Fred..

Not having read your thread (6 or 7 pages long on my computer)...was your wife still married to husband number 3 when you met her?

That could explain a lot.

Further, about your picker. Didn't ANYONE in your life advise you that it was a bad idea to marry a 3 time divorced, beer (I presume) drinking, smoking, woman with children she'd lost custody of???? If YOU had son, what would you have told him had he brought her home for dinner? What I'm saying is your "picker" problems likely extend outward to your family, friends and even associates as well (present company excepted...lol)

Mr. W

lol...my point was the opposite. IMO, "MOST" end sooner.

There IS a saying in AA to never get your spouse there because the people are all SICK! I love my AA friends, but I would never marry one. And they would be crazy to marry me.

That was a good point, too. I never considered it. And that happened in my marriage and yours!

No I Plan A'ed after D-day (I'm a 15%'er I suppose).

But your point is still a good one, that many end before Plan A as well as AFTER Plan A.

No, Mr.W. She was already divorced from H#3. In fact, she was in a relationship when I first became aware of her. My morals and ethics dictate that *I* don't fish in someone else's pond. So I never even spoke to her until that relationship was over (and yes, she kicked him out, too!).

I met her in A.A. and first spoke to her on her first anniversary. My misguided perceptions about A.A. (based on my own experience) let me to believe that "broken" people could be healed. I never saw her smoke (until the day she came to "vacate the premises"). But the three divorces and abandoned children should have been . And I chose to ignore them. She helped assuage me that all that was a result of her past drinking...

What I own is not only the ignoring/denial of the but also of the deeply-felt desire to have a loving relationship. I had been alone (and virtually dateless) for eleven years prior to meeting WW. I had one very brief relationship that turned out to be a rebound on HER part, and she dropped me like a hot potato when her wizened BF wanted back in. I try to avoid "pity parties," but I certainly felt rather hopeless about finding love. I guess that made me a prime "target" for a sociopathic woman. And so I chose to overlook the warning signals and dysfunctional upbringing that I knew WW carried as her baggage...

And at my age, a never-married woman is more than one who has been divorced.

Hey Fred....at least you had some fun!!! I have heard people who are mentally unstable are sort of fun to be around part of the time.

Melody do you remember when I first came here you suggested to me my (then) husband was displaying sociopathic tendencies? Sorry to further T/J but that was a shocking thought to me even though I knew his behavior was way off the charts.

I think I told a story about him choking me during s*x....

FWIW, I think you were right about him...

I am sorry SW. I am sure there were fun moments or you would not have stayed with him so long. Even with my crazy sister, there were fun moments. I feel sad I cannot see her now due to her abusive nature.

Before I met WW, my sponsor (49 years sober) once told me he'd never marry a woman in A.A.

His first wife passed away. He remarried to a woman who to this day just believes A.A. is his little "club" that he goes to every week. She really likes his "friends." We sometimes go to parties at their house.

They've been happily married 26 years.

Not really, Mel. He did say what I attribute to him. I just cannot find the April 2008 article.
But,I do believe that 30% is right, as I have seen it cited ion several sites that do not promote their marriage saving services. Andm the therapist I saw, a clinical psychologist with over 30 years in the business, told me that 10-15% survive.

Well, let me know if you ever find it so you can back up your assertion.

Let's ask him. Do you have access?

I just sent him an email.

Merry Christmas Dr. Harley!

I wonder if you could solve a mystery. You have written that only 15% of affairs end in Plan A. A board member recalls reading that you said that "Plan B is successful* even less than plan A":

"As for the stats I site, they come from Harely's writings, as well as other sites. Harely says that 15% is about the max for success from Plan A. He goes on to say that Plan B is successful even less than plan A. I dredged up his articles from which I gleaned this a long time ago. They are on this site.

With this info, it is pretty easy to come up with a less than 30% success rate:15% max for Plan A and, presuming that Plan B increases the chances of divorce >15% for paln B. This >30% chance total."

Additionally, you have stated that most marriages do not end in divorce over infidelity, but most never recover. What is the percentage of marriages that stay together after an affair?

Could you please clarify these issues for us?

Thanks!
MelodyLane

*successful in this instance is being defined as reconciliation and not in the true sense of Plan B which is to protect the BS

True. We had some good times. He really didn't go off the deep end with the totally amoral behavior until about 13 years ago...when he got a degree and went to work in the corporate world.

So sorry. My sister was always mean and cold but when she reached age 26 or so, she got mean and paranoid. Then she became abusive most every time I saw or talked with her. Her husband puts up with it. Sadly.

Thanks, Mel. If he cannot recall the specific article, my post from Dec last year refers to an Article I saw dated April 2008.