If there is still contact between all of you, then recovery is impossible. Just know that one simple fact.

I told my children, and I'm glad I did. They were 1, 3, 6, and 8 at the time. Years later, I told the 1 year old when she was 6. I wanted her to not be surprised if she found out later. I think family secrets have a way of coming out.

When the kids know -- and all I said was "Daddy kissed Sophia on the lips" and "Daddy had a girlfriend and when you're married you're not supposed to have girlfriends."

Now, years later, with the marriage intact and Sophia a sad no longer discussed part of our past, I'm glad it's out in the open. They know they can come talk to us. They know they can mess up really badly and still recover.

When our oldest was in fourth grade, she was supposed to interpret the 10 Commandments. For "Do not commit adultery", she said "Don't have affairs." For "Do not covet your neighbor's wife", she wrote "Be happy with who you married."

She learned. I wish she hadn't learned so early, but she learned.

Cherished

[TJ]

Pariah, nearly everyone in your life has been the exception, from your immediate family clear through the people at church. The tragedies you have suffered have colored your view of everyone else in the world, and what you believe everyone else's viewpoint is. Given the awful things you've been through, that is understandable.

And although most people are not like the ones who have surrounded you, but are good, beautiful people, it's not surprising that you aren't able to see that, or to place the responsibility for your pain where it belongs.

Since your son still blames you for a shattering pain that is not even remotely your fault, it is reasonable to suspect that he may have the same difficulty. After all, he has surely been around a large share of the same people who have injured you.

Both of you will remain stuck in bitterness for as long as you misplace the blame for the evil things that have been done to you, including blaming yourselves.

My heart weeps for all that you (and Mel too) have endured. I am sad that you haven't found the healing that is possible. All the things in your life that could be good (including the friendship and camaraderie offered on MB) are tarnished by your acceptance of the framework evil people have tried to impose on your life.

[/TJ]

"the very REASON that your daughter came home and told you about WH and OW sleeping in your bed is because INSTINCTUALLY she knew it was WRONG, but as you pointed out, all the adults around her during that time, didn't appear to her to be saying that it was indeed wrong, so what did that smart little girl of yours do? She came to YOU - she asked YOU for validation that what she was thinking [that what her dad was doing w/ OW was WRONG], but as you said, "I let it go"...Tully, I believe you missed a golden opportunity to validate your daughter's instincts and guide her with truth...You underestimated her...PLEASE talk her about that situation"

Well said. I agree.

I'm alternately strong as a box of rocks and a Giver and a domestic goddess. And mad as hell but trying to rant only to friends, so as not to drive him back to her.

Upon discovery and confrontation he agreed to end it, initially wanted to in person, but I wasn't comfortable with that so he sent her an email which I was CC'd on, I know she saw it bc she tried to email him back to call her.

So I called her, my former friend. One question, is she HIV Negative (Yes) and she really wanted me to know that she'd never done anything like this ever before, ever. Do you think I care? Does that matter?

I asked if she realized what she had done to our children's friendship, never mind our friendship -- she'd thought about all of it, but this wasn't supposed to happen. Yeah, I said, those clothes just fall off in the motel. She just "loves him and thought somehow we'd all be happy, even though it doesn't make any sense." Yeah, you're right, it doesn't make any sense. And you are a liar.

And, this is rich, she really loved us as a couple. Well you sure took a dump on that.

She really wanted to see me and talk to me. I said no point. Can't believe I'm talking to you for more than 1 minute.

You are not to call him. OK. Do you understand? Yes. DO YOU UNDERSTAND? Yes. You are not to email him. OK. Do you understand? Yes. DO YOU UNDERSTAND? Yes. You are not to text him. OK. Do you understand? Yes. DO YOU UNDERSTAND? Yes.

Her: Can I please see you and talk to you? Me: No. Write to me, I don't care, but I may never respond.

He agreed to go to counseling. He feels ashamed and guilty. He didn't mean to hurt me. Yeah yeah, well whatever. Do I know it could recur? Yes. Do I have access to everything? Yes.

Have I scared the crap out of her? Yes.

Am I telling her husband? Yes. Am I waiting for her to do it? No.

The sad thing is the close friendship between our kids will just have to fade away. My son will never go to their house again. Their kid can't come here. I didn't want to do that to the kids, but I didn't do it. WH and OW did it to the kids. Too bad so sad. I will facilitate and cultivate other friendships with other kids.

Unfortunately they are in the same class. We love our son's teacher, she's the best of the lot, so unless we change schools... One day at a time.

But telling my 6 yr old that daddy had a secret gf for a month, and it was his bf's mom? I can't see that conversation yet. We told him that we were having a disagreement but we were working it out and it has nothing to do with him. So many of you will say this isn't enough truth. And you may be right. I need to get into counseling with H to talk about how to do this. One day at a time.

This is day 3...

Thank you. Happy to read any and all further advice... I know this isn't the end, but the beginning...

I admire you for what you have accomplished within just 3 days - you rock!

Don't hesitate to expose to OWH asap.

Nice job, shock. I'm not going to quarterback your decision to withhold from your DS. I respect that. But keep considering giving him age-appropriate info, especially because he's in the same class with OW's son. Things have a way of becoming known, and it shouldn't come from a kid in his class.

Expose to OWH quickly, before she spins your story.

S&A, please get ahold of her husband ASAP because she is likely spinning the story to him as we speak. He absolutely has to know and will need as much proof as possible.

As far as her asking to contact you, I am speechless at her chutzpah. How could she ever imagine that you could ever want her for a friend? Unfortunately, you will be triggered every time she does.

You need to be NC from her too, and you won't be able to do that while your sons are at the same school. You'll always be bumping into each other.

And since your WH will know that you're seeing her, he's likely to use that as a (sad, sorry, despicable) excuse to contact her - just a little bit - to make sure you're being nice to her. BTDT, have the T-shirt, it doesn't work.

NC for both of you has to be established at any cost, and I do mean any. Changing schools, changing jobs, moving, whatever it ends up taking. None of those things are worth the breakup of your family.

If your WH is serious about R, he will be willing to do any or all of those things, plus more. If he's not serious, you'll know that quickly enough, too. Actually, for where he is right now, he is not likely to be totally serious. He is very likely to have a false recovery, since this A didn't die a natural death but was interrupted while still near peak.

That's ok, just be alert for a false recovery, and we can help you through that, too. You can still recover fine after a false R - I have along with plenty of others - it's just one more common step in the process.

I would encourage you to read some of the stories on here and learn from the mistakes others have made. You will find a reflection of your own sitch in many of them, not the details necessarily, but quite a few similarities nonetheless.

Though your ordeal may not be over, trust me that you're in a very good place for everything that has happened so far. Keep reading, keep learning, and don't get discouraged. You've got a very good chance here, and you're a champ for getting so much done so quickly.

S&A,

I exposed to my children, who were at that time ages 6, 8, 10, 13, and 17.

There are so many reasons children need this information.

Do you have any questions about exposing to children that I might be able to answer for you?

Please, please, please expose to OWH right now. I can assure you she is plotting her spin and maybe even already started the fog babble to him.

He has a right to know and should have the opportunity to protect himself and his children from YOUR husband.

This affair will most likely go underground, not end. You and OWH need to be in contact verifying on BOTH sides that the affair partners are not in contact.

I'm sorry. It's just the way a wayward works until they are completely defogged.

The fact that the kids are in class together is problematic. The fact that you have an excellent teacher is good. Talk to the teacher about the situation. You know how this goes--classroom parties, school plays, assemblies, etc, etc. You and your H will continue to see this couple unless you move.
Believe me, the affair will rekindle if there is constant access. My H restarted his A after a YEAR of NC. All marriages hit rough patches, and if there is an easy out, waywards will take it. You need to think seriously about moving to a new school district. Sorry to tell you this, but unless you do,you will be back here after a false recovery.

Meanwhile, your H and the OW SHOULD NOT be allowed to attend any school functions at the same time. PERIOD. Honestly, they should both stay home and figure out where they got thier warped sense of morality, but at the very least, they need to trade off, every other event.
This goes for soccer games, class picnics, anywhere you used to see this couple. You and the OWH need to stay in constant contact to verify stories and comings and goings, or YOU WILL BE LOOKING AT A CONTINUED AFFAIR.
Your case is not so different from many here. Many thought they could walk the line, and every one of them has failed. With continued contact, there can be no recovery.
Your children will be confused about not being able to see their friends--you need to be honest, in some way, about the fact that daddy and the OW skank are responsible, not them.

Thank you. I'm very efficient. But I know this is far from over. For any of us. But the only people that matter to me are Me, Son, and FWH (and keeping it FWH, and not WH.)

My pain and anger is not over. And nor is his. He has terrible grief and anger over his waning (but far from over) career, his mother's Alzheimers which wiped her out mentally 2 years ago, my debilitating depression two years ago (fully recovered and continuously treated), my parents' extreme health problems which have been occupying both of us for a good year, especially horrid the last 3 months, all of which he needs to work on, accept, forgive -- these are things that will be part of our recovery. I acknowledge and own the deficits in our relationship over the past few months, and of course off and on since the beginning, but we were madly in love for many years, and I want that back, so it's not over and never was close. This is a bump in our road (OK it's whiplash, OK it's like gasoline and a match, whatever it's huge and horrid, and you all know what I mean). But OW could never be what I've been to him, and will continue to be, unless/until I choose not to. But right now I choose Recovery bc I love him. And he says he is willing to work on it with me.

And yes, I realize the A may have to end more than once. I'm cautiously optimistic but I'm not blind. And everything I've read her resonates, the language, the rationalizations, the abducted by aliens (love THAT metaphor, so true!)

As for my son, I've made no decision to not to fully disclose, I just want to do it carefully and with professional help. I hear what you are all saying, but I'm not ready yet and while I'm not interested in protecting WH, I also want to handle it in a way that we all recover, which I'm sure you all did, I just need to tread carefully. Son has been preferring me over WH for last several months and this is not typical since I've not been the primary caregiver since he was 2, as I work FT outside the home, and H works at home. And this recent preference KILLS WH, makes him so so hurt, whereas I accepted the opposite when son preferred daddy. Sad...

And, thanks in part to you all, I'm going to look into switching schools. He's just been identified this month as gifted & talented, 3 years early, been reading fluently since 3, and has been academically advanced since preschool where they taught him long division, which I thought was nuts, but whatever. Just let the kid PLAY for goodness sake. That's what he needs. (OW's son has no such gifts. In fact it's been hard for my son to understand why his bf can't read but I take great pains to make him understand that everyone learns differently, that there are lots of things my son couldn't do or still can't and is learning, and that we learn for our whole life, and most of his class is still learning sight words. I digress.)

I ordered 3 of Dr. H's books on Sunday. They are arriving at my office today. I'm going to read them all. I'm following Plan A (to the extent that I understand it.) I'm also busy with a demanding job but I've put my priorities in order on that level. I've been working from home since D day just to get my act together.

So I gotta go make a meat loaf and head to a meeting. But I'm waiting til after lunch cause that's when the PA took place. Over lunches. Nice.

And yes, she and I will have NC --- this might take a little while given school. Moving out of state because of that drippy whore is not on my plan for now, but no I will not see her, forgive her, make her feel better, whatever crap she wants from me. Our friendship which clearly never was real is so over, and I made that abundantly clear. And all the friends of mine I've introduced her too since we met are getting the news. Several already know and they are sick. One actually vomited. Say they'll not look her in the eye. So she'll reap what she sowed.

Furthermore, not sure where Plan A is on this and not everyone would likely do this, but I threatened her in the one phone call I made to her after he sent the end-it email that if she ever came near my family, I'd make her life miserable in ways she can't begin to imagine. I said I'm not threatening violence or anything illegal, and I'm not (of course!!) but it wasn't an empty threat and she said she believed me. Perhaps not the most Christian reaction on my part, but hey, turning the other cheek isn't on Plan A that I can see. Do you know how strong I am? (I asked her) Yes, she whispered from her sad little cubicle at work. NO, NO YOU DON'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT ME. Can't quite recall how the conversation ended but she was whispering some crap about (I think) hoping we work it out (me and H, not me and her) and I hung up without letting her finish whatever crap she was spewing. Gave her more of my time than she ever deserved. And I need to stop obsessing about her, yes?

But now I know all about her, who and what she is, and I'm watching her like a hawk.

I can forgive him, if I choose to, and if he commits to R which he appears to have thus far. Trust will have to come later. It does return, yes? Not soon, but eventually??

Thank you again. I'll keep posting... This has been soooo helpful. My friends are awesome too, and you people are part of my support system. Thank you thank you thank you.

Warmest regards...

Did you call her husband, S&A?

I will just add that, since your son knows nothing about this involving his bf, he is going to internalize not getting to play with him any more. He is going to blame himself, think he did something wrong and is getting punished - even if you tell him that is not the case.

Because it won't make sense.

If you don't tell your son that your family had a falling out with bf's family, he will blame himself, and it will become part of his core being - for life.

I had to tell my D8 that she could no longer go anywhere with her grandparents! I explained that it involved an argument between both families, and unfortunately, this had to happen. So she'd know it was about the adults, not the kids.

Later, when she was about 12, I told her the whole truth. She was fine with it, and knew by then that it had nothing to do with her. It was an adult thing.

You have to tell him this.

Also, he needs to know, in case he sees Daddy with bf's Mommy, down the road.

Having to hear from a BS like this is just one of the possible repercussions of being the OP. I don't think that's a bad thing at all. Good for you!

I totally agree with Catperson. The boy will think this is his fault unless you explain it. Don't put it past the OW to tell HER son that it's YOUR fault they can't be together. Then your son will blame you and the damage will have been done. You must beat her to the punch. And OWH needs to do the same. You and OWH need to talk A LOT more.

OWH knows. She told him the night FWH ended it with her, and after I had called her to tell her to stay away from my family, or suffer consequences she can't imagine. In that call she lied to me that she and her H been in counseling but they are going to get counseling now. He told me that today and that she is seeking referrals as is he.

OWH is sooo sad. Of course we are. Thankfully he and I are on totally same page regarding our respective marriages and trying to recover them, and he's glad I came to see him and we are now allies in making sure A doesn't continue. He's afraid it will bc she claims to love my FWH. (I know I should still say WH cause it's only newly over and only because they got caught and it could recur.)

I learned a lot about the A from OWH because she told him things that my H didn't know, and/or didn't tell me. Combo of both. Nothing shocking really, just some stupid plans my H was thinking about, which I kind of knew but didn't have details.

And we laughed about how stupid their existing plan was. They actually thought that they could stay married to their respective BS's and be happier in their marriages by having the A. I didn't know that was the plan until OWH told me.

Laughable. Stupid. Wrong. And so very sad.

OWH going to fight for his marriage. He loves his W. I want his M to recover too. Not just because it helps me with the R of my M, but because OWH is a good man and he's been a good husband, and he loves his family.

I'm buying him the Surviving an Affair. He can't wait to read all about Plan A, etc. I gave him the basics but then I had to leave his house and go to work.

No regrets on my part. I was scared but woke up this AM knowing I had to.

Thank you all for pushing me to speak to him. I'm glad I didn't have to give him the news. But I was prepared to bc I had no idea if OW would've or if she would've told him the full truth or some spin. Of course it was some spin but it was very much the truth in that it lines up with what I know. He told me how much I scared OW on the phone Monday night. She's scared? Good.

I'm scary. In a good way for ME and MY FAMILY. Mama Lion is now wide awake and she is going to protect what is hers.

Did you expose this to his family/friends? Make sure enough people know to keep him accountable going forward. Also, he is going to snap out of it soon and feel like an utter fool. When he says he was a fool, AGREE w/ him! DUDE