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Want to start a new thread for some help.

I got an email from XH a little while ago. In it he states the following...

I am trying to pay what I owe. I am thinking about filing for bankruptcy, I am meeting with a financial planner I cannot continue to pay all these bills.

I do not know how the bankruptcy will affect my half of the house if you want you can buy my portion of the house for current market value. You have the money.


I am very concerned with this possible turn of events. Is there any legal eagles or someone who has gone through this?

I am currently living in our home till DD turns 18.
The mortgage is in both of our names. it has been paid on time since we bought the house.

XH received a Lot as part of his D settlement. The loan is bigger than its worth. His attorney thought it was worth about 15k more than actual value. That is why XH wanted it. My name is on that loan also and I know it was paid up to January and need to go to the bank and check the status. I have checked and he has already not paid the taxes on this which were due end of December.

XH is also responsible to pay a loan that is still in our joint names. He has already missed a payment and I made it to try and keep my credit up.

He has a good paying job but is drowning in debt because of all his wild spending on PP this past year. He took her away every month after he moved out including two - 1 week trips to Vegas.

She knows how to beat the system. It won't matter to him if he declares bankruptcy because she owns a house that he lives in and when they get married he can use credit cards in her name. I know she will plan a big wedding and everything that goes with it.

do I have any legal recourse?


Me 55, XWH 53, M 22 years
D17, D30
alien replaces my husband "I'm not happy" -7/08
Discover OW-8/08 (his direct report and I work there also)
H moves out 10/1/08, confront Ow 10/28/08
Plan B 1/09
D final 12/09

Quote: "First thing you do is pray; when there is nothing else to do, continue to pray."
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I don't know how it works where you are, but my aunt just went through this with her XWH. He filed for bankruptcy and since my aunt was still on some of the loans, her lawyer said she had to file too. There went her credit again because of him. mad

I hope, hope, hope you don't have to go through this. You might want to see a lawyer though just in case.

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My ex filed bankruptcy, and it made me angry, because he HAD enough money to pay bills, but preferred to blow it on the OW. My attorney told me I had to file to, or I would be responsible for all of the bills. And that was another thing that made me PO'd. I had excellent credit until I married him. He came with lots of bills.

The house should be exempt from bankruptcy. I wouldn't buy him out, but you need to see an attorney to protect yourself.

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Originally Posted By: believer
My ex filed bankruptcy, and it made me angry, because he HAD enough money to pay bills, but preferred to blow it on the OW. My attorney told me I had to file to, or I would be responsible for all of the bills. And that was another thing that made me PO'd. I had excellent credit until I married him. He came with lots of bills.

The house should be exempt from bankruptcy. I wouldn't buy him out, but you need to see an attorney to protect yourself.


I don't understand.
How can you be responsible if you are divorced?

Someone 'splain to me.

I'm totally without experience in these matters ....

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i am going through this now and in my state any debit accured during the marriage is "marrital debit" and if loans have both names on it and one claims bankruptcy the other is responsible for it unless they too file. The other thing is that depending on what chapter you file it can affect whether or not you have to sell your house. If there is more than 20k of equity in the house per person on the loan the trustees can also make you file and take the money to pay back the debt. if there is less than 20k per person of equity in the house they USUALLY don't go after the house.

sorry you two have to deal with this!


Truth can stand on it's own two feet....A lie needs support....FRM
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OK, I am NOT a lawyer, nor do I play one on TV, so the following is just what I UNDERSTAND. My understanding, of course, may be totally wrong.

In community property states. I believe that bills run up during the marriage are considered to be joint bills.

In other states, if your name is co-signed on a loan with someone else, then you're affected if they file bankruptcy. There may be a way around filing bankruptcy herself, such as buying out his interest in the house if she can afford to do so.

Although the home is legitimately exempted in bankruptcy cases, the mortgage still must be paid. I'm wondering if, in a bankruptcy proceeding, Hope's ex can check the box to relinquish the house, and then Hope can simply have his name removed from the note once his bankruptcy is discharged. Hmmm.

I think Hope needs to check with an actual, bona-fide, reputable bankruptcy attorney to find out what her rights and obligations are and how to avoid being dragged into her ex's mess.


"Your actions are so loud that I can't hear a word you're saying!"

BW M 44 yrs to still-foggy but now-faithful WH. What/how I post=my biz. Report any perceived violations to the Mods.
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Oh, and it's for this very reason that I think people need to completely sever their financial ties in a divorce. In other words, if one spouse owes a bunch of money on a joint credit card, he needs to pay that card off and close the account BEFORE any assets are distributed.

It is usually kind of hard, though, when they own a home together, for one spouse to get enough money together to buy the other one out.


"Your actions are so loud that I can't hear a word you're saying!"

BW M 44 yrs to still-foggy but now-faithful WH. What/how I post=my biz. Report any perceived violations to the Mods.
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Originally Posted By: Lady_Clueless
Oh, and it's for this very reason that I think people need to completely sever their financial ties in a divorce. In other words, if one spouse owes a bunch of money on a joint credit card, he needs to pay that card off and close the account BEFORE any assets are distributed.

It is usually kind of hard, though, when they own a home together, for one spouse to get enough money together to buy the other one out.


WoW.
Good advice.
And Lady C ...
Click to reveal..

"What/how I post=my biz. Report any perceived violations to the Mods."
rotflmao

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Thanks to all of you that have responded. We live in a community property state.

I think there is less than 40K equity in the house with the marketing conditions.

I put a call into my attorney and she has not called back yet. I am also concerned about a joint loan that he agreed to pay in our divorce and he still owes about $6500. Can't he still be held responsible and would this affect my CS?

This man makes good money but ran up his bills with OW. Don't they look what he spent his money on? This is not caused by job loss or medical problems.

I am not sure if he is trying to scare me into trying to buy him out of the house so he can get some quick cash and not be responsible for the house maintenance bills.

What upsets me is that they plan on getting married by the end of the year and she will throw a big wedding and I am sure she will want a rock to go with it. Bet he will have money for that.

She knows how to work the system (sued in various car accidents to get some cash and other shady stuff).

I keep praying...


Me 55, XWH 53, M 22 years
D17, D30
alien replaces my husband "I'm not happy" -7/08
Discover OW-8/08 (his direct report and I work there also)
H moves out 10/1/08, confront Ow 10/28/08
Plan B 1/09
D final 12/09

Quote: "First thing you do is pray; when there is nothing else to do, continue to pray."
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Quote:
I am not sure if he is trying to scare me into trying to buy him out of the house so he can get some quick cash and not be responsible for the house maintenance bills.


This is exactly why you should talk to an attorney before deciding what to do about the house.

PERHAPS, if he files for bankruptcy and chooses to give up his interest in the house, YOU can simply assume the loan and convert it over to your name. That would be cheaper than buying him out! But, like I say...TALK TO AN ATTORNEY!

The other note...well, I don't know about that. I certainly wouldn't assume the note for ANYTHING unless that asset was signed over solely to me.


"Your actions are so loud that I can't hear a word you're saying!"

BW M 44 yrs to still-foggy but now-faithful WH. What/how I post=my biz. Report any perceived violations to the Mods.
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Pep, that's been on my siggy for ages! Are you just now seeing it? LOL!


"Your actions are so loud that I can't hear a word you're saying!"

BW M 44 yrs to still-foggy but now-faithful WH. What/how I post=my biz. Report any perceived violations to the Mods.
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Originally Posted By: hope3343
I am also concerned about a joint loan that he agreed to pay in our divorce and he still owes about $6500. Can't he still be held responsible and would this affect my CS? again in my state yes he could be made to pay this off if it is in the divorce you would have to take him back

This man makes good money but ran up his bills with OW. Don't they look what he spent his money on? This is not caused by job loss or medical problems. again in my state and with the lawyer i have we only had to give the last two months prior to our filing of bankruptcy, bank records. The lawyer stated the trustee can ask for older or more current records as well.

What upsets me is that they plan on getting married by the end of the year and she will throw a big wedding and I am sure she will want a rock to go with it. Bet he will have money for that.
had that happened to a friend of mine unfortunately


i am sorry about all of this but again the info i gave you was based on my experience with my bankruptcy lawyer and my states laws. the house deal they get your house appraised in today's market value and all so they will tell you how much if any equity is in the house.

not sure if this helped you or not


Truth can stand on it's own two feet....A lie needs support....FRM
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Just to clarify about bills run up during a marriage. Not all bills, even in a community property state, are split evenly. Noncommunal debts or debts NOT FOR THE BENEFIT of the marriage can be charged to just one party. Examples are expenses due to OW or gambling. And I'm counting on this in my situation.

And I agree that it's best to get all the i's dotted and t's crossed before papers are signed. I know this is difficult with a house -- especially in today's market when even people with good credit can't find a mortgage.

Hope, I think WH is just blowing smoke. He's trying to scare you into backing down because the sheet is about to hit the fan when the world finds out about their engagement.

Just keep tabs on his spending, if you can. Even after the D, it may come in handy should you wish to testify about his spending at any bankruptcy trial. You know there are two sides to personal finances -- how much you make and how much you spend.

Can you say wedding on a budget?

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Pep- I meant to say that WH filed bankruptcy while we were still married. He left and didn't pay any of the bills, just filed. My attorney told me that I would have to file or I would have to pay the bills by myself.

Holyheart - Not sure where you get the "noncommunal debts or debts not for the benefit of the marriage" deal. I had proof that my ex spent over $50,000 on the OW, and it didn't make a bit of difference here in California.

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California is like that...it's like, the most ridiculous state as far as divorce laws go.

What state are you located in, hope?


One year becomes two, two years becomes five, five becomes ten and before you know it, you've wasted your whole life on a problem you can't solve. That's one way to spend your life. -rwinger

I will not spend my life this way.
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Well, Hope's already divorced.

Quote:
D final 12/09


Hence, my confusion.

It is my understanding that bankruptcy does not allow the loss of a primary place of residence. A second home, on the other hand ....

Like I said, I am green as can be in this regard...



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He got the lot and you got the. . .

If, big if, he is entitled to a portion of the equity in the house based on the marital asset split per the adjudicated divorce, you do have the opportunity to put the money against paying off the lot mortgage. So I would think. Maybe anything else for which you are responsible.

Get a lawyer, quick.

Larry

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Originally Posted By: Pepperband
Well, Hope's already divorced.

Quote:
D final 12/09


Hence, my confusion.

It is my understanding that bankruptcy does not allow the loss of a primary place of residence. A second home, on the other hand ....

Like I said, I am green as can be in this regard...




If there is any debt on the primary home, the debt payments still have to be made. You do not get to keep the house and not pay for it.

Also, even though the divorce may allocate debt between spouses, I don't think the creditor has to abide by that.

The judge might order the WS to pay off a credit card; but, if he doesn't, the credit card company can still come after the BS. The only recourse, as far as I can understand, is for the BS to take the WS back to court in an attempt to recover those moneys she pays toward that credit card (in an effort to protect her credit rating). Or, I suppose, if her credit rating is already ruined, she can file for bankruptcy to eliminate that, and other, debt.

Like I said, check with an attorney. Anything I said is based on what people have told me about what happened in their circumstances.


"Your actions are so loud that I can't hear a word you're saying!"

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Originally Posted By: Lady_Clueless
Oh, and it's for this very reason that I think people need to completely sever their financial ties in a divorce. In other words, if one spouse owes a bunch of money on a joint credit card, he needs to pay that card off and close the account BEFORE any assets are distributed.


Yep. The responsible one typically gets screwed over again...consider why you are divorcing this person. Don't trust your ex. They are an ex for a reason.

Hope, the lender or other creditors will not care what your D decree says. They were not party to that agreement...they simply want their money and don't care who pays it. You said the loan exceeds the worth of the house and then you said there might be $40k in equity. Which is it? You need to think about a few things:

1-Can you afford the home with no help from H (Assume one day he may even say FU to CS or have a job loss)? Can you afford the maintanence, utilities and mortgage (PITI) for the long term? You don't want a house that will be the money pit only to have this same problem a year from now....think long term. What is the market outlook for your area?

2-If you are updside down, you can look into a short sale. You may not want to move, but this is an option nonetheless. You will want to get a release from the resulting defiency. Do not assume a release is a given because it is not. If you don' secure one, the lender can pursue a defiency judgement against you even years later.

If you have equity or are in the hole only a little (take closing cost and sales commission into account), you may want to sell and have a fresh start. If the loss is small, you may want to eat it simply to keep your credit in good standing. It is unfair if you don't want to move, but you need to see the glass as half full instead of half empty. Cut your losses.

3-Contact your lender to find out your options. Some are better than others but it is typical that they won't talk short sale, loan modification, etc. until you are 3 months deliquent. crazy but that is typical. They may simply push re-fi. The good thing is rates are extremely low. The bad is that you may end up carrying a loan that exceeds the worth of the house if they are not willing to re-fi at current value. Document all conversations with your lender.

A judge can not remove your exWH from the loan. A lender could remove exWh's name (for a very large fee) but has very little incentive to do so since the investor could come after them for a loss in the event you later can't afford the house and it goes into foreclosure. In the current market, IMO it is very unlikely a lender would be willing to do this.

The ecomony is stabilizing but what no one wants to report is that a new onslaught of foreclosures is on the horizon. The banks have not taken all their losses yet thanks to the Obama admin who was crying about foreclosing on people...the tidal wave is coming. On the up side...down the road you could get more/better house for less money plus good interest rates.



BW - me
exWH - serial cheater
2 awesome kids
Divorced 12/2011




Many a good man has failed because he had a wishbone where his backbone should have been.

We gain strength, and courage, and confidence by each experience in which we really stop to look fear in the face... we must do that which we think we cannot.
--------Eleanor Roosevelt
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Hope:

Your screwed.

The responsible one gets it in the end, and the irresponsible one goes off to plastic heaven.

Talk to your attorney. It may behoove YOU to file for Bankruptcy first. Yes, we should ALL pay our obligations. But make sure you know the ramifications if he goes, or you go to bankruptcy.

If you file first, you get to protect YOUR house, and WH is out of luck with whatever he thought HE was going to get. Plus that other debt he isn't paying is stayed in the bankruptcy and they will persue HIM.

All the options suck.

LG

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