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Please explain to me how to select just lines to quote. Previously, I've clicked on quick quote or quote and then deleted everything I didn't want. All your responses to me in the last two days are so good that I would like an easier way of selecting certain thoughts to quote and then comment on.
D-Day EA 11/29/08 D-Day PA 12/12/08
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MF, BR, Chai... I typed those words "still can't believe it" many moons ago, and the disbelief persists, although not as intrusively as before.
Maybe because we are not psychiatrists/psychologists, we are failing to appreciate the finer points of PSTD. Here we are, all describing the exact same thing. What are the odds that we are all alike in temperament or personality?
We experienced a profound blow, and we each know first hand how deep it hit. Odd that we would expect to get past it easily or quickly. But how could we know? Wish Dr. Harley had explained about the scarring...
Me BS 61 Him FWS 63 Married 40 years D-Day 6/30/06 Still can't believe it. 6/08 Recovering nicely. Anything is possible!
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Ah, Goldenyears, I'm glad I came looking for you tonight. You bring up something I've been thinking about for quite a while now.
Not sure this is what you want to hear, but nearly three years past D-day, I have a hard time listing the actual reasons I love my FWH.
Am I happy and grateful that he dumped OW and chose me? Yes. Has he been a better husband than ever before? Yes. Am I happy with the changes I've made in myself? Yes. Do I believe he truly regrets his A and won't do it again? Yes. Do I finally feel "safe" with him again? Yes. Have I finally forgiven him? Yes.
So what's the rub?
In an attempt to figure this out, I've tried running through the list of all the attributes I admire and applying them to him. Hit the wall every time, probably because he hurt me so badly with their exact opposites, in so many ways... and yet I am aware that I DO love him.
All I can come up with is that my problem isn't that I don't love him. I just haven't reached the place where I admire him. Two different things, no? Might we have an "admiration bank" as well as a "love bank?"
I mean, I thank him, express appreciation when he meets an EN, or works through a difficult conversation with me, or just does something sweet. I care about him very much. But as for admiring him in a global sense, I still struggle with that. Maybe it's different when you've been betrayed after so many, many years of marriage, four decades of believing that you KNEW your husband, trusted him so completely, only to have him smash your heart, your confidence, your faith, and everything you believed in, just when you're entering "old age."
It took so much out of me. It's a very real loss. I can rejoice over a rebuilt marriage, but the sadness lingers. What's done cannot be undone, no matter what comes after.
Maybe all this means that I (and we) are not yet fully recovered, I dunno. I am not unhappy, I am just very different inside from how I was before. Having to make such a huge adjustment to a different, much harsher reality at 60 is incredibly difficult. (I imagine our younger counterparts could make the same case for their own situations, and I wouldn't argue...I'm just looking at why it might be this way for ME.)
It isn't resentment that fuels this. Maybe it's fear, or just the after-effects of very deep trauma. I don't think we all react in the exact same way, no pat formulas.
Maybe that inability/refusal to admire is a way of keeping myself safe, deep down inside. It isn't a conscious decision to withhold anything on my part, just a wall I hit. I'm hopeful that as more time goes by, continuing the good stuff we've been building, that I will be free of whatever it is that's causing this. That the scar will fade some more.
I'd love to hear your thoughts on this. Maybe we can work through it together. If anyone else can relate, I hope they'll chime in too.
Right Here Waiting rightherewaiting, I am amazed that you and the others who responded to my latest post have recently experienced the same concerns. Only a few months into R, I feel that i can say yes positively to five of the six questions you asked yourself. Only the feeling safe gets a tentative yes at this point. For all these reasons, I love him. You are so right about the inability to admire the FWH. Before D-day, I thought he walked on water. Now, I have a hard time believing that he is the same person. There is no longer any honor to admire. Oh, my, yes, I am a totally different person. I no longer enjoy my volunteer work. I don't take the same delight in my family. I am forever changed. I'll log back on later for my other thoughts on your post. You are always so helpful.
D-Day EA 11/29/08 D-Day PA 12/12/08
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Is it normal to be this confused about why I love him? I believe it is because I feel the same way, and we've been in R for 2 years now. It's funny that I read this today because I have been wrestling with this lately quite a lot. What I have come up with is that there is a self-defense mechanism that will not ALLOW me to really focus on why I love him...because deep down I know I do, I just cannot figure out WHY, after all that has happened. I also believe I am angry at myself...why would I love someone who has hurt me so badly? This is not a conscious thought, but one deep down and where the self-defense mechanism kicks in to protect me. Maybe my sub-conscious thinks that if I only love him superficially, then he can only ever hurt me superficially again as well. [by superficially, I mean "not deeply" rather than "fake". Am I making any sense???] <shrug> Dunno, but it's something that I have been thinking about some as well. Yes, I feel as if I will live the rest of my life with a self-defense mechanism close at hand. In a sense, the mechanism is simply the memory of how someone I trusted so completely could have betrayed me so completely and hid it for three+ years. Such a long betrayal makes me wonder if the other 38 years were also fraught with lies and betrayal--I tend to believe that he was faithful during those years---but what if he wasn't???? See--it's a vicious cycle. I relate to how you feel about being angry at yourself for forgiving your H. I often say that I must be a pathetic individual to allow myself to go on with someone who had so little love and regard for me. I say this and yet I love him and do not want to face life without him. Am I just an utter mess or what?
D-Day EA 11/29/08 D-Day PA 12/12/08
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Gy,
You are not pathetic at all. I can tell you that it is far worse to split up a long term M, so be thankful that your H was willing to recover. Mine wasn't, and it has been a tragedy tearing apart 35 years. I've learned that there is a practical side to marriage as well.
Not only is there the companionship, the partnership etc. but there is the support for aging together. I'm now going into retirement totally alone and without the nest egg I thought I had. Not only am I not covered by WH's insurance (both health and life) anymore, but I have also lost the biggest asset which was our house. We had to sell in the worst market ever and lost almost all equity that we had. Everything else has been cut in half to split, then cut in half again because of the horrible economy. Add atty fees on top of that and debt accumulated on the A and you have a mess. Oh, and I forgot the tearing apart of a family.
I guess what I'm trying to say is that I'm not sure what I'm trying to say. lol Just that there are other factors in deciding to recover. Factors that relate to surviving and protecting yourself in this world.
BS - me 56 XWH - 57
12/25/06 - Dday - WH promised NC. Plan A in effect. Thought we were in recovery.
6-3-07 - Dday#2 Found out NC never took place and A never ended. Found MB NC promised again, but WH would not write NC letter.
9/07 - Dday #3. Still lying and sneaking around. Plan B implemented WH wants nothing to do with me
Divorced as of 12/09 after 36 years
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Goldenyears,
I am sorry you are feeling low right now. I have been reading your thoughts and I wish I had some good words of advice or encouragement for you, but I have been stuck on many the same questions. I do think your H is remorseful, cares about you, and wants a better M with you. I do think there is resolution to these thoughts, and have hope for you, your H and your M.
Hugs to you.
AM
BW - 70 WH - 65 M - 35 years D-day - 17 Apr 08 H broke contact 11/1/09 Back in love after the worst thing that every happened to us.
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Such a long betrayal makes me wonder if the other 38 years were also fraught with lies and betrayal--I tend to believe that he was faithful during those years---but what if he wasn't???? See--it's a vicious cycle.
I relate to how you feel about being angry at yourself for forgiving your H. I often say that I must be a pathetic individual to allow myself to go on with someone who had so little love and regard for me. I say this and yet I love him and do not want to face life without him. Am I just an utter mess or what? Golden, I have had those very same questions--what about all those other years? What else do I not know? Hard, because my life has always been pretty much an open book to my husband. I'm not the secretive type. Learning how his secrecy covered up so much dishonesty, I find it hard to believe there was none in the 37 years leading up to his A. I don't dwell on it like I did in the beginning. Just the same, something deep inside remains aware. Who's to say our self-protective defenses aren't a GOOD thing? Put into our psyche by a God who loves us, as a means of helping us protect ourselves, a biological, internal "security system"? If that is so, it's all right to just let it be. Good to know that we have a means of self-protection, no? On top of that, we have the power of an almighty God to lean on. Much better bet than putting all our faith in ANY other human being, as we've all found out. I think Chai makes a very good point regarding the practical elements of marriage. My heart has gone out to her as I've followed her story over the months. She has faced (with grace and dignity) every element of what we long-married BW's feared when we learned of our H's affairs...the painful loss of someone she loved who she believed loved her, and the daunting prospect of tackling the future, and our old age, alone. We whose husbands have returned to us can reclaim much--but the price includes the thoughts, questions and fears we've been discussing here. Ain't nuthin' perfect. But always best to focus on what we HAVE, not what we have not.
Last edited by rightherewaiting; 04/22/09 09:31 AM. Reason: spelling
Me BS 61 Him FWS 63 Married 40 years D-Day 6/30/06 Still can't believe it. 6/08 Recovering nicely. Anything is possible!
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Gy,
You are not pathetic at all. I can tell you that it is far worse to split up a long term M, so be thankful that your H was willing to recover. Mine wasn't, and it has been a tragedy tearing apart 35 years. I've learned that there is a practical side to marriage as well.
Not only is there the companionship, the partnership etc. but there is the support for aging together. I'm now going into retirement totally alone and without the nest egg I thought I had. Not only am I not covered by WH's insurance (both health and life) anymore, but I have also lost the biggest asset which was our house. We had to sell in the worst market ever and lost almost all equity that we had. Everything else has been cut in half to split, then cut in half again because of the horrible economy. Add atty fees on top of that and debt accumulated on the A and you have a mess. Oh, and I forgot the tearing apart of a family.
I guess what I'm trying to say is that I'm not sure what I'm trying to say. lol Just that there are other factors in deciding to recover. Factors that relate to surviving and protecting yourself in this world. What a special person you are to be so supportive of those of us going through R when your own R failed!!! Thank you for reminding me of yet another low that I could have experienced had my H and I not decided to recommit ourselves to our M. You will be in my thoughts and prayers. I stand amazed that I feel such a strong connection to people I've met on-line only.
D-Day EA 11/29/08 D-Day PA 12/12/08
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Golden,
I have had those very same questions--what about all those other years? What else do I not know? Hard, because my life has always been pretty much an open book to my husband. I'm not the secretive type. Learning how his secrecy covered up so much dishonesty, I find it hard to believe there was none in the 37 years leading up to his A.
I don't dwell on it like I did in the beginning. Just the same, something deep inside remains aware. Who's to say our self-protective defenses aren't a GOOD thing? Put into our psyche by a God who loves us, as a means of helping us protect ourselves, a biological, internal "security system"? If that is so, it's all right to just let it be. Good to know that we have a means of self-protection, no? On top of that, we have the power of an almighty God to lean on. Much better bet than putting all our faith in ANY other human being, as we've all found out. Righthere, Again, I see such a parallel between your story and mine--and probably a lot of our MB sisters. My life and thoughts were also an open book for my husband because I trusted him completely. Today I'm rebounding from a total meltdown last night. I haven't had such a bad time in several weeks. I told my devastated husband last night that I am forever changed and that I will never again have the kind of trust I gave him in the first 41.5 years of our marriage. He always says that he understands and reassures me. Your comments on trusting only God that much come at a very good time. H and I just finished reading The Shack, and we both found it enlightening. I just need to keep reminding myself that He/God has to come first--not third behind my H and my children. Again, it is so good to be back in touch with you again. I rely on your experience and hard-earned wisdom in this battle to regain marital happiness.
D-Day EA 11/29/08 D-Day PA 12/12/08
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Golden,
It's been a while since I checked this thread. I'm sorry about your meltdown...and also sorry I didn't think to warn you about them. Suffered many myself that first year or year and a half. My H was not as verbally supportive as yours, so perhaps you will have fewer. I do hope so. Remember, it's still early for you.
Early on I, too, told my H that I was fundamentally and forever changed. He didn't understand, and I was coudln't explain it. You obviously understand. I daresay we're not the only two this has happened to.
Toady, I'd say that it was an identity crisis in a way, as well as an attempt to adjust to a harsh new reality. In addition to believing I was safe in my marriage, I'd always known myself as competent, confident, and able to lok fear in the eye and do what I had to do.
To find myself completely demolished after I discovered his A and (some of) his lies left me questioning myself. Was I a fraud? Had I been fooling myself all those years? I was completely lost. Disoriented. Surveying the scene in my mind, I saw all the good parts of myself lying far away from where I was standing, smashed, irretrievable. How I would survive without them?
Of course, I DID survive, and God DID come to my aid. Led me to MB and all the books. Brought friends and family rallying around. They all prayed with me. A LOT. His angels on earth.
I got the strength I needed to move to the city H had moved away to, present myself at his door and tell him I was there to stand for our marriage.
He was not happy about this. Hurt me again, badly, and drove me back home after a month. I went back again 6 weeks later. Ultimately, We did the MB weekend, and I lived with him in that place another year and a half, while he continued to work with OW. Finally, he agreed to move back to our home. We came back nearly a year ago, and he is fully on board with recovery efforts. The changes in him are nothing short of miraculous.
Still, I am not the same woman I was before June 2006. In some ways, that's good, but in some ways, I still struggle to come to terms with the new me. Gotta believe I'll get there eventually.
RHW
Me BS 61 Him FWS 63 Married 40 years D-Day 6/30/06 Still can't believe it. 6/08 Recovering nicely. Anything is possible!
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