AMG

Sometimes I am amazed at the insight people on here bring to the table. Pep just wrote you what could be called a classic post. Mel went back in the past and pulled your previous persona out of somewhere. Both posts amazed me.

After that I noted you were going to counseling, again. I read what you said in the past and now.

I looked up and saw the sky. I looked down and saw the mat at the door. I looked left and saw Pep's post and right to see Mel's. And I thought, "AMG is in love with her philandering husband and either has low self esteem or is dense or something.

What could "something" be, I asked myself, just in case it wasn't low self esteem or dense. Well, it so happens that many women, if not most, when met with adversity, first try to internalize and change themselves, whereas males will try to externalize and try to change their environment or the people around them. Just as generalities, you see.

So maybe its that. Or maybe not. I don't mean to insult you, I am just confused.


Why do you suppose you only have sex a few times per year? Is this your choice or his?

Who feels unattractive to their spouse, you or him? Are you morbidly overweight?


That takes two to work.

And I don't think people stay in relationships where one is cheating (or has cheated) unless there is something in that relationship for them, such as financial support or whatever.

Whatever is always a hairball.

Larry

Yes I too am very confused. I too am amazed at people here like Pepperband and Mel that took so much time to really look at the situation of a stranger and be helpful.

I definitely love my husband even though I no longer know if I want to be married to him. I know I'll always love him. He's actually a very smart, kind, funny person who for whatever reason every 2-3 years for the last 7 does something like this. (I believe you mentioned in a previous post that I "don't know what he's REALLY been doing". Since his previous As his time is well accounted for and I can look at detailed cell bills at any time. I told myself a long time ago that I didn't want to live the life of a detective, so I never looked. Not even when things felt weird...until last week.)

The lack of S is def me and not him, but it doesn't exactly feel like a "choice". I know it is a choice what you spend your time doing (what else would it be?) but all I can say is we both think about it--he more than I--and then it just doesn't occur or does in spurts then stops. And the S is always great when it does happen.

I have actually been told all my life that I'm physically attractive. I consider myself to be very physically attractive especially for my age--people are surprised that I'm 37. I often receive attention from other men (in public, work) but that is not something I need or respond to to feel good about myself. But considering myself to be physically attractive isn't the same as NOT having low self esteem...I consider myself to be intelligent and funny. I guess I consider myself to be a pretty darn good package b/c I'm also fun, funny and genuine. And as far as the financial part, I have a great career and have always made more than my husband so I'm not financially dependent on him, though obviously we're better off together financially.

He is also attractive, not over weight, actually very physically fit and this past summer (he's a teacher and was off) worked out very hard and gained a lot of muscle with drew attention to him from friends, family.

Really the only other piece of useful info I might have here is that he has always had a complex about me making more money than him. This is ironic because a career doesn't fulfill me as a person (I know for some it does) but I have been fortunate and the reason I pursued a career agressively in the first place was b/c he took over his family's business at his father's death and needed time to get it off the ground. I supported us mostly during this time.

All of the As have been about him being admired, desired, feeling attractive more so than S. It is true that I don't give people enough complements verbally (at work, family and in marriage). Combined with the lack of S my husband does not feel that he is attractive to me, and wants someone to feel "crazy about him". He has recently mentioned that he was extra fit over last summer, and that many people complemented him but I never did at all. This is probably true, and I'm not sure why.

Sorry for long post and THANK YOU again.

One more quick thing...he does not like being a cheater. He's obviously suffering depression not just a result of being caught, but has been as this has been going on. This is usually the "weirdness" I feel from him when this happens.

So at this point he doesn't want to be a cheater and doesn't know if he'll ever NOT be a cheater if he's married to me, since he doesn't feel that I'm attracted to him, admire him, etc. Obviously HE has a self esteem problem. I'm not sure if I do or not. If I do I think it's just with him.

My take on this is that I refuse to be blamed for his actions, that it's not me that causes him to cheat (though I could change my behaviors to fulfill his needs and make it less likely), and that until he addresses what's wrong inside himself he'll just do this in a new relationship too.

(And don't fly off the handle too much here...he doesn't BLAME me for his actions. But in contemplating what all of this has wondered if this is a dynamic between US that he wouldn't have with someone else, or if it is something in him, or both.)

This is all bullcrap. Your WH doesn't mind being a cheater if he is being one. Self esteem problems, depression, or whatver are cop outs. He will stop when/if he wants to stop.

My H did not have sex with his first AP. I caught the A before it got to that point...still hurts and was devastatinge nonetheless. We were both ignorant and naive about A dynamics so the problems were never addressed. Sloppy boundaries, immaturity, ignorance, conflict avoidance, unspoken resentment...all helped us end up dealing with a full blown sexual A years later...what joy!. More As = more damage and more resentment. Everyone has their own threshold of what they are willing to put up with. I will never put up with another A from H. I won't even stay married to him if he treats me like crap again even without an A.

Whether your WH is married to you or someone else, he will continue to be a broken person. He is the only one who can fix himself. However, you can change the dynamic by not putting up with his behavior.

amg, why don't you make a decision to fix your marriage? You are saying the same things today you said 7 years ago and nothing has changed.

Why won't you take action to change this situation? You could get phone coaching with Steve Harley, who would assess your situation and give you a PLAN to straighten up this mess. You really don't have to live like this.

I *personally* don't know if I could emotionally handle another affair from H. This first one has darn near floored me and I'm slowly trying to put the pieces back together.

Wanting to cheat and acctually doing it are totally seperate monsters. He had a choice. He could *not* cheat if he makes the decision not to. PERIOD.

For MY marriage, it will only handle one. IF H ever goes down this road again, even a EA, I will go to straight to Plan D and follow it with a dose of Plan FU for good measure......He KNOWS this....there will be not ever be another recovery from another affair.....

not2fun

Why do you make so many excuses for him?

There is something very "off" in your reactions to his cheating.
You have no anger, no sadness, none of the devastation that most betrayed wives express when they come here.

You are very ho-hum, "it-certainly-makes-sense-that-he-cheats" blaise about the whole situation.

Do you have children? You haven't mentioned any -- and its just my opinion that if you don't, you should just move on.
You don't seem to have the emotional fire to fix this.

I think you clearly recognize that you have failed him -- but have done absolutely nothing to fix it. He certainly has his issues to deal with. But I don't see you doing anything to fix yours....

Divorce this man now. Why do you want to live a life of compromise?

Well I definitely appreciate everyone's comments. I certainly am sad, disappointed, devastated, and additionally somewhat proud of keeping my compusure during this time. If it sounds like I'm "blase'" I'm certainly not. People on here need to realize you can only tell so much of a story, so much detail or else the posts are so long other can't get through them. So I've attempted to be matter of fact.

MelodyLane is certainly right that we're talking about a lot of the same things as 7 years ago. But to day we've done "nothing" is certainly not true. Have we done the "right" things...some but definitely not all. I appreciated the suggestion to call Steve Harley and might do that.

Many ppl here think I'm insane (I'm not) and have asked if I'm in counseling and yes I am which I'm glad for. My counselor has really helped me see what I think some of you were saying about the fact that our marriage isn't perfect NOT being a reason to cheat. The marriage problems are one issue. His poor decisions are another. I can see that more clearly now, and my counselor feels that partly why I'm holding up: I see it as HIS issue.

I have few questions I'm wondering about:
1)Is Steve able to help a person like me decide whether to pursue the marriage? Or only how to improve it?

2)I need advice on "fog", guilt and depression. A week out my H really seems just depressed and out of it and not really up for making decisions about anything. Maybe better the last couple of days. I don't think he's having contact with anyone (though I always reserve the right to be wrong on this; I'm pretty confident not though.) It really seems like just letting things rest for both of us is the right thing at this point. I asked him not to come home and he agreed a week ago and has respected my space though we've talked frequently.

Thanks again and to anyone wondering if I'm nuts or just wanting to tell me to run, please don't b/c it's not productive for me and I'm just attempting not to take the easy way out here, as if there were one.

No, you are not crazy, you are in shock. I know because my H was also a multiple cheater. He ended up leaving me. Believe it or not if he hadn't I would still be putting up with his infidelities and lies.
I think serial cheaters never get out of the fog. Looking back at my H's behaviour between As, he was never clear of the fog. He was always unhappy, depressed etc..
Sure, your H could very well be depressed but the issue here is he takes care of his problems by cheating and till he sees that there is no Steve Harley or anybody that can change him. Steve talked to my H but to no avail. H was too far gone when he talked to Steve and H was already in his second A, but was so good at hiding it that not even Steve could detect it. All Steve cold think of at that time was that my H had fantasies about OWs but not an active A. In reality his A had been a PA for already 7 months by the time we talked to Steve.
OW was the downstairs neighbor so my H did not use cell phones nor computer (she is computer illeterate). He started using cell phone in the spring and summer becasue they were setting up secret meetings at the beach. And that's when I started getting suspiciuos, but that was many months after we spoke to Steve.
In other words, if your H is the kind of callous cheater like mine he can decive anyone anytime. I was the biggest fool of all and yes I think I was utterly stupid for not seeing it and for putting up with him for so long.
All this I am telling you is in the hope that you see the light and get out of this abusive marriage.Take care of yourself and stop the being the human punchbag for a man who can care less about your feelings and ultimately you�
Blessing