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Originally Posted by lisafran
I just hate the fact that it is so complicated and I can't seem to move past the why. It feels as though the rug has been pulled beneath me. If he praises our marriage and me so much and still did this, what is to stop him again????

Exposure will go a long way towards stopping him from doing it again. A kid will continue stealing from the cookie jar as long as all he gets is "Boy are you in trouble now!". In other words, some hurt feelings, some tears, and no real consequence... he's back in the cookie jar whenever he likes.

But you tell Dad, Grandma, and Grandpa that little Joey is not currently to be trusted around cookie jars, and see if things don't change, and fast. Little Joey will be doing whatever he can to regain his good reputation. It will take some work on his part.

Regarding the why of it all... your WH acted in a selfish, spoiled, entitled manner. He had many, MANY opportunities to back away from this but he didn't. He has terrible boundaries.

He should never have sent that first email to her alone w/o copying you.
He should never have gone out to lunch/dinner/walk with only her and no other person along.
He should never have added her to his cellphone list of contacts.
He should never have texted her.
He should never have done a lot of things, but he did.
He broke a LOT of little rules before he found himself in a full blown affair.

Has he said "It was an accident, I didn't mean for it to happen"? That's a lie. Their clothes didn't accidentally fall of and he tripped and found his penis inside her. THAT would have been an accident. What he had was no accident, it was a long series of not establishing reasonable boundaries.

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Originally Posted by MelodyLane
Originally Posted by redhat
IMVHO. You could expose to OWH but you need to know for what purpose. Revenge ?. b/c OWH deserve to know ?. Who would be held responsible for OWH's reaction ?. However you could use this as deterrence to OW and WH.

-rh-

redhat, huh? Her purpose, of course, is that the more people who know the more people can keep him accountable. Exposure helps a WW recover from the affair. That is the purpose of exposure. Any other reason is irrelevant. It is the FIRST STEP towards recovery, just as Dr Harley says.

I don't attack your many opinions that I disagree. Please stay out mine. **************edit***********

This forum should be a safe forum for everyone to help and getting help.

This is the closes I could find about exposure to OPS since you like to quote Dr. Harley to make your point The whole story for excerpt below.

Originally Posted by Dr Harley
Should I reveal to OP Spouse from a MB point of View about the nature of the A and it's extent?

The primary reason to reveal the affair to lover's spouse (OPS) is to gain support in breaking up the affair. But when the affair is already over, that reason is lost. A secondary reason is for altruistic reasons -- the OPS should know that the affair took place (you would want to know if the tables were turned). But for the practical reason of helping your marriage, I regard it as optional, and should be done only if you both enthusiastically agree to it.


Last edited by JustUss; 03/09/10 05:24 PM. Reason: personal attack

Give your absolute best such that you could look back 10 years from now w/ no regret.

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Thank you all for your responses. It is very helpful to get other opinons as I have very few people to discuss it with. THe counselor told me that by me not telling the OW H, was the right thing to do. So, hearing a different perspective is very helpful. I also hope that one day in the not so distance future, I can quit thinking about the past and start figuring out what I am going to do now. It seems like this is whole thing is taking over my life. I have always been a very positive person and I hope one day that something positive will come from all this pain.

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Originally Posted by redhat
[

redhat, huh? Her purpose, of course, is that the more people who know the more people can keep him accountable. Exposure helps a WW recover from the affair. That is the purpose of exposure. Any other reason is irrelevant. It is the FIRST STEP towards recovery, just as Dr Harley says.

I don't attack your many opinions that I disagree. Please stay out mine. *********************edit***************[/quote]

No one is "attacking" your opinion, redhat, just questioning it because it makes no sense. You can�t demand that someone not respond to your points. Good grief. No reason to get so defensive. Dr. Harley has been more than clear on the subject on exposure and recently wrote this newsletter last November:

Quote
This week, again I�ll be taking a question from the Forum to help clear up a conflict regarding one of my common recommendations about when to expose an affair. The issue of exposure comes up when a betrayed spouse has first learned about the affair. Should it be exposed to others, or kept secret? I generally recommend exposure. When should it be exposed? I usually recommend that it be exposed immediately. To whom should it be exposed? I recommend that family, friends, children, clergy, and especially, the lover�s spouse be informed. Exposure in the workplace depends on several factors.

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What about exposure of an affair that took place years earlier and is now ended but recently revealed? I feel that the children, close relatives, close friends, and the lover�s spouse should be informed. Granted, it�s embarrassing to admit an affair, but publicly admitting failure is usually the first step toward redemption.

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I'm in the process of rewriting "Surviving an Affair" to add information about plan B. Some of the main points are as follows:

Whether in plan A or B, the world should know about your husband's affair. All of your relatives, your friends, your children, and the licensing board for your husband's lover. In some states a licensing board will revoke a license if a counselor is having an affair with a married person, client or not. This is because it's well known that affairs hurt families, especially children. And counselors know better than to have an affair.

The reason for the wide exposure is not to hurt the unfaithful spouse, but rather to end the fantasy. Your husband's secret second life made his affair possible, and the more you can to to make it public, the easier it is for him to see the damage he's doing. Keeping it secret does damage, but few know about it. Making it public helps everyone, including the unfaithful spouse and lover, see the affair for what it really is.

So, please familiarize yourself with the newsletter on Exposure. The reasons for exposure are much greater than just ending the affair, the more people who know, the more ppl can keep him accountable. The Harleys have made their position crystal clear and are rewriting Surviving an Affair to reflect it. The days of arguing against exposure are over, friend.



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Originally Posted by lisafran
Thank you all for your responses. It is very helpful to get other opinons as I have very few people to discuss it with. THe counselor told me that by me not telling the OW H, was the right thing to do. So, hearing a different perspective is very helpful. I also hope that one day in the not so distance future, I can quit thinking about the past and start figuring out what I am going to do now. It seems like this is whole thing is taking over my life. I have always been a very positive person and I hope one day that something positive will come from all this pain.

If you are at peace with the possibility of OWH finding out from someone else and recognize the possible future repercussion in your life, and you think it's not the right for a spouse to know when they are being betrayed, then don't tell OWH. That's your call.

It will get better, lisa. I promise you.



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lisafran,

Sorry I am being rude to defend my self here.

Whatever you decide you are the one who live in it. We are here just try to help.

You will survive this w/ or w/o your WH and come out as a stronger and wiser person.

God Bless.


Give your absolute best such that you could look back 10 years from now w/ no regret.

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Originally Posted by lisafran
THe counselor told me that by me not telling the OW H, was the right thing to do.

lisa, your counselor is giving you bad advice. And anyone who tells you not to tell the OWH is giving you bad advice that harms you, your H, your marriage, and the OWH and his children. NO ONE benefits from keeping it a secret except the AFFAIR. Affairs thrive on secrecy so by keeping this secret you become an enabler.

The only possible reason for helping your H hide his affair from his other victim is so that he can avoid the consequences of his action. How is that possibly in his best interest or anyone elses?

Secondly, how will the OW H protect himself and his children from your husband and his skanky wife if no one will tell him what your H has done to him? This is about as moral as knowing the neighbors bookkeeper is stealing from him and not telling him the truth for personal, selfish reasons. Not telling this man what has been done to him is cruel, selfish and manipulative and it leaves the door wide open for them to resume their affair.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Originally Posted by lisafran
Thank you all for your responses. It is very helpful to get other opinons as I have very few people to discuss it with. THe counselor told me that by me not telling the OW H, was the right thing to do. So, hearing a different perspective is very helpful. I also hope that one day in the not so distance future, I can quit thinking about the past and start figuring out what I am going to do now. It seems like this is whole thing is taking over my life. I have always been a very positive person and I hope one day that something positive will come from all this pain.
And that positive thing may be that you grow a more mature, honest and ethical M. Witholding this crutial information from OWH is very sleezy. You now have become a part of the lie and deciet.


Me; W 46
Him; H 46

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DD16
Dated/Married total 28 years.
..I am learning and working on myself.
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Originally Posted by barbiecat
[Witholding this crutial information from OWH is very sleezy. You now have become a part of the lie and deciet.
Quoted because it needs to be said again and barbiecat did it so well.

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The most powerful awesome way for this to happen would be for your HUSBAND to own his mistake and make an apology to those he has harmed.

I hope Pepperband jumps in here. Because as a requirement for forgiveness and continuing the marriage -- she required her husband to meet and apologize to the OW's husband. She couldn't respect him otherwise.

I don't know if she exposed to him prior to that -- or if her husband was the one to tell him.

But it seems right, doesn't it?

It seems to me like a way to cleanse. How can you respect him if he keeps his sleazy secret to protect himself? It seems pretty cowardly. Ick.

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Originally Posted by Lexxxy
The most powerful awesome way for this to happen would be for your HUSBAND to own his mistake and make an apology to those he has harmed.

I hope Pepperband jumps in here. Because as a requirement for forgiveness and continuing the marriage -- she required her husband to meet and apologize to the OW's husband. She couldn't respect him otherwise.

I don't know if she exposed to him prior to that -- or if her husband was the one to tell him.

But it seems right, doesn't it?

It seems to me like a way to cleanse. How can you respect him if he keeps his sleazy secret to protect himself? It seems pretty cowardly. Ick.

ITA. I also required my FWH to apologize to OWH. He did it without hesitation. That was critical to me. And it's one of the many things I admire about him. I would have thought less of him if he had refused.


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Many times A partners try to hide their A from exposure by villainizing the BS by using the tactic used here..."I am afraid of what OWH would do." Implying he is unstable or violent, which often ends up not being the case, but a fear that the A partners do not want their secret out.

I would encourage you to weigh again telling the OWH and know that it probably won't be as bad as the A partners are making it out to be...


Life may not be the party we hoped for, but while we are here we might as well dance!
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Show me a wayward who has not made amends to his victim and I will show you a person who is not truly remorseful and is not recovered. If I say I am "sorry" for stealing money, my true repentance is demonstrated by giving the money back and making amends to my victims. Otherwise, it is not true repentance.

And aiding and abetting this avoidance of the consequences is to become an accessory to the crime. Hiding this crime from the victim harms the WS, BS, the marriage, and everyone involved.

Lisa, the OWH needs to know what has been done to him so he can protect himself and his children from your H and his wife. He needs to know that your H is the fox in the henhouse.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Lisa, besides all the of the reasons mentioned here in favor of exposure, IMO the biggest benefit to YOU is that you will have an extra set of eyes on the OW to help you verify that NC is in place.

This is incredibly valuable...some of us didn't have this benefit and sure wish that we did.

Yuou are going to be on a wild roller coaster ride for quite some time...having an ally to help defend you against the affair is really invaluable.


Me,BW - 42; FWH-46
4 kids
D-Day #s1 and 2~May 2006
D-Day #3~Feb.27, 2007 (we'd been in a FR)
Plan B~ March 3 ~ April 6, 2007

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Originally Posted by Lexxxy
I hope Pepperband jumps in here. Because as a requirement for forgiveness and continuing the marriage -- she required her husband to meet and apologize to the OW's husband. She couldn't respect him otherwise.

OK

Quote
I don't know if she exposed to him prior to that -- or if her husband was the one to tell him.


No, I did not talk to OWH.
My H made the call.
Asked to meet in a coffee shop.
I went too.
H told OWH he'd had an affair with his wife, and apologized.

We were both surprised by OWH's lack of shock.
He already knew !!!!!! (and never told me mad )

But, no matter.
I got to witness my H stepping up to the plate, and own his adultery.


Here is the link to the story *****


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Lisafran,

I reject a husband/partner who refuses to acknowledge & fix what he broke.
For me, living with a H whom I could not respect, would be a living hell. (for both of us)

Most men, need to feel admired by their wives.
I would NEVER admire a husband who insisted I help keep his adultery a secret.

If H had not gone to OWH and made his confession/apology, I would never have recovered my respect for my H.

no respect = love bank completely & hopelessly EMPTY


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