My story is long and convoluted, but I'll try to summarize quickly.

I first learned of my wife's affair in August. Lots of TT. I immediately said I wanted a divorce, she begged me to stay. So I did. (Later learned that she actually had two PA in our 7yr marriage, one with ex-bf, and one with ex-coworker.)

Since I was still in love with my wife (and her with me), we started MC and R almost immediately. It was a false R because she broke NC with co-worker. I found this out on Oct. 12 while we were in Hawaii to visit our families. (We now live in Los Angeles.) I again asked for a divorce, she again begged me to stay.

Another NC letter was written. We started MC again. On Feb 9, 2010, I discovered that NC had again been broken. She finally admitted she had feelings for her co-worker and that she was having trouble not contacting him. She swears their relationship is now platonic, but that she needed a friend (we are new to LA and both relatively lonely). She also admitted that she has feelings for the co-worker, but they're nowhere near the feelings she has for me. She claims she still loves me, but that she feels broken, and that she's no longer sure she wants to be married as she doesn't want to hurt me anymore.

To be honest, I almost gave up, but a friend steered me here. Over the course of our seven year marriage, my wife has had two affairs, she claims to feel broken and empty. I sometimes still want to give up. The only thing keeping me in the marriage is an insane love for her (and her love for me. I know she loves me. Deeply. As crazy as that sounds), and the fact that starting in August, I really pulled away from my wife as I was so injured by the affairs. I gave her almost no EA. So, instead of making a problem better, I probably made it worse.

I wish somebody told me out this site earlier.

Anyway, at this point she refuses to break off contact with ex-coworker. She said she doesn't want to lie anymore. Over the last week, she's also been spending a lot of time out of the house. She claims she's trying to figure things out. Part of me thinks she's with the OM, although she claims she's not, that the only way they're in contact is by email, despite the fact that he lives only a couple of miles away.

3 days ago, after coming to this site, I started Plan A. I clean the house every day. I make both breakfast and dinner (something I never used to do). When I'm angry or upset, I go and buy her a card or send her flowers...as one of the things that really resonated with me is that after I found out about the broken NC, she said she has no romance in her life anymore.

If people are interested, I'll post what our week's been like since the discovery and why I'm so confused about everything. One second, she tells me I'm the love of her life. The next second, she tells me she doesn't want to be married anymore and that she's no good to anybody. She gets warm. She gets cold. It really feels like I'm dealing with two people, not one.

I'm going crazy. Please tell me I'm doing the right thing or 2 by 4 me if I'm doing something wrong. I've stopped asking about OM because we're not in R. But I'm dying to know if she's going to him. Part of me is thinking of buying a vehicle tracker so I know for certain, but then what good would that do me? Again, we're not in R.

She just keeps on saying that she has a lot of thinking to do. Please steer me in the right direction so I know what to do. So many websites say so many different things.

I guess I have a couple direct questions. Is Plan A and Plan B the same for both men and women? I kind of feel like Plan B might work for men better than woman, but I don't know anything right now.

Also, are the time-frames different? Do woman deal with Plan A better than men and, therefore, it should last longer and be more intense?

(I haven't scheduled a Plan B yet as I'm kind of hoping Plan A works. We still sleep in the same bed. We still make love. She still sends me random notes that she loves me. But then, today, she changed all her email account passwords.)

And how do you separate "attention" from "smothering"? I know my wife is feeling smothered. Since the affair, I was so on her every move. I needed to know where she was at all times. I demanded full-access to her email accounts so this stuff couldn't continue. I thought I was protecting the marriage when maybe I was hurting it because I became so obsessive. She said she felt "grounded" and all she could think of was rebelling (and, later, getting away from me).

How could I screw things up so badly?

I feel so alone.

Hi AKUA, sorry you are here. Do you have any children?

Also, this should be on the Surviving an Affair forum. All you have to do is click "notify" and ask the mods to move it there.

Hit Notify and move your thread to SAA, sir. Best of luck and prayers for you.

Plan A is for both men and women. It is intended to be a short term plan in which you express to your spouse you would be willing to meet their needs if they ended the affair.


3-4 weeks for women, UP TO 6 months for men. However, I would consider all the time you have been dealing with this as Plan A, so you would want to make plans to move to Plan B in the near future.


You were protecting it. When someone is destroying you behind your back, you should watch them closely.

[/quote]

Have you exposed the affair?

1x4 coming.

You have no kids, she has cheated twice that you know of, shows an inability to maintain NC, and you're in plan doormat. I'd recommend plan D.

I can't argue with this at all. Regardless of what you do, AKUA, you should DEMAND today she end her affair and start exposing this in a nuclear fashion. This affair has gone on and become this entrenched because a) she continued to see her affair partner at work [that is like an alcoholic who continues to drink] and because its secrecy has been protected. Affairs thrive on secrecy.

I asked them to move thread, thanks.

Lots of questions. Let me see. No children. It would be a relatively easy out if either of us wanted it.

I exposed the affair to my parents, she told her parents, I told GF of ex-coworker. I don't know any of his friends. She told some of her friends. I don't think she's trying to hide the affair anymore. To be honest, I'm not sure she even wants to be in the affair.

I actually think she wants to be with me, but doesn't want to say she's going to do something (NC) and then fail again, for starters. I saw an email thread between them. If I didn't know they slept together six months ago, I wouldn't suspect he was anything more than a friend. Totally platonic stuff.

Anyway, I think it's this constant failure to stay loyal which is making her doubt her marriage (of course)...and not so much a desire to be with this other person. I didn't get the ILUBNILWU speech. I got the "I LOVE YOU SO MUCH AND DON'T WANT TO HURT YOU ANYMORE" speech.

As I'm writing, she just IMed me "Are you okay? I love you."

All good signs I guess.

Right now, my plan is to be the husband I never was, ratchet up the romance. A hot dinner (I don't normally cook) and a bubble bath with flower petals is on the menu for tonight. I really want to satisfy her EAs. (Although part of me wants to run away, as I'm wondering if she can really control herself.)

We'll see.

I don't think you aer going to make it if that is your plan. The reason this has gotten so bad is because you are appeasing and keeping her secret.

To clarify. They don't work together anymore. I don't know where he works.

I've asked her to stop contacting him. How do I demand it? What's the language?

I've already demanded she stop contacting him twice before (which she agreed to, sobbing), and both efforts lasted about a month before she contacted him again.

This time she just said she doesn't want to fail again, doesn't want to lie anymore, and that she doesn't know what to do. Every night, I tell her that a marriage only has two people in it...and leave it at that.

Am I being a doormat? You can give me 2 by 4s. I will do anything to make this work.

AKUA, this is hopeless unless she ends the affair. She won't end the affair unless you make the affair so unpleasant that she wants it to end.

You, on the other hand, seem to REWARDING her for abusing you. Where is the conflict in her affair?

As it is, she has no motivation to end it. What women in her right mind would give up having TWO STUDS fawning all over her?

Sir, you are going to have to man up here if you want to make it. I am not trying to be harsh, but appeasing a wayward is going to doom your marriage.

STOP YOUR AFFAIR. Thats the language. Let her know you can't live like this and will be separating unless it ends today.

And then start exposing her affair. Expose the affair to her parents, close friends, OM's parents and facebook friends, her facebook friends.

Go pay a visit to the OM and have a come to Jesus with him. Let him know his affair is over and hell is coming.

I have a question about exposure. I could tell everybody. All our friends. But so many books say to watch who you tell because they'll hold it against the relationship forever. Obviously, this site works a little differently.

As a side note, we stopped going to MC because we're obviously not in R. I told WW that we can't go back until a firm NC letter is in place. Driving to work, she told me she hopes we're back in MC by next week. What does that mean? Good sign? Bad sign? No sign?

From the new book by Dr. Harley Effective Marriage Counseling pg 94:

"Granted, there are situations when demands may be necessary in marriage. During a spouse's affair, for example, I recommend that the betrayed spouse demand there be no contact with the lover. If there is continued contact, separation or even divorce would be the logical consequence. While normally demands don't work, in this case there are no reasonable alternatives because thoughtful requests are even less likely to separate lovers."

If they hold it against your wife then they are not friends to begin with. Even so, some ppl do not choose to befriend cheaters.


Sounds like bullcrap to me. She is throwing you a crumb because she feels guilty.

She is cakeeating, Akua. And I think what ML is trying to tell you is that you have to lay down some ultimatums or she's not going to get off the fence. Tell her:

End the affair.

Write the NC letter: NOW (and you edit/approve AND deliver it)

Give me all your passwords.


If she can't do all of this, then Plan B is in order. Or as others have suggested, perhaps Plan D.

This appears to be a pattern with her.

I'd simply write a plan B letter, telling her you love her, but will not continue to live in a marriage where you have to worry if she's cheating AGAIN.

Let her know that you are in favor of the Marriage Builders program and that if she wants a marriage with you, she needs to call, make an appointment and do what it takes to become a safe wife for you.

Suggest she show Steve or Jennifer the letter and when she's learned how to exercise extraordinary protections for the marriage, you would be willing to join in the Marriage Building with her.

If she is unwilling or unable, you have no desire to be in a marriage with someone who cannot provide the protections needed to have a safe, monogamous marriage.

Let her know that you will be studying MB as well while she is engaging in how to protect you from her abusive penchant for having affairs.

According to your signature, you have no children, so put the ball in her court. If she really loves you and wants to be married, then she has to demonstrate a grasp of the importance as well as the how-to of being a safe marriage partner.

Safe marriage partners not only don't have affairs, but they put protections into place. They provide what Dr H calls just compensation for their actions.

If the MB team cannot tell you she is likely a safe partner, do you really want to be married to her?

It's not that I don't demand things. I do. In strong words. This is the first time I'm not demanding anything. I'm just taking it one day at a time. I know our marriage has been broken for a long time. There was no PLAN A last time. I just kept on reminding her of the affair and the damage she did. I wasn't there for her at all. Now I want to be.

I'm getting a little confused. I thought PLAN A was about satisfying your WS's EAs for a little while, and then telling them they need to leave if they don't stop all contact. Not demanding they leave before you could prove that you're being a good husband.

Her affairs started three years ago. That coincides with two different things in my life. One, I became addicted to pain killers because of a chronic pain issue. Two, I began to work, all the time, eighteen hour days (I'm a screenwriter in Hollywood and to succeed you just need to be really obsessive and work long hours).

Anyway, I stopped paying attention to my wife almost completely. We stopped having sex. She'd pepper me with questions like "Why don't you look at me anymore? Why don't you like to touch me?" She cried herself to sleep. She cried in the bathroom. She begged me to get off the pills. In MC, she said her ex came to her when she was the most vulnerable and knew which buttons to push. And that she didn't want to leave me, but it was like I wasn't in the marriage anymore.

So, for at least three years, I wasn't fulfilling almost any of her EAs. I'm not blaming myself for her affair, but I will blame myself if we get a divorce.

And it's for those reasons I'm still here. And because I love her.

So I demand tonight that she stops all contact with OM? This is day three of PLAN A for me.

I exposed twice (for two different and consecutive A's, lucky me...). I'm still friends with all those who were my friends before. Family members (even hers) are more endeared to me as well. What's going to happen is you will hold yourself to a higher standard and the "proof will be in the pudding" -i.e. as time goes on, any doubts your exposure targets have about your integrity versus your wayward's will become obliterated.

Good luck.

opt