I better sh*t up so

Lexxy, I totally understand your point. And in ANY other instance I would agree. But I will never agree to keep my mouth shut when I see children being hurt. Even if it hurts my chance of getting a WS back. Psychological hurt to children is forever. And they are helpless, physically and psychologically and developmentally, to deal with it without an adult protecting their best interests. Maybe if they're 15, I would back off; not before. Sorry, but that's my belief.

catperson, I know what you mean - it's a catch 22 really - if I say something Plan A is interrupted again as I am lovebusting again - and a big one this time - he hates nothing more then being judged - meaning the chances of getting back together are getting even smaller - the thing is, if we would be back together we wouldn't have this problem in the first place.
He was abroad for 4 years and this has not ever happened before -it's a result of the separation and cheating,not the working abroad I believe.

And the end result is the children are STILL hurt, their father then avoids them entirely, and is bitter towards BS.

What is accomplished?

Do you really think some magical occurance will happen when you provide him with facts and statistics?

If he were operating from a logical place none of this would have happened in the first place.

He is operating from EMOTIONS. And educating him is going to be offensive, and create many negative emotions in him. Very counter productive to Plan A.

Decision made: I am not going to say anything. It's the first time Plan A has worked for a while without me lovebusting and I would like to keep it that way. I am keeping the long term goal in mind. Thanks for all your opinions. It's so hard sometimes.

That is NOT a proven, steadfast outcome. Just yesterday someone was saying how his effect on his children is what broke him out of his fog.

If she doesn't want to tell him, she could consider finding another way to get him the information. Ask his parents for help, for example. Or a brother. Or friend.

As I tried to say, that is what I would do. You don't want to do it, fine. Don't. But if I saw my children crying or hurting over their dad cutting short a 3 minute phone call or ignoring them for weeks on end, he would know about their reaction, somehow.

I have trid asking people for help before and - it just backfired -if I ask them for help I have to tell them first what horrible father he has been for the last few weeks.I think what makes me angry most is that he will be back in the country next week and I am sure he will take the kids for a weekend in his parents house and he will look like the great dad again - but for me it's only show.Everyone else only sees one side of him and I see both.

I am just having a bad day today am in tears most of the morning - I think it's because I am keeeping in my anger and frustration about what happened or at least what I believe happened in for so long and it's just eating me up. If I would have one wish right now it would be to wake up tomorrow morning and to have no feelings for him anymore and to divorce him and never look back.

I think I mentioned before that it takes at least 4 years in Ireland to get a divorce - one of WH's friends who has been in a similar situation as us divorced his irish wife within 6 months using the UK courts - now he is telling WH to do the same with me.So I informed myself a little yesterday - it's not as easy for WH as for his friend as he has no british passport - he has to live permanently in the Uk for at least 1 year and then he can ask for a divorce - still less then 4 years but at least better then 6 months - just in case he goes down that route.

WH just called - he just landed in Romania. He said:"We have decided to hit the road for a few days." Let's hope that "we" means him and his Romanian Flatmate who is male but I wouldn't hold my breath.
The kids were so disappointed - they barely said a word when he called.

I took it as an opportunity to Plan A him and wished him a good trip, that he really deserves a break.

Best - Quote:I think it's not so much his abandoning us what scares me but the reason why he did it - I am not really sure of his reasons to be honest. Can you elaborate on what you mean?


How am I going to explain this - here is what I think happened.
I think WH started an EA / PA around August last year - funnily enough he also found out about me opening my shop around the same time and he was angry and dissapointed that I didn't fly over to see him for our anniversary also in August. Now I always said that I had never noticed any difference in his spending which is actually not true - I just never looked - his spending changed - he would take larger amounts at once and mostly on Fridays and Saturdays.

He blew up on the phone around the second week of September last year - it was actually a misunderstanding but I have never seen him that angry before - he named a list of things I had always promised and never done. This fight went on -mostly online for 2-3 days until he calmed down and I ended up doing all the things on the list I had always promised - one of them going on the pill again - we had always used condoms for years - if I ever get to proof that had a PA during that time I will kill him for that request actually.Anyway looking back at the fight now which came totally our of the blue I am wondering if he picked the fight on purpose.

Anyway I opened my business in November and we went back to normal - having said that I found a journal entry from last November where I noticed that he rarely said I love you anymore.

Fast forward to start of April 09 and him telling me that he fell out of love with me 6-7 months earlier because of the business - I am wondering what made him tell me in that moment - if there was something ongoing affairwise why did he rock the boat?

And why did the PI not find her but another woman 2 months later with him?

And now the dating with OW2 is presumably over too but he still didn't come back to me.

I think he didn't leave for another woman but to get his freedom back.I am just wondering what started the ball rolling.

Ok Best. My boss just dropped something on my desk. I'm going to get rid of her and then read.

Be patient...

Ok, I read when you wrote, but I think I need to begin at the beginning. I have to get to lunch. So I will be back in a little bit longer period.

no problem

My guess is he was spending a lot of time away from you - NOT getting any SF (bad sign for a guy) - and seeing lots of single, available women around, and he started to think of you as a drain on him. After all, he's a healthy man with real urges and needs...better off without you.

I am not convinced - I think that a "relationship" with a particular person started all this - I could be wrong though...
In regards to SF - we had SF until a week before his I am not happy talk.
Anyway I am continuing with my Plan A - even though I don't know what I am up against at the moment - at least one thing Bubbles and Schoolbus always wanted me to do was to improve our communication and make the conversations enjoyable and I think I have finally achieved that over the last few weeks.I am working on getting access to his "secret" email account but it's hard - need to be patient though.

All in all I feel much better - I am trying to keep my eye on the long termn goal without losing myself in it.
I am trying to create an environment where my kids feel safe - I don't want them to feeel like I could disappear too.

Thus the appeal of having an affair - getting to have two women, and the first one being none the wiser. People have affairs because it's scary, exciting, sneaky, thrilling...they don't WANT to lose their spouse. They WANT to keep doing both of them.

I think you are underestimating the affect the urge has on men. Women usually start affairs because they're being neglected emotionally. Men start because they're wanting more - or more exciting - sex.

That's the danger of long-distance relationships.

I just read through Armywifie's thread - I think there are a lot of similarities between my husbands line of work and what happens in the military. Below quote describes it to a T:

"Almost all STBXH's buddies are treating thier wives like crap too, and some are divorcing as well.Pffft. Just a bunch of boys who see one of their own getting to throw off the anchor or marriage and family and get to go back to being a boy again - like they always really wanted. Disgusting."

I am not underestimating it - I am just wondering if he really wanted to separate back in April - I am trying to understand if he wanted both worlds - but if he did why rock the boat - if it was just random sex and there was nobody in particular why rock the boat - why not just carry on - I would have never known...
Just brainstorming here by the way...

Last night, FWW and I read aloud through the Love Busters chapter on resolving conflicts of time management and career choices. Dr. Harley thanked the airline industry (pilots & flight attendants) and the military (deployments)for creating the majority of his business.

I don't think that's an idle observation. Spending nights away from each other creates unhappiness for the spouses. My FWW and I experienced this heavily when I worked swing shift; we lost most of our time together.

He should have known that with his "I am not happy talk" and 2 days later mentioning the growing friendhip with the coworker that I would make a connection instantly - I just don't get it...
It doesn't seeem very smart for a cake eater who wants both.