It's only two weeks now since I found out about my H's adultery. I know many of you have been doing this for so much longer. I'm really thinking he thinks he can have it both ways, a double life. Is it too early for an ultimatum? I was so afraid to leave at first because I don't want to hurt my little boys if I don't have to. But every day that goes by is more torcherous and I'm getting much stronger (maybe I should madder) and far less afraid to leave. He can't exactly just move in with her cause she's married too. I don't even know who she is! How can I find out. There's nothing on the phone bill, his e-mail, nothing. This is all going on at work. I'd hate to think I have to drag my children with me and sit in the parking lot watching for them!! This is crazy.

well you should get a lot of response...<BR>different things have worked for different people...kat hung in there for about 6 months i think and her H turned around...<BR>i hung in for almost a year and mine didn't so we just seperated. now he's making noises about breaking up with her.<BR>the work thing is so hard. you need somebody on the inside i guess.<BR>there is not 'one' answer on how long to try or wait.<BR>good luck<P>------------------<BR>Kellie<BR>Sometimes Love Just Ain't Enough<P>

Hurt Bad,<P>Tough question. I'm approaching a year that my life has been totally turned upside down. I spent two months wallowing in self pity, clinging, smothering, all the wrong things after my wife told me she didn't love me, and the miriad of other hurtful things. Then I found out she was invlved with another man. Cruched me beyond belief. <P>I finally implemented a plan A in the face of severe rejection. I kept at eventhough she was seeing the OM. That went on for 5 months. I finally couldn't take it anymore and confronted her about everything. She confessed and promissed to stop seeing OM. She did for about 3 months. She started contact again to be "just friends" - yeah right. So, here I am.<P>We are doing better overall. Our marriage was in such a shambles that it didn't take much to make it better. So, I keep trying, and trying, and trying. <P>Don't give up, it's very early for you. In fact you seem to be handling it pretty well. <BR>Give lots of Plan A to try and pull him back to the marriage. It just takes a very long time.<P>Best wishes,<P>SHA

Hi sir hurts alot-<P>I don't know how to even start plan A because my H's adultery is already known, but he won't stop seeing OW, who he works with. I want to meet his needs, but he won't let me. The strange thing is it has made me love him more. The only way I can explain it is that he betrayed me, so my feelings are still there even tho his aren't. Now I'm in the worst pain of my life and need to be comforted by the person I love, even tho he's also the source of my pain. I just long for him to hold me and make everything alright.<P>A few days ago, the credit card bill came in with his hotel night and gifts he bought the OW on it. I'm so destroyed and have no self-worth anymore. No-I'm really not handling it well. I don't want him to get comfortable thinking he can have us both. But when I start crying (which is something almost uncontrollable), it makes it worse with him. I'm in a horrible cycle. He says he wants me to just be myself - only she's out there waiting. I know she still sees him and contacts him because we've had some really good days with intimacy and affection, but then he comes home from work and won't even look at me. She destroys any progress we make here at home.<P>How are you doing plan A. I've read it and can't figure out how it applies to me. My H won't separate from the OW. Can anyone tell me how to approach plan A, if H is still seeing and working with OW and she kills any feelings he may show to me?<P>

Dear Hurtingbad:<BR>Read my post, "What I did to the ow". It sounds like the exact situation that I was in that you are in now. My answer to your question lies in my post of how long... Just a note about that, not even a minute should you stand or allow that disrespect to you to go on. Every situation is different. Everyone is different. For what I had done, it was right for me. It was something that I personally had to do to save my marriage. We also have 2 small children and I did not want to leave because of them, yet, I was not going to stand by and have it go on. There's my two cents worth of what I really feel about the situation. You deserve better than that. You do not deserve to be cheated on and to have to accept that. If I was you , I would have to put a stop to that, especially since you have children. I am curious what you will do. Keep me posted.

I understand your situation a little. After my wife told me of her affair she moved to a separate room within the house. She sees the OM all the time first thing in the morning if she sleeps here, last thing in the morning if she sleeps there. Yes it is very difficult to deal with a spouse who gives you nothing and gives all to the OM. <P>While your spouse is in the house it is still better to continue plan A despite the pain he will inflict on you. The way I have been able to rationalise my W actions and words that are the most painful is to understand that she is not trying to hurt me, but does not know what she is doing. <P>You should also ask yourself what changes you should make of you, how you can meet his needs that the OW is not meeting. While the two of you are in the same house it is easier for him to see that changes in you. <P>Plan A is suggested for 6 months for exactly the situation you describe. If after that time you see no significant change and can't go on with plan A, it may be the time to think about moving out with the kids and implementing plan B. Be aware that while he is home it will be very draining on your lovebank.<P>------------------<BR>It's always darkest before the dawn

Hi, I don't think there is a time limit on how long we should wait for them to leave the other person, other than how confortable or willing to wait we are.<BR>As Kell said, I waited for about 4 months, time where he claims it ended, but then about 2 more months untill it was really over. <BR>It seems like a lot of time, but that was my decision and my goal. AS long as he was kiving at home, and I was seeing any signs of progress no matter how small, I continued what is now called plan A ( although I didn't know about it at the time ).<P>My H also worked with his ow, and they saw each other daily for the first 4 monthts. aFter that he had a chance to change schedules so they weren't seeing each other everyday, but would still see each other occasionally , or when there were meetings.<P>My H's affair was found out the week it started and he was convinced he wanted to leave. However, today our marriage is doing great and I've been able to regain the lost trust in my H. We're both working together to keep our marriage strong and it has been working quite well for over a year.<P>Reading your second post reminded me so much of my ow situation. A lot of the things you wrote applied to me at that time. If you want to e-mail me, (lwnd@hotmail.com) do so. I can tell you more about what happened and how I dealt with it.<P>Do take care<BR>Kat<P>------------------<BR>Each and everyone of us is deserving of a kind word, a gentle thought, and the gift of understanding.

Why are you waiting for him? Its your life, you decide what you want to do with it. He did not consult you on what he was going to do. <BR>HB, if you want to put up with him walking all over you while he decides then just be patient and wait him out. There are plenty of people that wait the rest of their lives. <BR>If you don't, Jettison him like a used rocket pod and get on with you own life. I did that and she came running like it was a white sale. <BR>I cannot understand for the life of me why people let people that are careless with their feelings continue to be careless with their feelings.

because fighter, it's just not that easy...<BR>kat did plan A and it worked for her...<BR>you did plan B and it worked for you....<BR>i have done A and am now doing B and neither has really worked. he still waffles. i have 3 children, a home and a 16 year history with this man. that doesn't 'end' or 'change' overnight.<BR>i'm glad you were able to take control of your situation and that it resolved for you fairly quickly after plan B. some of us are not so lucky. and we don't need more 'anger' from you.<P>------------------<BR>Kellie<BR>Sometimes Love Just Ain't Enough<P>

Dear Kelsill:<BR>I really don't understand why you got angry at fighter? Was he not speaking the truth? Seriously, I really don't understand how that can be o.k., for a husband to treat his wife like that, cheat on her with another woman and feel that it's alright. What in the world is so right about that? No wonder her self-esteem is shot. I know what you said, in terms of it's not easy. Who ever said it was. But it's surely not easy either to sit there day after day and know this is going on, him spending his money on hotel rooms, gifts, on the ow. Why should she or anyone else take that sort of abuse? Whether she was married to him 1 month or 16 years. I would think the thing to do would be to approach him/confront him and put a stop to it if she is hurt by this. I'm not being arrogant. I just really don't understand where you are coming from. Maybe you can explain to me why she should hang around and not do anything but read a book. By her allowing him to treat her this way, she is allowing him to disrespect her. She is giving him permission to go on his merry way doing whatever he wants to do and to treat her any way he wants because she is giving him permission to. That is not a marriage. A marriage is working together to become a stronger union. How is she suppose to strengthen her marriage when he doesn't even know she knows? I really don't think fighter meant anything more than him being honest about the way he feels. Isn't that what we need to do? Regardless, I just want to understand your logic in this. I'm not being sarcastic, but, instead being sincere, because maybe I am missing something here.

I will say it again, since no one seems to get it yet! Adultery is WRONG! Plain and simple. Do NOT allow him to have his cake and eat it too. Tell him he has to choose, either give up OW and recommit to you or get out! I am sorry but this is so ridiculous! It is paramount to saying to a child...well it is ok, when you are ready to stop playing in the street, I will be there for you! NO! NO! NO! Give him an ultimatum otherwise he will use you adn stomp all over your feelings until you have somthing left. Have some self-respect!! It really seems to be lacking around here lately!<P>------------------<BR>Rachel :)<P>

Dear Camarinick:<BR>That is exactly what I am saying. I just don't understand where some members are coming from...I thought it was just me. This is why I wanted it explained to me. But now I know I'm not insane for thinking like you and fighter.

I agree Kelstill-<P>It's not that easy. I have children. Maybe it's easy for a man to jettison his wife. He usually doesn't end up with the kids, the dogs, having to get a new job after not working untold number of years, and possibly living in a much lesser lifestyle (more concern here for my kids than me). Not that I want my H for material things. This has only been 3 weeks for me. I'm still so much in shock and can't just turn love off from the man. That may happen, I don't know. I made vows that even tho he didn't mind breaking, I DO. If there is a chance, I want to give it one. I have already seen a lot of progress, so it's hard to turn my back on it. Sometimes your marriage can back stronger than ever from a crisis (even tho he CAUSED it). Sometimes not, but marriage is sacred and should be given a 2nd chance. To jettison him without trying would be just as selfish as what he did, and I'm not in this for revenge. I'm in this to understand where we went wrong and how to fix it, because in my life I don't think I can ever love someone as much as my H. I'm a forgiving person. I will not do this forever, but I will always give anyone a 2nd chance.

Dear Hurtingbad:<BR>yes, I agree with you fully in terms of trying to make it, but, by doing absolutely nothing and letting him keep on cheating is absurd. He really does need to be confronted. I do believe that a marriage should be given another chance as long as both sides are contributing. I have been in mylousy marriage for 5 years, 2 of which we have not had sex or intimacy or affection. So, I keep asking myself, how long do I stay. I stayed so far, just like you said for you, because of my children. My children do come first. But, regardless, one cannot just hide from the facts of infidelity or sweep it under the rug. Every situation is different, of course. It is a very shocking and scarey thing to have something like that such as infidelity hit you in the face. I got that reality a month ago. I still continue to work on the marriage as long as he is willing to. But, I also know that I will not stay, don't know how long, if he does not keep trying. A marriage is a union of one.

Hurt Bad<P>You sound better already. The only difference between your story and mine is we have cats and no dogs. <P>Really everyone's situation involves different personalities and problems, and we must deal with them as best we can.<P>In my case I have only just got a handle on what our marital problems are. Unfortunately we never had joint counseling to try and fix things. I insisted on using a mediator in the divorce who was also a therapist. He has been very helpful. <P>Moving on with a divorce or reconcilliation is extremely hard without figuring out what went wrong. We have never discussed her side of the problems only the symptoms of my part. If I am right in my analysis, I will be satisfied that I at least won't make the same mistakes again with her or without her.<P>Keep on doing what you feel is right for you and the kids and try not to lovebust.

Here is my story in a nutshell. I am living proof that it CAN be done. My H told me out of the blue after 6 years of marriage that he had been seeing someone from work for 2 weeks and wanted to move in with her. I asked him to work on our marriage. He put relationship with OW on hold for a month. During that time we talked, cried, laughed, yelled, the whole gamut. After a month he made the decision to leave me and move in with OW. He left me and our 3 children (ages 5 1/2, 3 1/2 and almost 1 year) On June 6th, 1999. 2 weeks after he moved out, I filed for divorce and our final hearing is on Nov 3rd. It was a very hard decision to not wait indefinitely for him to come around. But I was not willing to sacrifice my own healing and happiness or the stability and emotional health of our children "in case" he chose to come back to me. I will never know what could have happened, but what he has put me through pretty much destroyed our marriage. I am not "happy" yet, but I am content in my life and I have started to forgive him. We have joint custody of the children(he has them every weekend) and we get along and communicate well. I am happy for that at least. My point in telling you all this is that it is one thing to have the betrayer put the OP on hold while you try to work things out. It is quite another thing for him to continue the affair while one of you is trying to work on the marriage. That is why he needs the ultimatum. Don't expect an immediate answer. Give him 4 to 8 weeks to decide(whatever you are comfortable with). During that time, he has to commit to puttin the relationship with OP on hold. If he can't agree to do that, then he should move out right away. He at least owes you some time to make a rational decision. If he chooses not to put OP on hold and has no whereto go, oh well! That is his choice, his problem now! It is no wonder so many betrayers end up with their mothers! This is my suggestion. Any concerns or questions, feel free to email me at rew72@hotmail.com<BR>Good Luck! <P>------------------<BR>Rachel :)<P>

Hi Kel, It was not easy for me either. Any of us that are so in love with our spouses and work towards remaining that way are shocked by what they have done. I did not fall out of love, she did and she kept decieving me that she was still in love with me. <BR>Steping back from it, I saw her continueing ballistic attacks of lovebusting as the final answer. I did not have MB at the time and there was no one to talk to about this. I had to decide whether I was going to let her continue this abuse of me or if I was going to end it. I have four children that I love just as much as anyone. So much so that I stayed in the marriage and tried to work on it many times when I had run out of patience with her. The kids kept me there. Namely my doughter who showed tremendous compassion towards me and did a lot to counter the mental cruelty of my W. The thought of the OM being any kind of father figure to them is unconsionable. So I filed to set her free not me. I'm staying put because of the kids and there will have to be a long court battle to get me out. <BR>My anger is not towards any of you, only at the thought that we have to put up with this kind of behavior from our spouse. You can be on either plan and not take it. Not letting them walk all over you is not lovebusting.<BR>HB, I love my wife no matter what she does. It was the most difficult thing in the world to do what I felt was my only option. I also had to preserve myself for the sake of the children. What good am I to them if shes driving me nuts. With her having to face reality, I put a stop to her and I could do my duty as a parent. This way I could be at home with them while she went running off to meet him.<BR>Thanks Katya and Cam for your more patient explanation

Thanks all,<P>My H told me from the first day he told her that his life was on hold. So he did do that. However, she continues to contact him and it keeps putting us back to square one. It's hard because we are still very intimate at times, but you're right, it's more like only I'm working on the marriage and he's trying to decide whether or not to ruin my life and his kids. I don't understand the heart of a man that does this. It's like he's not the same decent person I knew. He's changed. I'm still a little confused on what to do I guess. I imagine I'll start getting real fed up in not too much time and I think my whole attitude and outlook with change, but for now I'm just hurt, lovesick and broken, and I want him back.<P>Thanks for all your thoughts everyone. God bless.

Then you're going to have to wait him out. Sooner or later he will tire of being torn between the two of you and will decide. From what you have told us, it looks like it will be you. In the meantime, try to get him into counselling with you and plan family weekends away. Picnics, etc so that he is unavailable for her. A gentle pull as opposed to a push if he is in the home.<BR>Take care

As you have read here...It is different for each person and each couple. I do not believe that there is a certain amount of time for each situation that every person or couple has to abide by. What I do believe is that many of the people here have posted a large amount of patience and "Hanging In There" to try and save and rebuild. kat, KelStill, SirHurtsAlot and Katya are examples of different situations that each person did "Their Way" From all the posts it seems that the will to "Endure" rather than "Fire, Ready, Aim" adds a much higher chance of success for rebuilding if both partners want to invest in that effort.<P>What does everyone else thing?<P>mr rlk