I said: "There was a time when none of us looked forward to him coming home, so we told him."

What would you suggest? Keep it secret? Run and hide? I'd rather teach my kids to speak up for themselves, and adjust their schedules for cleaning up to promote harmony in the home. It's an easy enough thing to do, don't you think?

Well, What you said was "WE told him."

So what I was wondering was whether YOU told him, FOR your kids?

Or did your child, with no suggestion from you, step forward to his/her father and say "I don't like you coming home" or "I'm afraid when you come home"?

I was asking for clarification about what exactly transpired.

I told him I didn't look forward to him coming home because it always meant a 'taking inventory' on his part, and I was left feeling like I didn't measure up.

The kids have told him things like, Dinner is more fun when you're not here, Daddy if you have to work, why don't you just go back to work so we can play, among other things. It's not just a one-time, sit-down and discuss thing, cat. It's lots of comments, over years. Lots of actions as well, like scarcity.

Like I said, he's better about it now, and me and the kids are better about making it nice for him to come in. There's work on all parts that has to be done to make it good.

The only people who bring problems home from work are those who have problems at work.

They need to realize where their problems lie, and not get them mixed up, before they can fix them.

Whenever I was not having my children rush to meet me, I knew I must be doing something wrong, so I went and hugged them. Unfortunately, I used to travel all week, and get home really late sometimes on Fridays. I decided to stop doing that, to work longer days and take Friday off. The clients who weren't fine with that, I had to fire.

That's why I asked, cwmi. Your explanation is a big difference from the confrontation that it sounded like at first. I was just curious.

You fire your clients? lol

You never heard of firing clients? Those are the ones you tell to straighten up, how to straighten up, and then you send them notice if they fail.

Some I just lay off. I finish the project, but never take any more work for them.

The only way a consultant or attorney can improve himself and his income is to improve his class of clientele. That means grading them and dropping the lower 10% every year. Avoid taking any more like them. As I got older and crankier, I realized it was not just money, either. I had to get rid of the ones who tried to treat me like an low-grade, high-paid employee, by interfering with my family and married life. Kaboom! Gone.

If you can ever get to a certain level, you will earn all you need in about three or four months a year. So if times get tough, you don't take the stuff you swore off; you work on your house, go fishing, spend time with the family.

Cool.

What things do you notice about h when he gets home from work??

First beats on door, let me in, I'm home! Open door and then go outside with him. He likes to smoke a cigarrete or two and let the dog out to roll on the ground. Ready to dump on me everything about his day. I listen intently and add in supportive & positive comments. He's covered in filth and stinks to high heaven from working in factory. BUT lets hug and kiss because I missed you. Ok so I do. Time spent - usually 20 minutes. Comes in follows me where ever I go and see what I am up to. Then goes sits in his chair in livingroom pulls off dirty boots, lets them lay where ever they landed, massages dirty feet for around 12 minutes. If I'm not handy, read near by to chat with, he goes to read internet news until supper. Or if I haven't started supper he begins to look forlornly like he's going to starve to death any minute. If I ask him what he's interested in he can never decide, so answer is alwasy I don't know. He just wants to be fed a hot sit down dinner. Then it's more tv or internet and then off to bed in the same dirty clothes. Now that he works nights we still do the outside debriefing, he then comes in to massage feet for 2 minutes, pee break, and then straight to bed, dirty clothes and all. Also if I try to tell him anything about my day, when he follows me to see what I'm doing, it must always be good stuff otherwise he thinks he must fix whatever was stressing me, even if his way of fixing things makes it worse. So I just smile usually and don't say much about my day.


What things would you like to see when h gets home from work??

I don't mind the debriefing it helps him unload his day. I would like to be able to share all about my day as well. Then I would like him to get a BATHH!!!! One with SOAP!! Because I did ask him to but he thought spit water is fine. I wouldn't mind if he would actually spend a little time with the kids.

Sorry, but this is on you. This is you being the 'dutiful' wife and thinking you don't have the right to be as happy as him because he pays the bills.

This is you having to say you are not happy, dealing with his stress over it, and NOT GIVING UP because of it, and then showing him what would make you ecstatic when he comes home - all of which are common decency in a home - shower, no dirty clothes in the bed, and ATTENTION.

In my house, when I share that I'm not happy, H immediately accuses me of:
1) picking the wrong time or way to announce this (i.e., nice way to mess up the morning, ruin a good afternoon, etc.).
2) he doesn't want to listen to it because he says I don't listen to him. That I have a need to just 'spew' until everything is off my chest and then I'm done.
3) at the same time, he claims he is done talking to me about matters of his heart because all I do is store it up and use it to throw in his face later at some point.
4) according to him, I'm all about me, I will push and push and push to get my way no matter what, I never listen to him.
5) Wow, I am a total b*tch. And though he has some points in there--I won't argue---I have tried to address them. The minute I mess up though, we are back to how I never listen.

This is what I've told him over the months/years.

I'm not happy
I'm afraid
I'm lonely
I am wracked with guilt
I feel like a failure
I am worried
I am stressed
I am depressed

But then it's all about me and he hates that.

oops, was this supposed to be about when he comes home from work? Well, that rarely happens in our house so I had to write about something else.

Agreed! I have pushed the issue since D-day. I wakened up to that and realized I need to set a boundary and told him that he needed to take a bath that it was important to me. For a short bit he took a shower eventually before bed without my asking and then it progressed with my asking again and his whining and complaining that I don't care about him because he's to tired to take one. And now I backed off again to what would happen, sure enough back to staying dirty. Currently his last bath was 2 1/2 weeks ago. He works in a corn processing plant as a welder, so I guess you can get an idea of how dirty he really is after this many day. And he hasn't shaved in close to 3 weeks. I was shaving him close to the end, I asked him if I could and didn't mind doing so neither did he. But after D-day and a few shaves I decided he should go back to doing it himself. Hasn't shaved and is way dirty. I still cut his hair, as I do with all my family - saves money. This morning he came in after our breakfast date, in public lol - why they didn't throw us out him being so stinky and filthy and in the same clothes as from 3 days ago, anyways he comes into the house I tell him the sheets have been washed and he needs to help me keep it clean, take a bath. So, still no bath but not in bed either. Asleep in his chair, the dirty chair as I call it. Both the chair and couch are this way from his rubbing of filth. When he's not at home I throw a clean sheet on it. Curently been wearing the same underwear as last week and hasn't brushed his teeth once since we've been together. He can sleep in his chair, he looks so uncomfortable. But I;m tired of feeling like I'm sleeping in a garbage can. Oh I did show him how thrilled I was when he took a bath, lots of sloppy pvf (positive reinforcement)... but still dirty.

1) I get this reaction alot
2) he doesn't want to listen to it because i'm just b*tching
3) I get, that he can't share something with me because I will have a negative reaction
4)I get number 4 too
And number 5 he told the counselor that I b*tch and am demanding and always complaining and so controlling, overbearing, and no respect for his need of space

sigh, I understand

OurHouse,
I'll bet every man has thought and said every one of those things, 1 through 5, to his wife. I know I have.

If they are true a lot of the times, it makes it easy for the husband to use it as an excuse the rest of the time.

I think a lot of women DO bring up things the wrong way.

1. There is a right time and place to bring up complaints.
NOT in public.
NOT in front of the children.
NOT first thing in the morning.
NOT just before going to bed.

NOT when the husband is unable to do anything about it.
It is frustrating to be told by your wife that she is really upset that so-and-so is not done, when it was something he would have been glad to do earlier, like paint the front door - during the day, not at 9:00 PM.

Regarding complaints/comments about the relationship(which in a healthy marriage are supposed to be generally a good thing?)

When is the right time when he says:

1. First thing AM/last thing PM...bad
2. During the day....bad
3. By phone or email....bad
4. In front of the kids (this is a given--no argument here)
5. In public (see above)

I'm sorry, Alice, but this is STILL on you. Telling your H what bothers is great, if he cares if you're happy and is willing to MAKE you happy.

But you have trained this cretin that what he wants, comes first.

Time to set boundaries, and ENFORCE THEM!

You don't shower, you sleep on the couch.

You don't shower for TWO WEEKS, you sleep OUTSIDE ON THE PORCH!

Good god, woman!

You have the RIGHT to set rules of common decency in your house.

If you're too weak to do it on your own, GET HELP!

No, you DON'T understand. He manipulates you by using those things he knows pull your strings. You are smarter than that. Stop letting your 'femaleness' get in the way of what is right.

Personally, if my H didn't shower in ONE week, he would be living in the garage.

OH, you know you can't use these types of plans on your H.

I have never understood how anyone gets their spouse to sleep somewhere else. Even if they "deserve" it.

How do you "make" someone leave the bed? Let alone the house...

Alice, I think you need to jump off the fence you're on. Jump far and run. The man cheats with prostitutes and won't bathe?

What would you tell me to do?