Hello
I am finally to the point that I can admit my wife is engaged in at least a EA if not more. Long story (aren't they always) but she stills says they are just friends. I have confronted him and told her she must have NC. Obviously an angry outburst was the result. She blames me. I am jealous and insecure (that what the OM said when I called him) and that I just want to smother her. I know I need to follow plan A and B. I am working with a counselor and he subscribes to the LB/MB theories. A year or so ago we went to him and were working on it. We stopped since she seemed unwilling to work on it.

I can see past Plan A. In fact over the course of last few months I have been doing it somewhat. Problem is she is very entrenched in this relationship. My thought is to get into counseling as the carrot and then use the stick by getting to a position that she understands I am willing to stay and work or leave if she doesn't agree to NC. I know only a little bit about the OP and can't really expose him. We're a step family. my DD knows and the steps know, but have been conditioned that opposite sex friends are ok. They have all been to his house for a BBQ and know to not tell me.

I have learned that there is no such thing as being brave. There is only being scared $$$$less and knowing and doing the right thing.

Having typed all this and reading here. I know what to do. Question is can I do it and is counseling first really just a cop out on insisting on NC?


rosecroix

Wow, if she refuses to end her affair and you have been doing this for months, then you are ripe for Plan B. She has no intention of respecting your wishes and clearly would choose her affair over her marriage. You really have no good options here other than to either accept that this will be your lot in life or.... separate...

The MB path is to do Plan A for 6 months [or less] and then move to Plan B, which is separation.

Are you sure this is an affair?

Is this jerk married?

You would probably get more benefit out of eating pickles than going to counseling. What is counseling going to do? make her do what you - her beloved husband - couldn't do? Use some magic, clever words to force her to end her affair? Marriage counseling is useless when one member is in an affair because recovery is impossible.

In fact, if you do manage to coerce her into counseling you will likely end up divorced. Your typical MC is not promarriage and focuses on CURRENT FEELINGS. Your wife's current feelings are warped by her addiction to her affair.

On the other hand, insisting on NC would force the issue one way or the other. You can't very well live in a marriage where your W openly engages in an affair.

And i will tell you this is an affair. Of that I am certain. Can you imagine a wife choosing a "friendship" with a girlfriend Betty at work over marriage? Of course not! Your has told you she does not care about your feelings so she is either in an affair or is profoundly thoughtless to do this to you.

And if this guy is her "friend" then why can't he come over and be "friends" with all of you?

p.s. has she ever had an affair before? How come she got divorced in her previous marriage?

Hang in there rosecroix. You are in for the ride of your life. Keep reading and posting here. I'm glad Melody jumped on this thread early...she's fantastic! Wise old veteran of MB.com...

And I forgot to mention...start snooping your tail off!

Put a voice recorder in her car. Keylog the computer and find out what she's doing. Track her cell phone...if she's got a smart phone get flexispy.com quick! GPS her car. Find evidence that this is a full blow EA...if not even a PA (sorry...had to say it).

Snoop, snoop, snoop, snoop...

DNU is right on about the snooping. Thanks for the vote of confidence, friend.

You are more than welcome Mel! I can't even begin to thank you for all the great advice...and the occasional 2x4 to the noggin

Happy to report NC strong, ENs being filled, LBs avoided, lots and lots of quality time together Moving forward...trusting more, but verifying (aka, SNOOPING!)

Oh, and by the way...SNOOP, SNOOP, SNOOP, SNOOP, SNOOP, SNOOP...and when you think you have had enough, snoop some more

We're a step family. my DD knows and the steps know, but have been conditioned that opposite sex friends are ok. They have all been to his house for a BBQ and know to not tell me.

Involving the kids?? I would at least tell your Bio daugther, by your post I am interpreting a DD from another marriage, to not attend anytime with this otherman. Telling the kids, especially, your daughter to lie about it is BS!!!

What is your relationship with your wife outside of this issus been like? Has she shut down towards you...affection, sex etc?

WW has lied about the OM. Has hidden what she did with the OM. Now admits to dinner with the OM. This was done so WW can deny a PA.

My years reading here say's this is a PA. You must expose to WW's parents and her siblings and the OMW. Then gather intelligence.

You need to get a key logger for the computer. Copies of phone bills. Place a voice activated digital recorder to hide in the home and to hide one in her car.

Then you need to get real time GPS for WW's car. This way you can tell if WW is at work, motel, or OM's home. Lowest cost to do this is to get a cell phone with real time GPS. Get the cheapest plan because you won't use much minutes and the GPS feature is included in the base fee.

Wow.
Maybe I am in denial about the PA? Doesn't really matter. An EA is bad enough.

The physical side of our relationship has obviously slipped. We still have sex but the quantity and quality has lessened. It is clearly our emotional relationship that has left.

I really think I have enough info. It is there, still going on and not going to stop. I know that. Will having all the specifics really help anything? My thought was to get her into counseling and use it as a way get us to Plan B. She is angry and violent at times. I think I have done all I can to get ready for separation.

MelodyLane asked about an affair and yes she had at least one in her previous marriage. I don't know that anything she has told me about it is reliable. I only got one side of the story.

Maybe I am being a dope?

I guess what I am denying is that if I believe that I have satisfied Plan A and it is not working, then Plan B must be implemented and as quick as possible. I am not sure that a day or two extra will hurt, but I need to do it.

Do you know what Plan B is, RC? It is a separation that is initiated by a letter telling her that her affair is very hurtful and that you will not have any contact with her until she ends it. You would have to separate first, get yourself legally protected and then cut off all contact. You would give her no advance notice.

In these situations, the BS tries to get the WS to move out, but you have an unusual situation with your 2 step daughters. That might not be so easy to accomplish. Can you get her to move out?

I am horrified that she is introducing those girls to her sleazy affair. She is teaching them that right is wrong and is screwing with their heads. Has she done this to your DD?

I would also suggest having a meeting with the OM and asking him what his intentions are with your wife. Let him know if he intends on pursuing this that you will have him named in any divorce proceedings. [if you are in a FAULT STATE] He needs to know you will fight for your marriage.

Do you have the book Surviving an Affair by Dr Harley?

I'm right here with you RC. My WH has been in an EA for the last year and a half and filed for divorce 4 weeks ago. Have you done COMPLETE exposure? I'm doing that this week. I have already told a few people, which has resulted in the typical anger, but also WH feeling embarrassed to be in public. He's says he's embarrassed to be seen with me, but I think it's moreso he's embarrassed to just be seen. So it's working.

This place is great! Lots of great advice! Make sure to listen with both ears.

Momtobug, just an observation from watching past exposures, it is best to do it ALL in one fell swoop to get the maximum effect. Ideally, on the SAME DAY. For example, you might send a certified letter to his employer and on that day, make phone calls to all other targets.

Otherwise, it is like bringing a pea shooter to a gun fight, it just annoys the affairees but doesn't knock them out. Doing minimal exposure allows them to quickly recover and brush it off. It is harder to brush off a MAJOR exposure when you have to explain your sleazy self to 5 people. It is a real wake up call when you have to see how disgusting you look to 5 family members in the same day.

Doing it all in the same day can have a powerful impact that is very hard to recover from. And if you are going to infuriate the affairees, you might as well get your money's worth and get some bang for your buck!

Good exposure targets are:

OP's spouse
OP's parents
employers
WS and BS parents
close friends and family
pastors
CHILDREN <----very important

We have a template letter for exposing workplace affairs if you are interested. It was developed by BritsBrat, a corp attorney and board member.

and the more people that know, the more ppl are watching so the affairees feel very SQUEEZED..

Well today I asked if we could talk a bit about things and she seemed willing. To get to the meat of the talk, I again emphasized that it was me or him and that she would ultimately have to decide. She was upset but not as bad as I expected. I think some of this has sunk in. She told me that a txt msg she lied to me about was really him. He sent a txt early in the morning yesterday, waking us both up. I find his audacity hard to fathom. Of course I got the usual blah blah blah reason and didn't tell me cause I'd be mad. Whay can't she see that most husbands would be upset for a non emergency?

She is going to meet with my counselor this week. I will hopefully talk with him before. He has advised me to tell her she must stop. He uses MB/LB materials, so I am hopeful he is aware of or will support the Plan A/B. Still hung up a little on this snooping thing. I am sure it is my fear of what I will find. It's why we never look under the bed. In this case there is a monster and I have no wish to see it face to face. I know OM exists.

I am a work in progress

rosecroix

RC, i take back what I said about your counselor, I see now he is familiar with MB concepts and is giving you good advice.


I think that you are not going to solve the problem unless you get up and stop being a conflict avoider. This is ridiculous, Rose. Too afraid to face the truth? If you are too "scared" to even to do the most BASIC things to save your marriage, i will predict RIGHT HERE AND NOW that you are not going to make it.

Your marriage is under assualt and being too scared to look at the field of battle is going to result in your death. IF you want to save your marriage, you need to knock it off right now.


He should call 911 or his mommy for an emergency. He should never contact your wife. Why not have a visit with this man and ask him to stop?

Will your wife end all contact with the OM and send him a no contact letter? Is she willing to do that? Here is the no contact letter from Surviving an Affair:

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5060_qa.html


Dr. Harley: My advice is to write a final letter in a way that the victimized spouse would agree to send it. It should begin with a statement of how selfish it was to cause those they loved so much pain, and while marital reconciliation cannot completely repay the offense, it's the right thing to do. A statement should be made about how much the unfaithful spouse cares about his spouse and family, and for their protection, has decided to completely end the relationship with the lover. He or she has promised never to see or communicate with the lover again in life, and asks the lover to respect that promise. Nothing should be said about how much the lover will be missed. After the letter is written, the victimized spouse should read and approve it before it is sent


[from SAA, pg 58]

OW, I want you to know that out of respect and love for my wife and children, I have come to realize that I must never see or talk to you again. My relationship with you was a cruel indulgence that BS did not deserve. While I cannot completely repay BS for the pain I caused her, I will do my best to become the husband she has been missing. I care a great deal for my family and I would not want to do anything to risk their happiness. I will not make any further contact with you and I do not want you to make any contact with me. Please respect my desire to end our relationship.

Sincerely, XXXXX

I am not sure at this point of anything. I talked to a good friend who I sort of lost track over the years last night. He has been/still is in a very similar situation. I come to find out from him that he had a EA with OW for a year. His insight into how much he denied it and only came to grips when she moved out of state was enlightening. It was also interesting when I asked him about recovery and how long it took. He was clear it was years and took counseling on his part to get past it. His wife also has had a string of PA and has been in and out of the house.

He sent me another email this morning that I need to keep in my phone daily to remind me what my focus is. His whole story is not good, and he presented it in a way that seemed very much to say to me "keep doing what you are doing and my life is how it turns out". Our personalities are very similar and so it rings a bell for me. His life is crap. He is willing to accept WW for the sake of the kids. He VERY clearly told me that I must do something different.

I am not ready financially to pitch her out. I need to get there soon. I need to get ready. I need to quit caring. It's too late for caring. WE must separate. I know that now.

rosecroix

RC, it's ok to still care. That is the only reason that you may want to try to R. That's not a bad thing. But you will lose the desire to R if you continue to be with a woman who is abusing you and having an A and continuing to do so IS abuse. Some of the worst kind.

Plan B protects what love you have left so when she comes to her senses, you will HAVE the desire and love left to go through R.
It's when you stop caring you're done.