I've been reading posts on here to try to give me advice on my marriage crisis. My husband and I were high school sweethearts and have been together for 17 years, married 9 of them. We now have two boys, ages 6 and 4. I'm a stay at home mom. Throughout our marriage, we've for the most part been very happy but I have had health problems that are now better. I had to have a heart procedure (SVT) 6 years ago and it's fixed, then I had a large cyst on my overy 4 years ago and had it removed, then I also went through postpartum depression very bad after my second son. I seeked help right away and have been doing very good. My husband was very supportive through it all. For the past years, we've had times where our love didn't seem as strong but we still seemed for the most part happy. We focused so much time on our kids and did everything together, but very seldom ever just my husband and I. It was all about our boys. So...about 9 weeks ago, on a Sunday, I asked my husband what he'd rate our marriage, I said a 2 or 3. He said, he probably wouldn't even give it that. That's the first time he's ever said anything negative about our marriage. Since that day, he's told me he doesn't love me, only as the mother of his boys. He won't kiss me, hug me, say I love you or anything. He says there's no hope. The boys and I stayed with my parents (close to our home) for 2 weeks, thinking he needed space. He said he didn't feel any different. So, the boys and I moved back home and he left to go to his parents and has now been there going on 3 weeks. He says he'd do anything for our boys but doesn't love me and doesn't even say he wants our marriage to work. It's killing me but I'm trying to stay positive and strong. We went to counseling 3 times and he hasn't tried anything the counselor has suggested (date night) or anything. He said he's sorry he never said anything to be sooner but he didn't and now he can't go back to loving me. I admit that I could've been more affectionate at times, and other things but I never dreamed he felt like this about our marriage. I've caught him in several lies (he said he was at his parents and wasn't, he was driving around). Also, while I was at my parents home, he was staying at our house. I noticed on his credit card that he'd gone to a hotel one of those nights and stayed. When I saw the statement, he denied it and said that date must be wrong. I called the hotel and he did check in. I called him back, he admited to it and said he just wanted to go and think, went to the hotel bar, drank too much and then got a room. It didn't make sense to me bc he had our house to himself that time anyway. He says there's no one else but part of me doesn't believe him. I never thought he would give up on our marriage like this. He knows that the decision is up to him and that I'm doing everything to keep us together. I've apologized and said everything I can. He hasn't been wearing his wedding ring for two weeks now. He's mentioned divorce but that's it. He has no hope for us and I don't know what I should do to keep us together. I've prayed and prayed, trying the Love Dare and talked with our pastor several times. I'm trying to stay strong but I'm a mess. Even though he's said hurtful things to me, I still love him and want this to work more than anything. He knows I won't give up.

......He is not willing to work on the marriage and says he just wants to be able to see the boys. What's hard is that he all of the sudden, one day, quit saying he loved me. We were even trying to have a baby since June! How does that happen?? When I asked him why he was also wanting to have another baby, if he didn't love me. He said, he thought that would make things better. I don't buy that! Today, I hadn't heard from him and then he sent me a text, wanting to take our little boys to a ballgame an hour away. I didn't know what to say. He can go and do what he wants, and when it's convenient for him, ask to see the boys. I feel like I'm on pins and needles bc I want our marriage to work. I did all the apologizing in the beginning, nine weeks ago, when he told me all of this on that Sunday. It hasn't worked. He says he's been praying and hasn't gotten anywhere and that he still doesn't feel better towards me. THen he'll say (or text), I hate doing this to you!!! Then why is he doing it?

I do wonder if he's seeing someone else. I've caught him in several lies, saying he was at his parents when he wasn't. Then, he says he's been driving around just thinking about things for a couple of hours. I don't get that! The bad thing, his cell phone is through his company. So, I have no way, that I know of, of getting his call records. That would tell me a lot!!

So, if he's not willing to work at this or he can't even say he wants our marriage to work...what other approach should I take? As bad as this sounds, I love him so much and have been with him for 17 years, high school sweethearts! He's my one and only love and I'm just 31 and he's 34. This is killing me......

Please help me, thank you!
_________________________
~Renee

He never told me there was a problem. I mean sure, we focused so much on our little ones and didn't take enough time for one another sometimes, but to me, we were overall happy. We did everything together, but agree we needed more time for the two of us. At times, I took some things for granted and so did he but nothing that can't be fixed. We didn't communicate well about those things. Then one day he tells me he doesn't love me. He said he never thought he'd get to that point of not loving me anymore but he did. He said he slammed that door and can't open it. He also said he prays every night and hasn't gotten anywhere. That, I don't believe. We go to church but would miss maybe one SUnday a month at times. This is just killing me that he can't say he wants our marriage to work. He doesn't say much to me at all. It's just not like him. This happended all one day, nine weeks ago and he's been this way ever since. No warnings. I don't know what approach will maybe make him wake up. I've said Im sorry many times, in the beginning for taking things for granted and maybe not giving him as much affection, but we can all do that. I've quit with the I'm sorries and I love you so much...etc. although I still want to say those things. But he knows he holds the power as to what happens. But nothing seems to be affecting him. I suspicion he may be seeing someone, just with his lies but have never had any proof. He swears he's not. But many do. What approach, if any, will make him wake up?

Hi Reneem,

I am so sorry that you find yourself here but it is a very good place to be. Things are a little slow here on the weekends but spend your time reading the articles and some of the other threads. Your H is exhibiting serious signs of infidelity. You can't do anything to fix your M until you determine if he is seeing someone and unfortunately he is not going to tell you. The experts will be along soon to advise you. Hang tough and know that you are now among friends.

God's Blessings,

Say

I agree. Start snooping... maybe more than just the credit cards. Check with friends and family. Once they start lying, it's a slippery slope.

I heard the same thing. We were high schools sweethearts, together 30 years, three kids. Then... the distance started, the "stories", then the "I love you, but I'm not IN love with you" speech. "Is there someone else?" I ask. Of course he says no, and I believe him because he's not a liar. Then the truth surfaces a month later.

It's painful. But you have to keep your wits about you. What you find out NOW may be pivital if you want to save your marriage.

Check his car. The trash cans. The compartments of his wallet in the middle of the night. He may not be too careful right now because he believes you trust him. Which you do because you've always trusted him. But when he's having an affair, he will lie through his teeth. He will be where he's not suppose to be doing what he's not suppose to be doing. He will SWEAR on your children's life that he's not lying -- but he's not himself.

And do not tell him what you find... just yet. You will need a plan. If you have to, make copies of things you find and put back the originals. These items may come in handy down the line.

And tell yourself IT IS NOT YOU. He is at a crossroads in his life. You are not to blame for him crossing the line.

Read up on the articles here. They... and this forum... will be your lifeline to sanity.

And prepare for a marathon. The problem will not be fixed over night. Start training now, pray, and prepare for battle.

Thank you all so much! I'm so glad I came across this website. Please share any information you can with me. I want my marriage to work more than anything. You know, what's real hard is that no matter how hurtful he's been to me, and catching him in lies, I still love him so much and want this marriage to work. This is the hardest thing I've been through. Thank you for the advice and words.

Hi Renee, wow do I remember feeling as you do when I got here! It's one of the most awful feelings I've ever had. I'm sorry to tell you, it doesn't get better for a while. So fasten your seat belt, it can be quite a ride!

I gave you some suggestions on the post you made in the Divorcing/Divorced forum. I'll repeat the basics here: If you husband uses a Blackberry or smartphone and you can have access to it for less than ten minutes (while he showers, for example), you can install Flexispy which will enable you to track his phone activities. You can also attach a GPS to his car to track where he goes. And you can hide a voice-activated recorder in his car (or other places, like his office) which will capture his conversations. If you can afford it, a private investigator (P.I.) can find out an awful lot in just two or three days.

All of these are vital. You may not feel good about doing them, but do you feel good now? No, you do not. So this won't make you feel any worse. And the knowing is better than not knowing. So it's all for the better, isn't it?

Document everything you find. Make copies of things you can't keep and store them away in a safe place.

DO NOT TELL YOUR HUSBAND or give him any idea that you are snooping. If he is involved with someone else and finds out you are suspicious, you will cause him to "go underground," making further research more difficult.

I'll stop there. Please let us know what you find out, if anything. Then, we can advise you on what steps to take next.

I'm glad to see you moved over here Reneem. I posted some steps over on 101...#1 was to come here. So check that one off your list!

ETA: It's slow on weekends here. Hopefullyl, people will start really responding tomorrow.

I am sorry that it is so slow on a night when you need support and advice. I can tell youthat the more information you can gather right now the better off you will be. You have an advantage now because he thinks that you still believe him.

My FWH's phone was also a business phone and I stumbled by accident onto a text just by randomly checking his phone. After that first night, I checked his phone at night after he went to sleep. It was not like I was sleeping anyhow. I don't know how I managed to keep enough control not to confront him uny\til I had the info that I needed but I did, for ten days. By then, I had made my own decisions and had had an opportunity to really Plan A him.

Gather your information very carefully and hold your cards close. Keep coming here when you need to vent. I did not find MB for about a month after D-Day. I acted by instinct.

God's Blessings,

Say

Well, I found out through a recording that my husband is indeed seeing someone else. On the phone message, they called one another Baby and he also told her he loved her at the end of the conversation. He also told her the he's filing for paperwork the next day, which would've been Jan 26th, 2010 and he told her he doesn't care if it pisses me off. The girl? She's our neighbor. She use to work for me at our public swimming pool several years ago in the office, she just bought my husbands care this fall, she just graduated from hair school and just turned 22 the end of December, she's not that cute at all and get this....she just lives right up the road!!! I'm so upset and hearing their whole conversation let me know what has been going on, that he's been involved with someone else. His phone records from work also show her number from back in October. So it's been going on for awhile. I have no idea what all they've done but to be telling one another "I LOVE YOU", no wonder he couldn't tell me! I confronted him, he said I don't know what I'm talking about, I told him what I heard on the conversation. What could he say? I also called her, since her # has also been in my phonebook as friends!! She said,, we're just friends. Bull!

My husband hasn't said anything about it. He got the parents the other night and I sent the boys, 6 and 4, out to him. I hate this. I talked to her parents and they assured me this was over betweeen their daughter (22) and my husband (34). Her dad even called my husband and commanded he stay away from her. But how do I know this will be over? What was he thinking? But he still hasn't said anything to me, that he's sorry, he'd like for us to try, or anything. As much as this hurts, I would be willing to try counseling, but I don't know that he is. And I sure don't want to crawl to him after finding this out. At this point, he needs to make the moves, or that's at least how I feel. Please give me your advice.

Well, I found out through a recording that my husband is indeed seeing someone else. On the phone message, they called one another Baby and he also told her he loved her at the end of the conversation. He also told her the he's filing for paperwork the next day, which would've been Jan 26th, 2010 and he told her he doesn't care if it pisses me off. The girl? She's our neighbor. She use to work for me at our public swimming pool several years ago in the office, she just bought my husbands care this fall, she just graduated from hair school and just turned 22 the end of December, she's not that cute at all and get this....she just lives right up the road!!! I'm so upset and hearing their whole conversation let me know what has been going on, that he's been involved with someone else. His phone records from work also show her number from back in October. So it's been going on for awhile. I have no idea what all they've done but to be telling one another "I LOVE YOU", no wonder he couldn't tell me! I confronted him, he said I don't know what I'm talking about, I told him what I heard on the conversation. What could he say? I also called her, since her # has also been in my phonebook as friends!! She said,, we're just friends. Bull!

My husband hasn't said anything about it. He got the parents the other night and I sent the boys, 6 and 4, out to him. I hate this. I talked to her parents and they assured me this was over betweeen their daughter (22) and my husband (34). Her dad even called my husband and commanded he stay away from her. But how do I know this will be over? What was he thinking? But he still hasn't said anything to me, that he's sorry, he'd like for us to try, or anything. As much as this hurts, I would be willing to try counseling, but I don't know that he is. And I sure don't want to crawl to him after finding this out. At this point, he needs to make the moves, or that's at least how I feel. Please give me your advice.

Reneem,

If you want to save your M, all the information that you need is on this site and the books offered here. Order Surviving An Affair and His Needs Her Needs to start. Are you both still in the home?

As counter intuitive as it may seem, you need to read up on Plan A here and start your own stellar PLan A. It is also your decision if you want to divorce him. That would be a perfectly normal and understandable response although often very premature in the anger and pain immediately following discovery of an A.

Keep reading and coming back to this forum. I am so sorry for your pain.

God's Blessings,

Say

He's been staying at his parents home for 4 weeks now and he's to the point where we don't hear from him, only if he wants to talk to or get the boys. I want this marriage to work but I'm not sure that he does. Before I found out about the affair, he said he didn't love me, only as the mom of his boys and that there wasn't any hope. But now that the affair is out, I'm wondering if he still feels that way. I wish God would give him a change of heart and that he too would want to try to reconcile our marriage.

Renee, it's the weekend and things get slower here. There is less "drama" occurring here now, thanks to the moderators, so we can focus on marriage building again.

Saynomore gave you some great advice: read everything you can that's on this web site. Click on the "Articles" link at the top of the page. Or go to the "Most Popular Links" located to the right of this page. --------------->

You will want to read up and learn about the Basic Concepts, since that's what this site is based on and the advice you'll get is based on. Read about Emotional Needs, Love Busters and then read the articles on Surviving An Affair.

Because it is possible to survive an affair! In fact, I believe Dr. Harley (the owner of this site and the author of the books found here) claims that more marriages do NOT end in divorce than do when infidelity is involved.

But you have to know how to work THE PLAN(s) Dr. Harley has put together in over 35 years of being a clinical psychologist and practicing marriage "coach." There is even telephone counseling available, which you might want to consider after you've read up on the basics.

Dr. Harley and his daughter Jennifer (who also counsels here) wrote a book, Surviving An Affair, which is probably the definitive guide to solving this problem. You should be able to find a copy at your library or book store, and if not, it can be ordered here.

Incidentally, if you're thinking I'm a shill for MB, let me tell you that I found this site after buying the book, not before! I have since bought two other books, His Needs, Her Needs and Love Busters. You might say I'm sold on the simple truths Dr. Harley has uncovered and writes about so clearly.

From what you've written, it's not too late to save your marriage. But the road to recovery is long and difficult. And it involves making and executing a plan! This is what we can help you with here.

You are going to get advice that will seem to go against everything you think you believe, like EXPOSING THE AFFAIR to everyone who might have influence over your husband. SNOOPING to get all the facts you need about who, where, when and how. These things may make you feel ugly. But nothing is as ugly as the violent crime your husband is perpetuating against your marriage!

Spend the free time you have learning about MB concepts. And when you have questions, come here and ask. When you want to scream, come here and scream! When you want to pull your hair out or swear up a blue streak, come here (well, the software has a "cuss filter" on it, but otherwise). By coming here you have found a small army that will arm and equip you to go forth and fight for your marriage!

Are you ready for that fight? We are ready to help. Basic training begins with you reading and familiarizing yourself with the MB concepts (and abbreviations). You can get through this. You WILL get through this!

I understand how you feel Reneem. Hang in there, keep praying, be fabulous (I know it's hard right now believe me). I just want you to know you aren't alone. I'm pretty new here too and probably don't have all the best answers.

Thank you very much. I've been reading what you've replied to me and that's what has gotten me to where I am nowm, finding out the affair. I'm going to read the basic concepts and also see about getting Surviving the Affair Book. He hasn't come to me saying he's sorry or anything....maybe he's not sorry and this is his way of showing me he's done with the marriage, I hope not. But should I just sit and wait for him to make the first move? I don't want to push him to divorce if he hasn't done so already. Thank you for your help!

Renee, it's still very early in the chain of events. Right now, just think of your husband as having been taken over by an alien. This alien has put a fog over his brain, and his thinking is muddled and his words are meaningless.

Affairs are, by their very nature, secretive, illicit, exciting and not based in any sort of reality. Dr. Harley states that most affairs die of their own accord, but exposing them goes a long way to aiding this process.

The first and most important thing right now is to kill the affair. Your husband is not the enemy. The Other Woman (OW) is not the enemy. THE AFFAIR IS THE ENEMY! One of the wonderful posters here wrote an article titled, "the Carrot & the Stick" of Plan A. Please read this. Print it out if you think it will help. This will be your starting point.

In essence, you have to don two masks: You have to become the wonderful wife your husband fell in love with and married, while subjecting yourself without negative response to his assaults on your marriage. Tough work, so know in advance this will take a toll on you. The second part is to become, as I put it, Sherlock Holmes' smarter sister. You will need to snoop, spy, check, uncover and dig like a ferret to uncover the details of his affair.

When you have incontrovertible proof, it's time to "go nuclear." You expose the affair to anyone who can or will have any influence over your husband and/or the OW. This includes family, coworkers, business associates, ministers/priests, Facebook friends, and whoever else you come up with. Make a list, because you will want to expose all at once. This is why it's called going nuclear: you don't want to give you husband a chance to get to people ahead of you with his own "spin" (she's overbearing, we've not gotten along for years, she's frigid, etc.). Dr. Harley states that exposure is the #1 most effective tool used in ending affairs.

Let's not talk about Plan B, yet. However, suffice it to say that Plan A does not always cause the affair to die. At least not right away. If necessary, there is Plan B, the foundation of which is built in Plan A. So get ready to work a stellar Plan A.

The affair is about to be dealt a mortal wound. Your husband and the OW don't have a chance, once MB is marshaled against it!

Let the "games" begin! Let's save your marriage!

Where can I get ideas or examples of how people did Plan A?

Renee, each Plan A is different because the people involved are unique. Therefore, one can only speak in generalities about how to "work" Plan A.

The "carrot" part of the plan requires you to determine what your H's top emotional needs are (see the questionnaire here to help you get started) and then to do your utmost best to meet them.

This is very tough, because you also have to put aside any Love Busters and become 100% of the person your H fell in love with and married. Because it's so tough, it's recommended that a time limit be put on it to keep your own Love Bank from going into the red and killing the love you have for your H.

At the same time, the "stick" part of Plan A is to snoop, pry and search to find out what you can about the A, and when you have enough information, to go explosive on the affair, notifying everyone AT ONCE about it. This includes the OW's family, H's family, coworkers, friends, business associates, ministers -- basically, anyone who has influence with/over your H. EXPOSING THE AFFAIR IS THE NO.1 USEFUL TOOL IN KILLING IT!

So you see, you need to find out what your H feels is missing, and what OW is giving him. Then try to be better at it than she. This is very tough, because he's gripped by a physiological and emotional force right now that has clouded his thinking and makes puts him at war with himself internally. But the addiction of the affair is a strong pull, so it MUST be eliminated before any possible recovery can happen.

Does that help?