himself up and have you arrested.

Men have done this.

Beware!

This is not the marriage I signed up for!

I worry that he is going to try and take the children. That would cost him a lot of money but it would certanily hurt me.

The expensive car and the house are currently in my name.

What am I missing?

He might try and have me arrested or put an AVO on me. Best part about that is I can put a counter one on him and include the children too.

I would bet on this one. Which is why I was going to tell you to print out that email and go straight to the police and demand that they enter that into the records that he has threatened you in some way.

That way, when something comes out, and it will likely involve you looking like you did something, you'll have already warned them it was coming.

Do this today!