Thought I'd start a thread on my Plan B experience. It took alot to hand her the letter although afterward I really felt quite empowered. Haven't felt taht for a while. Feels good.

I entered into Plan B on 16 Nov and handed WW the letter Sunday afternoon. In a nutshell I wrote that I still love her but can't accept her being with or contacting OM (she claims she hasn't seen him for a couple of weeks but they still talk and txt). Said no contact with me until no contact with OM. Much more to it than that but you get the picture.

She begins txting that eve to make changes in kids visit. Did not respond.

I received a couple of calls on Monday. Typically boys are with me Monday and Wed after I come home from work and she picks them up at my place that evening. Now she wants me to drop them off. In response to the calls I sent a txt saying that if she chooses not to pick the kids up then I'll drop them off the next morning. She says OK. I have no problem with this because I love spending time with my boys and previously when she picked them up there was barely enough time to have dinner and get homework done before she arrived. Now we can watch a movie or play games until bed time. The kids love it to. I know that it also gives her the opportunity to have OM over but the way i look at it, the more time they spend with each other now the quicker they'll come undone.

On Tuesday she tried to call twice but I didn't answer. Had kind of a bittersweet feeling because on the one hand I don't want to hear from her but on the other I was feeling down and when she called it was like OK she's reacting and it made me feel better. I felt even better not answering. Must be that empowerment thing again.

I also shared the Plan B letter with DS18. His response kind of shocked me. He said "it's about time dad". Since our separation last fall his relationship with his mom has really taken a turn for the worst. WW kept blaming me cause she felt i shared to much with him. She doesn't get that S18 is 18 years old and can observe what's going on with her behavior. i don't have to say a thing to him. Kills me how WSs think their invisible.

Wed am WS send me a txt saying Good morning, how are you feeling? Huh? It kinda made me feel good but again I felt better after not answering. Last night WS again tried to call before she dropped the kids off. I didn't respond so she sent me a txt saying she needed to talk to me about the kids. I txt back asking if there was an emergency. She txt back asking what time i was going to drop them off. I txt back saying she needed to reread my PB letter. She txt back saying OK. She just isn't getting it. I also read the PB letter to DS7 & DS9 last night. DS9 said, "Oh that's the letter I saw on your computer." I apprently left it open at some point when I was drafting it and he read it. I'm so relieved that I chose to read it to them. If I hadn't S9 would have been holding a secret that would have torn him up inside. After i read it to them I explained what it meant and that the reason i wrote it had nothing to do with them. I said that their mom is very confused right now and chooses not to be with me and we have to accept that for what it is. I also made sure thay understood that we both still and always will ove them no matter how this ends up. I thought that revealing this to them would really hit them hard but surprsing they got it. They understood who the OM was and the relationship he has with their mom. They genuinely seemed relieved that I shared it with them. When i put them to bed they both said "I hope your letter works dad." Broke my heart. Had to go drop a few tears. Their maturity floored me.

Dropped the kids off this AM before I went to work. Got a voicemail from her. She said she needed to talk to me about setting something up for the kids beginning the week after Thanksgiving because she's beginning clinicals and her hours are changing and she needs to drive 30 miles to where the clinicals are being done (she's currently going through nursing school). OK, clearly she's not getting it. I send her a txt saying she needs to read my letter again. No, txt, no calls, no contact. If she wants me back in her life the letter explains how that can be done.

That's pretty much where I'm at right now. I know I've already busted the Plan B rules by txting her back but man. it's like she just doesn't get it. Is this typical of how a WS initially reacts to Plan B?

In any case, even though we have a separation agreement that was worked out through a mediator I have an appointmennt with an atty on Tues 1 Dec. I'm really feeling that although I still hold much hope for recon, because of the PB letter she may be working with an atty herself. No proof of this but just a gut feel. Not that I'd push for D but I need to determine options and if the sep agreement will stand as is if in time we end up going that route.

Is it a good idea to meet with atty at this point? It's just a consult now but if WW hasn't seen one and finds out I have I'm afraid it will push her more towards D than recon. I don't mind that it gets her PO'd thoug. Thoughts on any of this?

L4, I would try a solid Plan B first. That means not reading any of her texts. If you tell her no contact and you continue contact, then she knows you are not serious. Her texts and emails should be completely blocked. Reading them will keep you mired in her bullcrap and you won't get the relief that Plan B offers. No communication should come through that is not screened by your intermediary.

You might want to consult an attorney and get a visitation schedule and get your finances settled. Have you separated your finances? How is she paying her way?

Have you changed the locks so she can't get in the house?

Hi ML

I know what you mean. In fact she just sent another txt saying we have to maintain contact for the kids. NOT! I ignored and will put her on the block list.

Unfortunately, I moved out when we separated last fall because she made it miserable once I started to get the clues that she was leading a secret life. At the time I felt she was seeing someone but had no proof. She vehimently denied but at the same time always kept her cell with her and made sure I had no access to it.

When we separated it was under the lie that she needed more space and she made it almost intolerable to live with her. Not wanting to disrupt the kids I decided to move out. We signed a sepa agreement to cover my *ss legally. In the state I live in there is no "legal separation" but if a spouse moves out, even though he/she may continue to take care of the finances and maintain a relationship with the kids, you can still get slammed for abandonment. The agreement is not a legal agreement in the true sense in that it is notarized but not filed with the courts.

Oh wow, I would get an attorney pronto. Many courts view this as abandonment, because IT IS. So are you paying all her finances? Has she had the OM in your home?

OMG, are your children being exposed to her OM? Has he been in their home?

Yes they have. It started back in Dec 08. The sad thing is that the OM was a mutual friend we've known for 4 years. The kids knew who he was and, if you ask the WS, they looked at him as just WWs "friend". That's the way she explained it to them. It didn't take long for them to figure it out though. Even without my input. She was so wrapped up in her A that she didn't see nor care how it affected the kids. I was livid when I found out and made it clear that it wasn't acceptable. I threatened to put the house on the market if it continued. Since then it has stopped but I'm not sureif it was because of my threat or because she began to realize the resentment the kids had towards OM and the fact that the kids began acting out when with her and she began to realize the impact it was having on them. In either case OM hasn't been over the house since around March 09. At least when the kids have been there because i ask them all the time.

WW has a part time job and is going through nursing school. I am paying CS and partial mortgage since our sep agreement states that we both own 50% of the home. Other than that our fincances were split and kids college fund remains in both our names. We really saved quite a bit of money and with her half she has plenty to live on for a while.

BTW, I have a tele conference with Jennifer this Sunday eve. Can anyone who has spoken to het give some feedback and what to expect from her?

Great! I hope she can help you, L4. I have not counseled with her but I know many others here have. Hopefully, they will post to you.

Just got a call from S18. Said he received a call from his mom and she asked him to call me about setting something up with the kids so she can take care of clinicals week after Thanksgiving. I said that as far as S7 & S9 are concerned we have that already worked out in the sepa agreement and the PB letter. She needs to take care of that herself and if she works it out with another sitter or daycare I need to know who they'll be with and how to contact them (I'd probably go pick them up after she hassled with making the arrangments anyway). S18 said he'd pass it on.

WW knows who the mediator is. It's not primarily S18 although I did say in the PB letter that he's ok with doing that if the primary can't be reached. So far WW hasn't done anything through the primary. I don't feel right going through S18. Anybody deal with this before

This is difficult. Not only do I feel guilty about S18s involvement but I'm at a loss as to what I should do. If she comes back with an alternate vis schedule because of her clinicals do I agree or stand my ground on the current schedule. I feel like standing my ground is the right choice in regards to her having to put some effort into making arrangements without depending on me but I also feel that S7 & S9 would be affected if I don't step in. I don't want them to think I'm not there for them when their mom isn't. Being the age they are, even though they are aware of the PB letter, I'm not sure trhey'll understand. Help!

L4, I would have your IM contact her and explain that any messages not sent through her will not get through to you. Ask the IM to ask your wife not to send messages through the kids.

The IM can tell her that any text messages or emails will be deleted without reading them. And it will be important for you to back her up on this and not respond to any texts or emails.

That being said, I don't think its a big deal to send innocuous messages through the kids, like being a couple minute late to pick them up or something. In this case, it put your 18 yr old in a position to have to negotiate a tough issue. I agree that is not right. poor kids!

Thanks Mel.

I was actually in the process of doing that and sent an email to IM a few minutes ago. Any advice on whether I should stick to my guns ref the vis schedule or bend a little? Seems she's always trying to change something just to make life more convenient for her.

Feel down in the dumps today. Blocked WWs phone number from my cell. Had a long talk with DS18 last night. I really spewed it all out although he still doesn't know the half of it. He said that WWs family is going to have some sort of intervention while they're up there for Thanksgiving.

Holidays are terrible when you are separated. Last year I spent Thanksgiving with the boys at my sisters home. It was just unbearble not having W with us for the first time in 12 years. Christmas was spent together though and we had a nice time. Took the boys on a ski vacation between Christmas and New Years and had a great time. This year I have the boys for Christmas. Being in Plan B doesn't allow for us to be with WW. Not sure how I'm going to manage but I know whatever happens I'll be alright. Just feel sad for the boys.

Going to speak with IM tonight and give them a copy of the PB letter. Was told that WW called IM about what to do with the kids while WW is in Clinicals week after Thanksgiving. I'll be discussing this with her (IM) tonight. Still not sure if I should stick to my guns with kids visit schedule or bend some. Any suggestions?

This just plain sucks.

Not sure why I'm not getting any feedback. If there's somethinmg I said or did or something in this thread or previous threads that has offended or caused a reason to be ignored I'd sure like to know about it. Isn't honesty what this board is about?

Fridays are often slow on the MB boards. It's not you.

I have deadlines at work, and I would guess many others do too. My boss figures he pays me to work.

However, I can spare a minute while I take a break.

There has been a lot of discussion over the years about your question of sticking to your guns, or bending and helping.

Sometimes you have to let them experience the consequences of their decisions, and make arrangements with no help from you.

However, it's good to keep in mind the golden rule too. If you had something come up, would you get help from her? Would you want help from her? It's a good thing to keep in mind.

Consider both sides, and then make your decision. You'll do well.

SS

I may as well touch on this too..........

Holidays are terrible when you are separated. Last year I spent Thanksgiving with the boys at my sisters home. It was just unbearble not having W with us for the first time in 12 years. Christmas was spent together though and we had a nice time. Took the boys on a ski vacation between Christmas and New Years and had a great time. This year I have the boys for Christmas. Being in Plan B doesn't allow for us to be with WW. Not sure how I'm going to manage but I know whatever happens I'll be alright. Just feel sad for the boys.

What would you do if she had been killed in an accident?
You would grieve, but you would (after a while) pull yourself together, and you would go on.

You can do that now to some extent. Think of things you always wanted to do. Maybe it's time to do some of them.

We feel for your boys too. This is not fair. No one should have to go through this. It is, however, reality. Life is NOT always fair.
Remember some basic things. Your happiness does not depend on her.

It's the truth.

Relationships can add a great deal to our lives, but you can have a happy life anyway.

If you want to have a happy life, it has to come from inside of you. Not only do you have to find a way to continue, you have to teach your sons how it is done. You have to show them by example.

Think - Lighthouse. You have to be the lighthouse.

Figure out how you are going to do that and work on it during the holidays. It will keep you busy, and I believe you will find that things will look better all around.

Celebrate life. Don't just exist. I assume you have good health, and that you are not destitute. Remember what it is that we celebrate next Thursday. Show your boys the good that exists all around you, and don't dwell on the bad.

I hope this comes across right. I am not trying to tell you to just get over it. Your feelings are important. However, you do need to change direction, and it can only come from inside you.

SS

It is sad for the kids, but (looking at glass half full) I'm sure they'd gladly give up a Holiday or two, for their parents to come back together, recover, and celebrate the many Holiday's to come. This isn't a guarantee, but just another way to aproach things.

As for the schedule situation, MHO is to keep the kids for any and all time you can, hopefully putting you in a better position if custody becomes an issue. Document, document, document. I'd also want to spend as much time with my kiddos as I could...

I definitely see the benefits to leaving the childcare in her hands though, leaving her the responsibility to hopefully bring her out of the fog.

Toughie.

Thanks BR & SS

Haven't yet decided what to do about the schedule sitch. That's exactly what I'm struggling with. Spending more time with the boys or sticking to my guns especially while in Plan B.

Tried to call the boys just a few minutes ago and WW answered the house phone (she usually doesn't) Asked to speak with the boys and she started on the schedule for week after Thanksgiving. She said she needed to talk about it with me. I said you can talk to IM and I called to talk to the boys. She statrted again on the sched. I hung up. Now she's called twice while I'm typing and left a message. Guess I'm going to have to block the house phone also.

Going to speak with IM tonight. Her and her husband are more than willing to act as intermediators but I have to make sure they understand they can't do that half*ssed either.

Thanks again for the feedback.

All the more reason NOT to make it easy on her! Make living apart as hard as possible! It's HER choice to do this! She has the way to fix it all; she chooses not to.

Let HER scramble to cover her schedule.

Tell your IM what schedule YOU are willing to consider, and let IM tell her that. If it doesn't work for her, too bad so sad.

You HAVE to be stronger about this!

And you need to remind the boys exactly what Plan B means, in that they will not become relayers of information.

Thanks cat. I really do appreciate the feed back

Things didn't go well last night with the IM. They're willing to be the drop off and pick up point for the kids but not to intermediate. After I aspoke with them it was clear they didn't really understand their roll when I spoke with them the first time. Need to look for a new one. XIM said that I needed to speak directly with WW in regards to kids. I tried to explain why that's not possible but I don't believe they get it. Any advice on this?

I did end up texting WW (I know, NC,) but I need to get her schedule for clinicals. All I sent was "Send clinical schedule via email. I'll get back to you. After that sep agreement stands as written. Looking for new IM."

Spoke with kids this am. Good conversation.

Promise to myself today: What ever happens I'll be OK.