Let the PI do the work for you. He will (should) prepare a folder full of evidence; all you have to do is write the check.

Do you have friends of hers at work you can talk to and ask for help?

tc,

Based on the post above ... you have all the proof you need to take them down at work.

The University doesn't need to know whether the A is still ongoing, just that it WAS ... and that you are D'ing because of it ... AND may be considering legal action (keep it vague & non-threatening). THAT will get any major employer to take action. They will want to avoid the legal, monetary and reputational risks of protecting these two.

Tell the University ... "If you want to verify for yourselves, simply check your own email systems records for correspondence between WW and OM. I'm sure you will find all you need, in addition to the personal emails and other evidence I have already provided."

I'm sorry for your pain, but glad that you've finally found your strength to stand up for yourself.

Don't let others dissuade you ... you have every right to show the affairee's the "Consequences of their Actions", and bring their little SECRET chrashing down around them.

Remember ... "Revenge is a dish, best served COLD" ... do this work exposure with the steely eyed coldness of an assassin ... wear your best suit ... have your evidence copied and in an orderly manner for them ... speak quietly and confidently ... Thank them for their time ... and tell them as your leaving ... "My attorney and I will be watching closely how this is handled on your end".

However, there is potentially another option. Consult with an attorney, but considering you've helped put your WW through medical school, you may be able to get a percentage of her future earnings as a form of "Just Compensation" for your pain and suffering, but this won't likely be an option if your exposure causes her to lose her job.

It really comes down to what is more important ... and honestly, I can't answer that for you. Do you want to hurt them BOTH by exposing at work ... or do you want to hit her in the wallet for monetary damages.

Consult with a damn good attorney FIRST ... know your options ... and then proceed with righteous indignation. Maybe, if your attorney is very good, and the laws of your state provide for it ... you may get a form of BOTH, by exposing during the Divorce proceedings Discovery phase. Your attorney could subpoena the University's email records, which would effectively "expose" their A to the University, and still preserve your rights to some form of alimony.

YOU hold the cards now ... my friend ... play them WISELY for YOUR maximum benefit.

tc9

If you want to give Plan B a try that's up to you but given you are young, have no children, WW works with OM and was cheating within months of M I'd go with Plan D/FU.

If you want to expose to the University, stick with the facts and send a letter to the Dean, HR, and any other person/office of importance. I personally would stick their love letter emails all over campus in the interest of student education. To each his own though.

Stop torturing yourself with all of this and just hire a PI.

You aren't the only one who "can't believe the A is ongoing" without actual, physical proof.

So hire the PI and be done with it.

I guess one of the main reason's I want real proof is because I live in a state where I would get a 60/40 split of assets (or debt in our case) if I can prove infidelity.

The emails from last fall are ok, but they stopped using their work emails mid december (d-day 2). I'm not sure how long the university keeps email records.

I am guessing that their main form of communication is now a web-based email that WW only uses at work, instant messaging perhaps, and university issued pagers. Whenever I look at her pager, there are never any messages in it, not even from regular co-workers, so she either deletes them as she gets them, or the pager doesn’t save numbers. I don’t think she has another phone.

If they work together, they could EASILY be meeting at lunch, before and after work, or even during work hours.

Seriously dude...you're making excuses and wasting a lot of time. Just hire the PI.

If that's a primary reason for you then you need to evaluate what that additional 10% is worth. If that 10% is going to be eaten up with a PI or isn't a substantial amount, is it worth it? Is XXX dollars worth the headache and heartache of dragging this out?

I’m in the process. The town they work in isn’t a big city, so I haven’t found many. Google mostly just finds companies that say they serve the entire state. I’d rather find someone local. Anyone have good resources for finding a good PI?

I'm sorry ... I misjudged your determination, and thought you were ready to ACT.

Exactly how much difference is there between a 60/40 and 50/50 split for a 26/27 year old student? If there is a significant difference ... then hire a PI to get the PROOF you need ... otherwise, you're just making EXCUSES for continuing to do NOTHING.

You seemed to have a plan ... but now, you're back to being all over the place.

WHAT DO YOU WANT???

Divorce???

Alimony???

Assets???

Revenge???

Just pick the one that's most important, and then formulate a plan to achieve it ... or you could always just remain in a humiliating state of marital limbo hell ... YOU MAKE THE CALL!!!

If you don't have any kids, just kick her out and tell her what you require to start your marriage over. Then you'll see if she loves you in the first place.

What kind of skills do you think you need for a PI? They watch, they drive, they take pictures.

Good grief, just call someone! Quit being afraid of making her mad.

it feels like my priorities are changing on the hour. I don't want divorce, but feel that we're probably beyond any hope of healing our marriage. I don't want alimony. Right now, she is just a student earning a small stipend. As for assets (debt), there just a mortgage, some credit card left over from wedding costs, and about 100K of her student loans, all from before we were married. In the likely event of a divorce, all I am really concerned with is not getting stuck with her loans. I am really not interested in revenge as my primary goal, but if we end up divorced, I can't just let her walk away without some sort of consequences.

when it comes down to it, I guess my plan is to expose at work with real evidence in hope of finally achieving no-contact, while going dark with plan B. After that, if she decides she really wants to work on us, then I will have some more soul searching to do. If not, then I'll proceed to plan D.

I think you are hesitant to do what you already know you need to do.
Do you think that exposure at work without "real evidence" is less impactful than one with "8x10" glossy photos.
The goal of exposure and plan B is to salvage the marraige not retaliation and compensation.
You cant go attempt plan B and then when she comes back to her senses say "I searched my soul and found that I am glad you want me but I dont want you now" and then ride off into the sunset.
Seems clear to me that you are weighing the benefits of salvaging the M and enjoying the fruits of revenge.
Not an uncommon position once you find out you have been betrayed.
Take some time Decide first and then proceed accordingly.
They both cannot mutually exist.

tc9

I think you have two options:

1- If you don't want to be stuck with her student loans use that as leverage not to expose to her employer and proceed with D. I'm not sure if you'd be stuck with her loans anyway since they were accumulated prior to M so you should consult an attorney. Worst case scenario, if you get stuck with $40K vs $50K is $10k worth limbo hell? The housing market sucks so you may not even have any equity to split and can look into a short sale. After the D you could still expose to the University if you want...tough tacos for her.

2- Expose to her employer, Plan B and hope for the best. I don't think hope is a plan but the behavior of your WW doesn't give me much hope. You have no children and her refusal to leave the University where OM is says she's not willing to give up her wants for you. That she didn't think she owed your mother an apology for screwing you over and cheated in less than a yr of M, says volumes to me as well. If exposure at the school leaks back to OMW that could be a bonus. If you want to expose, I wouldn't bother with the PI. Go to the school yourself and ask to speak with HR director or someone of authority. If the people at the school have half a brain they will not want a scandal on their campus and will look into it whether they acknowledge this to you or not. If they don't believe you or you think that they will do nothing, fear not...the rumor mill can do wonders for shining the light on the A if you need to make a public service announcement as you leave the building or become more creative if you see no reaction in a week.

You're spewing the same indecisive drivel you did the last time you were here (50+ pages of it).

Just pick up the phone and expose with the e-mails you already have and toss her to the curb.

How many more times are you going to allow her to walk in your door with the stink and sweat of the OM on her?

You and I have some definite similarities in our situations. So I understand first hand some of your concerns, confusion and desires. My WH is also a Dr. whom I met when he was in med school, we got married during residency, he just finished fellowship, at a research hosp, and lft me for an ot who was working on his research project.


First you will not be responsible for her student loans. Even if you stayed married and she died, you would not have to pay them back. The only way this would happen is if you were a co-signer or it was in a pre nup. Which I am guessing neither of those things is the case.

Basic rule, what you bring into marriage you take out and what accrue together you split.

I also get your need to have proof. All of us BS's have that need to some varying degree, even if it is just to know that we are not the crazy person ws wants to make us think we are. With me I became consumed by it. I got it and it is both good and bad. Good in the sense that it will make it easier to move on and D and bad because if we ever get to a place where we try to work it out I have images and emails seared into my brain that make me tremble. For some the imagination is worse, you have to decide for yourself which is worse. Classic dmd if you do dmd if you don't.

As far as the pager, cmon, you know as well as I do it stores numbers. Stop trying to find excuses.

Trust your instincts, listen to the advice offered by the vets here they will not steer you wrong. This site is for recovery, of self and marriage. You just have to decide which it is you want and stick to it.

yeah, i know those things have to store numbers. I just found it a little strange to never see one number in there, not even harmless ones. but yeah, stupid excuse on my part.

as for proof, I am very right brained (engineer), so i'd rather have it than wonder. But, all the circumstantial evidence points to an ongoing A, so there is no doubt in my mind it is still going on, hard evidence or not.

that is because it is easier to erase all and not rsk gttng caught.

Then why in hell did you waste our time by starting a post titled "best way to end it?"???

I'm really sorry that I wasted my time responding to you, after KNOWING your history of indecision and inaction. Your WORDS are obviously meaningless ... and your ACTIONS show that you prefer to remain in "doormat" status.