Glad to see that it wasn't just me that couldn't get on the boards. Sad to see my story posted as SW is all lost. Thankfully I had cut and pasted some stuff from Schoolbus about the letter my cousin wrote to me. That was priceless insight and I so appreciated it.

Divorce dragging on slowly. New date November 30th. WH is in total denial. He still wears his wedding band to work and goes to great trouble to maintain the image he thinks he has. Everyone knows. He just won't admit it to himself.

D day was early May....I filed for divorce on May 16th and got WH out of the house on June 12. Remember how angry he was that I took ALL of his clothes to his new apartment? Because he would NEVER be there long enough to need winter clothes? Well, it was mighty nippy here in AR today. LOL. And the last time he dropped off ds he asked if he could have his leather jacket out of the coat closet. Hilarious stuff, but I resisted the urge to say, 'hmmm.'

I've been waiting for him to try and get me to just shove all of this under the rug. When he brought ds9 home on Sunday evening he did indeed say, 'You've dug yourself such a whole by telling everyone everything that you will never be able to get over it.' That I guess is his suave version of asking for me to take him back? I said, 'everyone knowing isn't the reason I won't 'get over' it. The horriblness of what you've done is why I won't get over it.'

Then we went on to argue at length about property and alimony.

After I subpeoned the cousin and the co-worker he immediately signed off on me getting full custody and visitation like I want. That part is done at least. Glad of that.

I've basically told him the settlement can be mostly my way or it can be the judge's way. I fully expect him to settle before Nov 30 arrives. I have a list of no less than 20 people who will show up in court and support me if he does choose to take it that far.

Will write more later....going to re-post the cousin list and ast least part of School Bus' response.

Cousin,

Look I owe you an apology, not only for what happened 7 yrs ago but also for the recent instant messages and the way I have handled the situation. I am very sorry that I hurt you and put you in this position. I dont have any excuses I just made a mistake. I have justified it to myself for so long even tho I know it was wrong. I doubt any of this is going to make you feel better but I hope you will accept my apology and we can some day move past all of this.

I am sorry for the hurtful things I said to, and also about you, it was childish and petty and unnecessary. To me this is old news, but to you its like it happened yesterday. I am not going to pretend that I know how you feel or what you are going thru because the fact is, I dont, you have every rite to be hurt, you were betrayed by a member of your own family, what I did to you was awful. The reason I lied to you is because I was a drunk and a child and I did not care who I hurt, it doesn't make it right, and I know that. I didn't tell you after that because it had been dormant for so long that I didn't want to bring it up, and for that I apologize.

We all do things that we regret- we chose the paths we take and I am sorry it has come to this but I don't think the details are going to do anything other than further hurt you. I think the situation handled differently would have had a better outcome- when someone feels cornered they aren't usually as cooperative as one would like, but when a person is upset sometimes they do things they wouldn't otherwise say or do. In a situation like this its hard to know who you can trust, who is telling the truth and who is lying. I promise you, I have nothing to gain by lying to you. My husband knows about everything he knew about most of it before he met with you and now he knows the rest.

I will tell you anything you would like to know, but I will not take sides. I want to be left out of this from here on out. I don't expect you to ever feel the same way about me again, and that is okay. However, my husband and I and our child need to pick up the pieces and move on. I have paid for my mistakes and will most likely continue to pay for them, but I am done apologizing. I need to get on with my life.

I am so sorry.... Cousin

And then School Bus got hold of it...

My general read on her mood is that she is exasperated - with herself, the situation she is in, and the fact that this "thing" in her life has hung itself around her neck and now weighs her down like an anchor. She believes she is broken, but she is not quite there - yet. She is, however, on the way there. The letter is generally sincere. My comments below.



Look The word "look" is used here as an opening in order to prepare the reader for what is about to come - a blatant and open purging. She mostly gives you that, but then stops herself short when it comes to the details. Probably a wise choice for this particular letter, as she is likely not sure of the exact amount of detail you might want, and so she holds up on that.

I owe you an apology, not only for what happened 7 yrs ago but also for the recent instant messages and the way I have handled the situation. Specificity about the apology is always good. Too much generality leaves things open to interpretation - she gets straight to the heart of the matter.

I am very sorry that I hurt you and put you in this position. She acknowledges your pain, and your situation. Again, she knows what she has done and points to herself and apologizes for it.
I dont have any excuses I just made a mistake. I do not like the use of the word "just" here. The word "just" is probably what bothers you - had she left that out, you might have accepted it a little better. I would have liked it much better if she had said a HUGE mistake, a STUPID mistake, or thrown in an adjective, but the rest of her letter doesn't seem to use much of that type of language. Perhaps not her style.

I have justified it to myself for so long even tho I know it was wrong. Now THIS sentence is interesting. She tells on herself here. This is your answer to the question, "Doesn't she even feel anything for what she has done????" Well, the answer is YES. She tells you so, right here. This speaks to her inner struggle, but being a woman of little depth, she would not really embellish it for you.
I doubt any of this is going to make you feel better but I hope you will accept my apology and we can some day move past all of this. She acknowledges that nothing she says is likely to make much difference to you. She realizes SHE ISN'T WORTH MUCH in your book - and yet, attempts to play on this feeling with some guilt trip that maybe you will....GET OVER IT SOMEDAY. Yep....she believes that maybe someday you will all.....be friends. She is still in the fog. Sorry.
I am sorry for the hurtful things I said to, and also about you, it was childish and petty and unnecessary. She sandwiched a little. Something must have struck her unconsciously about what she had just written, because now she is back to the apology - a realization that this isn't about her wishes to repair the relationship, but about her apologizing for what she has done. She does mean this part, by the way. Very specific about the apology.
To me this is old news, but to you its like it happened yesterday. She read this phrase somewhere... and this bothers me. This sentence is VERY out of place. I cannot figure out why this is placed in this spot in the letter. It was an afterthought, or she meant to go somewhere with it, perhaps interrupted while writing. She never fleshed the thought out, but meant to.

I am not going to pretend that I know how you feel or what you are going thru because the fact is, I dont, you have every rite to be hurt, you were betrayed by a member of your own family, what I did to you was awful. What is remarkable to me is that she again apologizes for her own behavior - and completely ignores your husband here. If there was anywhere in the letter that she COULD have brought him in on the blame wagon, it was this exact spot, and she didn't. Kudos to her.


The reason I lied to you is because I was a drunk and a child and I did not care who I hurt, it doesn't make it right, and I know that.
I'm wondering about whether or not she is in a 12 step program and this is one of her steps...if it is, she is doing a bang-up job of an apology so far. I didn't tell you after that because it had been dormant for so long that I didn't want to bring it up, and for that I apologize. She's saying that the affair happened, then too much time passed. She knew at some point she should have fessed up, but either wouldn't or couldn't - and then, as more and more time passed, it became more and more difficult. This ties back to the earlier part of the letter where I pointed out that this has bothered her, and that she has in fact struggled with this over time.
This was the third paragraph. She has actually said her peace through this portion of the letter. Her purpose has been fulfilled, and now you see the tone of the letter change:
We all do things that we regret- we chose the paths we take and I am sorry it has come to this but I don't think the details are going to do anything other than further hurt you. I think the situation handled differently would have had a better outcome- when someone feels cornered they aren't usually as cooperative as one would like, but when a person is upset sometimes they do things they wouldn't otherwise say or do. Do you notice the change of tone? She is much more philosophic here, with the hypothetical being used. The upper portion of the letter was much more direct, this feels much softer. She's now pulling back, because she recognizes that this part contains more hurt for you. This is territory that she is not comfortable with, and also that this letter is really not intended to cover at all. This is an apology letter, and if she goes into details now, the entire letter changes purpose. She wisely draws back. In a situation like this its hard to know who you can trust, who is telling the truth and who is lying. I promise you, I have nothing to gain by lying to you. So, she reassures you regarding the sincerity of her voice, only in a different way than she does at the start of the letter with her "look" opening. This is more direct, and yet, softer. My husband knows about everything he knew about most of it before he met with you and now he knows the rest. Her version of, "My husband has grilled me over every single detail, and I am feeling a lot of pain. This has haunted me a long time."
I will tell you anything you would like to know, but I will not take sides. I am willing to tell you what you want to know in terms of details, but please do not ask me to say anything negative about your husband. I want to end up "friends" with everyone. I want to be left out of this from here on out. Somehow, I am hoping that I will be able to be the tornado in the family, and not be blamed for the damage I have left behind me. I want to walk away with the mess in my own house, and hope to all things holy that you can clean up the mess in yours - and hope also that I can tell everyone else that this apology made everything "all better". After all, I apologized, so YOU can move forward, and from this point on, YOU can deal with it. I don't expect you to ever feel the same way about me again, and that is okay. However, And this "however" is the reason she believes she can now make the rules. See, now that she has apologized, she believes you can call her about details - because that's what this letter said, and that the rules now are that you take care of your mess and she will deal with her family. This sentence is devoted to this rule. my husband and I and our child need to pick up the pieces and move on. I have paid for my mistakes and will most likely continue to pay for them, but I am done apologizing. "You won't hear another apology from me. I plan to let everyone in the family know that I did apologize, and I'm done. Actually, I am worn out, more than I am done. Just writing this letter has me done. Only......the next line tells much more of the truth than I actually really know about myself....." I need to get on with my life This woman is completely under the impression that she is "done" with this and will move forward. Only she is not yet at the bottom. She has a way yet to fall. She is operating under the concept that she has now laid the rules out to you - she has apologized (she did mean the apology, by the way - and now the rules are that your mess is yours, hers is hers, and the family will be repaired in some unspecified length of time (apparently after your healing is done).

The problem is that she has not fully dealt with her own issues of guilt, evidenced by her struggles noted in the letter, with the issues her husband will go through because he obviously did not know details until recently, and with her need to continue the "friendship" with her affair partner.


She isn't even close to having this thing stop weighing on her neck.


Lucky for you that you KNOW the course of recovery from MB, and you CAN at least predict the things you will encounter down the line - for the purposes of cleaning up "your mess". As for "her mess"????

Que sera, sera. .
I am so sorry.... Cousin

Ok, If anyone is watching this thread sorry for all those edits. I had a terrible time getting the colors right to indicate when SB was speaking and when my cousin was speaking.

I wish I had the rest of SB's analysis of that letter. She spoke some more about how although my cousin's apology letter was sincere, it contained language and lack of description commonly found between siblings who had been forced to apologize to each other. Interesting. I am positive cousin was at the very least strongly encouraged to apologize to me by her parents and/or her husband. In fact, the night before I had spoken to her husband for about 45 minutes and many of the things he and I discussed were in her letter.

There was also the religious component. Cousin has been in trouble with the congregation since that time period 7 years ago for other things she was involved in that were known. She only recently had started her journey back to her faith...clearly not totally sincere (or maybe just very weak) since she started chatting with my husband (and by now she is married herself) about all sorts of nasty things they had done and planned to do. So when I busted her out to the elders I really rocked her world. As one of the elders said to me, 'you may have saved her life.' She certainly did not need to come back with all that junk still hidden away.

Thus her entry back into good standing with the congregation was delayed by several months thanks to me. About a week ago she was let back in. It has been especially hard on my parents who are in the same congregation with her and her parents. My mother struggles so much that I want to bash my cousin on the head for causing so much pain. I've explained to my mom over and over again that this hurt is so deep that no amount of Christian forgivness will ever right things back like they were...and that is ok. It doesn't make my mom unrighteous or unchristian because she doesn't want to ever speak to this girl again.

Gotta run. Hope everyone is fine.

SW, I like how Dr. H explains forgiveness in the Just Compensation article. He likens it to cancelling a debt. When your mom is ready, she can cancel that debt that your cousin owes her, and that doesn't mean that it makes sense for her to speak to your cousin. They are two different things, letting go of resentments and choosing to let destructive folks in our lives today. Forgiveness is a gift we give ourselves, in time. But our decisions remain, we can forgive and still guard with care who we choose to share our lives with.

How are you doing SW? Still out there?

Doing ok. Waiting on the court date. A week from this Monday. Still no progress on settling out of court. Our court date is the Monday after the long holiday weekend, so Really only have a week left of business days to work it out.

Off the cymbalta completly and feel pretty good most days. My um, libido has come back with a vengence after getting off Cymbalta and so that is not helping my thoughts stay chaste. Been thinking more lately that hey, I will be free to date soon....happy about that than terrified about that.

Most days I feel like William Wallace....."FREEEEEEEEDoooooMMMMMMMM!!!!

Good deal, glad to hear things are going relatively well all things considered. Hope your court date goes well and that you both (you and your son) have a great Thanksgiving!

I'm glad things are ok for you. Since he's in denial, I figure he'll be a greater jerk than ever before once he goes into court.

You can always have his "ladies" deposed if push comes to shove. It doesn't matter who gets angry about it, the truth of how those women behaved with a married man is just that...the truth.

Doesn't matter how many "I'm sorry's" they say, they shouldn't have behaved that way. Some people might think it's vindictive to do that, but they chose their paths. You invested many, many years with soon to be xWH. The last two were the worst because you turned yourself inside out to be a good Christian, loving wife and he wanted no part of it.

You deserve every bit of property and alimony you can be rewarded, even if that means playing hardball. You gave your most fertile years being faithful to a man who could careless. He ultimately didn't even care about his family. You deserved so much more.

I hope, and it's also my prayer for you, that you find a good Christian gentleman of your Faith. One that is equally yoked with you. Once the D is settled, I have faith that God will bless you for your faithfulness.

Stay the course and remain chaste. No man who will consider touching you outside of M is worth your time, SW. keep that in mind when hormones rage. You deserve to be treated like the rare jewel that you are! Loved, cherished, and respected.

Keeping you and DS and even WH in my prayers.

God bless and keep you.

Jewel

You are awesome. Thank you. Really needed to hear that tonight. Very curious as to what man might show interest once I'm actually available. The way the world seems to work, most think I already am. Had a friend ask me a few nights ago, 'so are you dating yet?' I said, 'I can't believe you are even asking me that!' And I had to tell a high school class mate go away VERY firmly.

It has been almost 6 months since I found out. I'm beginning to want....something. Hoping to stay focused on the important things.

WH is just.....such a procrastinator. He won't settle,but I know he doesn't want to go into court and admit to adultery in open court in front of my family and friends. I think JUST before court he will want to settle....but just in case he doesn't I have to be prepared. So Monday I go see my lawyer and spent much more money to be prepared. So frustrating. Don't think I can call the girls in now....sort of gave that up to get full custody and my visitation schedule I wanted. But I can still bring in the adultery in general...to show *I* didn't want the divorce but was forced into it.

Thanks for keeping up. I'm nervous. 10 days until the Day.

You rock. You'll do just fine.

You'll do fine. We're watching and hoping for the best possible ending to this for you and your son, Smiling Woman. You really are an inspiration; I hope you know that.

Me an inspiration? Really? That surprises me....I feel like an idiot for spending 26 years with him.

Court date one week from yesterday. I met with my attorney yesterday..WH meeting with his today....I still think he will fold, but my lawyer is fully prepared to go into court regardless. WH found out this morning I am listing an antique truck that he had before we got married as marital propety. He added my name to the title years ago. Hee Hee. He is FURIOUS. Told me he would be having his lawyer file contempt of court charges against me for selling two old broken appliances this summer. I collected a whopping $120 for the two pieces of junk...I laughed at him and told him to go right ahead. Told my lawyer and he was like ''don't worry. At most you will have to give him $60. No contempt charges.'' Yeah, um deduct that from my share of that $20K truck thank you very much.

So it is getting ugly.

The only offer WH has on the table includes 1 year of alimony and me giving my share of our stocks to ds and WH keeping his 401K. IOW a non offer. He must be out of his mind. Hoping his attorney knocks some sense into his head today.

I told WH on Friday about all my friends and family that will be in court as support for me. I know he is really freaked out by that. My neighbor is coming too. My best friend too...been my best friend since we were 11, so WH knows her from way back and we were close to her and both her XH and current H. I have to have a Witness say I've been a resident of this county for however long and that WH and I have been separated since beginning of summer....My neighbor will do that for me. I wonder who WH will have as his witness? I don't think he will have a single person in there. Even his brother that I've talked to several times a week all through this says he isn't going. No way no how.

I'm trying like crazy to be calm and trying to remember worst case scenario is still quite good for me and horrible for WH.

I will keep you posted. I owe this board so much for seeing the red flags that led me on my quest to find the truth. Thank you all.

Oh Smiley we love you!

((((hugs))))

In spite of being frightened of what you might discover, you found the courage to investigate. You've drawn from your resources here, and played this all out in a very smart and civil way, despite your anger and outrage of what was done to you and your son. Yeah...I'd call that inspiring.

This waiting for an offer or to go to court Monday is torture. He told me he counter offered Wednesday evening but of course I haven't seen it yet due to the holiday. Hoping my attorney gets it to me this morning.

I mildly lost it Wednesday evening when he refused to answer my call. I called him about 20 times and went to his apartment. He wasn't there or wouldn't answer his door. I hate that I acted that way. It just made me furious that he would dare to totally ignore me that way. I told him the next morning that 26 years, mother of his child, what he has done to me and our child, and being days away from a final divorce....all of that apparently isn't enough to make him pick up the stupid phone and see what I needed. I told him that is ok though, apparently that is how it is going to be and I just have to accept that he is that kind of man.

I met with my attorney on Monday...did I tell this already? Sorry if I'm repeating...he is ready to go to court. He thinks I've got an excellent case for good alimony although it is a gamble because the judge has such discretion.

I'm nervous. I spent Wednesday night, all day yesterday cleaning, sorting organizing like a mad woman. Having a family dinner here tomorrow, so that will keep me busy.

I feel like negotiations will go on all the way up to the VERY last minute before court. I hate this.

Good luck on Monday. Yep... November 30... my anniversary. Hope it's a GREAT day for you and your case. Hope WH caves so you get the settlement you want and deserve.

The whole weekend and not one word from my attorney about the offer that is supposedly on the table. I'm feeling a little irritated. I have 10 family members and friends coming to court with me at 9:00 a.m. tomorrow.....the majority of which are coming from out of town. A couple of which are taking off work. So it would be nice if we are going to be able to settle to actually KNOW this today at least.

However, my attorney did tell me that we might be settling it up to the last minute with just the 4 of us in a room.

SW,

Let all of his chit go as best you can, he's going to do what he's going to do and it's not your issue any longer unless it pertains to the health and safety of your son. Take care of yourself and trust your lawyer as best you can. You (or your H, whichever) are paying him to know his stuff and get the job done. You have a court date tomorrow, focus on that and the "official" end to this whole mess. Best of luck!

T

bump.
Any update??

Divorced. Went through on Monday....except the judge left open the property portion....wants our attorneys and us to work it out. Kinda think if we could have worked it out we would have already done so.

What it boils down to at this point is XH wants me to sell him our home for a greatly undervalued amount....and I don't want to. The judge did order him to come paint it and help me clean out the garage if we list it so that we can get the best price.

I took ds9 to XH tonight for visitation....went to buy a few groceries...came home and sobbed for 1 1/2. I guess I'm having trouble with him continuing to twist the knife in my gut over property when he is the one who caused this.

Oh, alimony 3 years...not bad, not great, but better than XH offered.

He made a fool of himself in court in front of my friends and family. I had 8 people there..he had none.They said I did great.