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No, she isn't wrong.
But the pastor and OW are VERY wrong. Until he confesses what he's done to the ministry, he is NOT a man of God.
I never had to take the Kobayashi Maru test until now. What do you think of my solution?O'hana means family, and family means nobody gets left behind or forgotten. My Story Recovered!
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My church that tossed me out's music minister had his very own little scandal within the church. They sent the message to him that the adulterer is welcomed by treating my XW like the victim. He goes and has an affair with the pastor's SIL (church secretary), leaves his wife, runs off with P's SIL, starts work at aonther church, gets discovered for the adulterer he is and gets fired. He then can't find work, she leaves him, he becomes destitute, moves back and robs the bank beside my former church. It's just too fantastic! http://www.walb.com/Global/story.asp?S=11307508
I watch, and am as a sparrow alone upon the house top.
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Your friend needs to expose their A to the entire congregation. An A is an addiction and usually unless the A partners are exposed they take the A underground and continue seeing each other. Your friend and her H CANNOT rebuild their M unless the pastor separates himself from his OW. Tell your friend to not fall to the lies and deceitfulness of a cheater. Cheaters become skillful at hiding and lying. My DH and I have rebuilding our M for 17 months and this is the hardest thing I have ever done. The pastor needs to understand how radical honesty is the most important thing in rebuilding.
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This whole story is why I have no trust in most organized religion. When leaders and parishoners start having affairs, how can ANYONE in the church have any respect for either of them? Sorry, but BOTH have to leave the church. FOREVER. It's a consequence of their actions, not a punishment.
Me:BW, FWH 1DD 1DS
Status: Chronicled in Dr. Suess's "The Zax"
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Of course it's not wrong for both parties to want to save their marriage. But it's wrong for them to think they can do this without his swallowing the medicine that his conduct requires, which includes :
(a) having no future contact whatsoever with the OW, and
(b) admitting to himself that he has DQ'd himself from any ministry position, and resigning accordingly, with no thought of resuming any ministry work anywhere until their marriage is back on-track.
Nothing they can do will work if condition (a) is not met, because the affair will continue to act on his brain adversely as long as they're in each other's presence; and your friend will continue to be piercingly affected by the very presence of her husband & his OW in the same room on a regular basis, as he apparently envisions. (Not to mention that he'll be carrying on his ministry with a huge blackmail threat hanging over his head!)
As for (b), the guy has failed Biblical standards. Those standards don't shift just because he keeps his wrongdoing a secret from other humans. Evidently, he's also lied to other congregation members (the "leaders" you mentioned a few days ago) re: the OW's identify; just how many lies does he think he can pile atop one another? And how can your friend believe that this kind of pile is a stable basis for recovering her marriage?
If your friend says she "wants" to recover her marriage, but tells you she's willing to let (a) and (b) slide, then your job as a friend is to tell her to please pull her head out of her bum, and that she has no idea what it will take to save this marriage. (Sorry, but this is a time for bluntness.)
RECOVERY does NOT mean trying to sweep it under the carpet & trying to pretend it never happened & continuing to project lies to members of his congregation. It means confronting what he became, confronting his selfishness, and assessing his & his wife's needs & changing the way he lives, so as to meet them. If he swallows his pride and works on this, his marriage can be saved. If he is too prideful to quit his ministry & focus on his marriage, he WILL lose them both, and your friend will be more grievously hurt in the months & years ahead.
Trust me on this, 'cuz I've lived more of it than I care to remember. Send your friend to this forum if you want her to get good advice. There are plenty of folks here who (unlike me) can speak directly to the betrayed spouse's point of view, and may be able to help get her seeing straight.
Me: FWH, 50
My BW: Trust_Will_Come, 52, tall, beautiful & heart of gold
DD23, DS19
EA-then-PA Oct'08-Jan'09
Broke it off & confessed to BW (after OW's H found out) Jan.7 2009
Married 25 years & counting.
Grateful for forgiveness. Working to be a better husband.
"I wear the chain I forged in life... I made it link by link, and yard by yard" ~Jacob Marley's ghost, A Christmas Carol
"Do it again & you're out on your [bum]." ~My BW, Jan.7 2009
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Why not suggest your friend come here? This is an anonymous message board and no one would know her identity.
Widowed 11/10/12 after 35 years of marriage
*********************
“In a sense now, I am homeless. For the home, the place of refuge, solitude, love-where my husband lived-no longer exists.” Joyce Carolyn Oates, A Widow's Story
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If he is too prideful to quit his ministry & focus on his marriage, he WILL lose them both, and your friend will be more grievously hurt in the months & years ahead. Amen! These kinds of things have a way of coming to light. God does have a way of revealing things yanno.
Widowed 11/10/12 after 35 years of marriage
*********************
“In a sense now, I am homeless. For the home, the place of refuge, solitude, love-where my husband lived-no longer exists.” Joyce Carolyn Oates, A Widow's Story
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Trust me on this, 'cuz I've lived more of it than I care to remember. A lyric from Tribal Ink comes to mind: I'm a liar, a denier
Believe me
Liar, liar
I can't hide it, don't divide it
Believe me - I'm a liar
Liar, liar, pants on fire
And I wont stop till I retire
Liar, they call me a liar
I wont stop till I retire
Liar, liar
(Believe me - Im a liar)
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Therefore confess your sins to each other and pray for each other so that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous man is powerful and effective. James 5:16 (NIV) The righteousness of the second sentence comes from the confession of the first sentence. David tried to cover his sin. It cost him a child. It cost him another son who led a rebellion against him. It nearly cost him the kingdom that really belonged to God all along. It eventually cost the entire nation and led to its division. The cost of sin is real. The cost of failing to admit that sin can be everything. Mark
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Mark, I am so glad you are here. You are so right on all of the time. I am so impressed by your faith and wisdom. I will always refer back to it.
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Ephesians 4 (NIV)17So I tell you this, and insist on it in the Lord, that you must no longer live as the Gentiles do, in the futility of their thinking. 18They are darkened in their understanding and separated from the life of God because of the ignorance that is in them due to the hardening of their hearts. 19Having lost all sensitivity, they have given themselves over to sensuality so as to indulge in every kind of impurity, with a continual lust for more.
20You, however, did not come to know Christ that way. 21Surely you heard of him and were taught in him in accordance with the truth that is in Jesus. 22You were taught, with regard to your former way of life, to put off your old self, which is being corrupted by its deceitful desires; 23to be made new in the attitude of your minds; 24and to put on the new self, created to be like God in true righteousness and holiness.
25Therefore each of you must put off falsehood and speak truthfully to his neighbor, for we are all members of one body.
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Ephesians 5(NIV)8For you were once darkness, but now you are light in the Lord. Live as children of light 9(for the fruit of the light consists in all goodness, righteousness and truth) 10and find out what pleases the Lord. 11Have nothing to do with the fruitless deeds of darkness, but rather expose them. 12For it is shameful even to mention what the disobedient do in secret. 13But everything exposed by the light becomes visible, 14for it is light that makes everything visible. This is why it is said:
"Wake up, O sleeper,
rise from the dead,
and Christ will shine on you."
15Be very careful, then, how you live�not as unwise but as wise, 16making the most of every opportunity, because the days are evil. 17Therefore do not be foolish, but understand what the Lord's will is.
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James 1 (NIV) 13When tempted, no one should say, "God is tempting me." For God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does he tempt anyone; 14but each one is tempted when, by his own evil desire, he is dragged away and enticed. 15Then, after desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, gives birth to death.
16Don't be deceived, my dear brothers. 17Every good and perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the heavenly lights, who does not change like shifting shadows. 18He chose to give us birth through the word of truth, that we might be a kind of firstfruits of all he created.
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And David was a man after God's own heart.
Waywards always win.
I watch, and am as a sparrow alone upon the house top.
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Yes he was a man after God's own heart but do you know why?
Widowed 11/10/12 after 35 years of marriage
*********************
“In a sense now, I am homeless. For the home, the place of refuge, solitude, love-where my husband lived-no longer exists.” Joyce Carolyn Oates, A Widow's Story
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Titus 1:6 (New International Version)
An elder must be blameless, the husband of but one wife, a man whose children believe and are not open to the charge of being wild and disobedient.
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Pariah, They might seem to be winning, but the race will be determined by this: Revelation 20 (NIV) 11Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it. Earth and sky fled from his presence, and there was no place for them. 12And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Another book was opened, which is the book of life. The dead were judged according to what they had done as recorded in the books. 13The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what he had done. This is when the winners and losers will be determined... Woe to the losers on that day.
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Yes he was a man after God's own heart but do you know why? Psalm 51 (NIV) 1 Have mercy on me, O God,
according to your unfailing love;
according to your great compassion
blot out my transgressions.
2 Wash away all my iniquity
and cleanse me from my sin.
3 For I know my transgressions,
and my sin is always before me.
4 Against you, you only, have I sinned
and done what is evil in your sight,
so that you are proved right when you speak
and justified when you judge.
5 Surely I was sinful at birth,
sinful from the time my mother conceived me.
6 Surely you desire truth in the inner parts;
you teach me wisdom in the inmost place.
7 Cleanse me with hyssop, and I will be clean;
wash me, and I will be whiter than snow.
8 Let me hear joy and gladness;
let the bones you have crushed rejoice.
9 Hide your face from my sins
and blot out all my iniquity.
10 Create in me a pure heart, O God,
and renew a steadfast spirit within me.
11 Do not cast me from your presence
or take your Holy Spirit from me.
12 Restore to me the joy of your salvation
and grant me a willing spirit, to sustain me.
13 Then I will teach transgressors your ways,
and sinners will turn back to you.
14 Save me from bloodguilt, O God,
the God who saves me,
and my tongue will sing of your righteousness.
15 O Lord, open my lips,
and my mouth will declare your praise.
16 You do not delight in sacrifice, or I would bring it;
you do not take pleasure in burnt offerings.
17 The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit;
a broken and contrite heart,
O God, you will not despise.
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a broken and contrite heart Exactly.
Widowed 11/10/12 after 35 years of marriage
*********************
“In a sense now, I am homeless. For the home, the place of refuge, solitude, love-where my husband lived-no longer exists.” Joyce Carolyn Oates, A Widow's Story
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Pariah, They might seem to be winning, but the race will be determined by this: Revelation 20 (NIV) 11Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it. Earth and sky fled from his presence, and there was no place for them. 12And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Another book was opened, which is the book of life. The dead were judged according to what they had done as recorded in the books. 13The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what he had done. This is when the winners and losers will be determined... Woe to the losers on that day. You failed to account the pre-forgiven clause, the one waywards bank on and are lavishly rewarded by.
I watch, and am as a sparrow alone upon the house top.
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