I can believe guys can sit and think about nothing. My H was astounded to find out the racing thoughts I have.

racING. lol.

I buy into the whole idea that men tend to be linear thinkers, while women are more circular in thought. For instance, H and I can go into a store and see a nice lamp.

He thinks, nice lamp. Want.

I think. Nice lamp. What wattage bulbs does it take? Will I have to buy standards, or can it handle florescents? Does the tone of the nickle match what's already in the house? How will the uplighting look with that shade? Will dust show on that color? Would it look good with a column shade instead of that belled one? Would it be better on the table by the chairs, or the one by the sofa? Is there a taller version? Is there a shorter? What height do I really want anyway? If I put it on the table by the sofa, where I like to read, it needs to be tall enough to shed light on my book. Maybe I'd like a wooden base better. Is there another lamp with this shape in a different material? etc...

I would argue that it's not my Taker rising.

What is rising then?

HIS taker.

You're impossible! LOL

Whose taker made today's IB possible?

Mine???

Mr. W, are you calling someone a TOOL?

CWMI,

Is "home" a nice, warm and inviting place for your husband to come to? Is it neat and clean? Do you cook yummy meals? Is it peaceful and soothing? Do you fix yourself up for him? What are his top ENs? How are you doing on meeting those?

Because I know as long as you've been here, you know the only person that you can change is you.

Have the two of you considered attending an MB Weekend?

Mrs. W

Even I didn't get that one - I gotta call and ask for clarification - So far, I'm sayin' - "That was a REACH, Honey - FAIL!"...

Mrs. W

OK...cwmi

back to my thoughts on you (though again, I thought my Music Man There's Trouble in Riverside post above was hilarious)


Since YOU are engaging in applying MB principle to your marriage in conjunction with your husband you can ONLY clean up your side of the street right now.

Have you guys even done the grocery story POJA thing yet?

I wouldn't expect him to be able to POJA a bigger thing like working friday nights with you if you haven't yet mastered some smaller stuff for quite some time.

It seems obvious to you and I, after having been here for so long, that he should have come to you to POJA this decision but are YOU even in a POJA frame of mind yet. Can he trust POJA'ing with you???

What I mean is...is there even a chance you would have said "YES" enthusiastically to him working Friday nights? Really?

He (and you) need practice POJA'ing littlier stuff before he's gonna run to his wife and poja a big thing like his work schedule.

[Mr. CWMI thinking] - "No one does this. None of the other guys at work have to call their wives to get approval for a change of their work schedules. Bob in Service has been married 30 years and he doesn't call his wife about such matters. She'll just say 'no' and ditch at me anyway and if I ask her BEFORE I volunteer and do it anyway [which I must] it will just make the fight that much worse because I'll be openly disobeying her. What am I her husband...a man or a dog on a leash. Next thing ya know...she'll be telling me when to take my lunch breaks and which guys at work I can talk to."

IT TAKES A LOT OF TIME for men to get this. A few phone sessions aren't enough but it's especially not enough if you expect him to LEAD this process and not do MB yourself.

My point again...he messed up. He's GOING TO...A LOT but you've got to stick to YOUR PLAN and that's meeting his needs and making love deposits in his lovebank and hoping/trusting that he'll respond eventually.


As far as handling this Friday night thing. Instead of getting mad as him why he felt he "had to" volunteer and THEN be understanding (as hard as that is to do when you feel so offended). Then try to NEGOTIATE something out of the deal to show him you WOULD HAVE BEEN understanding had he brought the POJA decision to you in the first place and been enthusiastic about the NO CHOICE decision with a few carrots to make the "deal" acceptable. For example, does this mean he's going to go into work a little/lot later on Friday mornings? Perhaps you two can schedule some time alone Friday mornings without the kids (go to starbucks for coffee or something).

PRESUME the best intentions...that your husband didn't really want to work friday nights but felt he HAD TO in order to provide for your family.

Be supportive and don't get upset. I KNOW you are tired. You've been TRYING for a long time but acknowledge that you wasted a lot of energy "trying" the wrong way. Now that he's at least talking to Steve maybe, just maybe he's gonna get on board with the program. I want that for you and your 4 children so remember y'all catch more flies with honey than vinegar. He's gotta start seeing some incentives to the program so essentially (because YOU are here and he is not) I'm asking YOU to LEAD the applying of the MB principles.

You don't have to...your choice.

Mr. Wondering

It was neat and clean until he ripped out the carpet and linoleum the other day in prep for the bamboo to be installed next week! Now it's kinda meh. We have to wear shoes all the time to keep from getting splinters from the subfloor. But it's pulled together, I cook daily, do a spiff before he comes home, I'm a fox, etc, lol.

I had a post about changing ENs. H listed O&H (HEAR THAT, GUYS?) as his top, and DS as his #2, and FC as his #3, but SH re-ordered them to put SF and RC in his top 3.

He is really super picky about DS. My house is clean and warm; my H will flip out if there's a splash of kool-aid in the inside gasket of the refrigerator. It is a point of contention. He expects me to see the things he sees and clean them before he sees them. And I don't notice. Someone spills kool-aid on the floor or the counter, I see that! But a spot on the gasket of the fridge? Um, didn't see that. Have no problem cleaning it.

The ONLY person who has said anything negative about the condition of my house is my H. I get compliments on my home from everyone who comes in, except my H.

I've asked him for a chore chart. He won't do it. Says I should just know what to do.

Um...

So I leave all the housekeeping fliers we get in the mail on his inbox. If he's not happy and not willing to tell me what to do, then I leave that happiness to him to work out. I cook, I clean the entire house weekly, do laundry and dishes daily, take care of four kids, and go to school full time. I also do all the financials and the grocery shopping and buy the kids clothing and do all of the school conferences, plays, activities, etc.

I meet RC and SF needs to the extent he will let me. We've planned things to do together, only to have him cancel and go into work instead. I just found out the other day that he's obliging ME by accepting my sexual advances.

I'd love to do the weekend. I'm wary because of the pile-on of things that point to him being a narcissist. Even SH said that my H was 'intoxicated and operating under the influence of himself.'

With a capital "T"
That rhymes with "P"
And that stands for Pool,


...okay. lol. I saw 'starts with T, rhymes with pool'.

Real quick, I'll read the rest later, but SH is recommending that my H change jobs because this job is such a point of contention. I didn't want him to take it to begin with. So no, there's no way I would want him to work Friday nights there, because I don't like him working there AT ALL.

*back to read*

Okay, I don't have much more to add. SH heard both sides, and recommended that H change jobs. Three months ago. H has put some lip service to looking, but has made no real move to do that.

When he told me about Friday nights, I said that I wasn't going to give him any carp about it because I knew he'd committed to finding another job anyway, so it wouldn't be long anyhow.

Was that good? Assuming the best, that he was going to honor his agreement with me and Steve?

Much better than getting pissed.

And, you know...you can passively mention how you initially felt MAD and that you calmed down and thought it out BEFORE reacting as a way of demonstrating to him that YOU are applying MB to your marriage and how such is changing your average/typical behavior (if at all). You must do this calmly and conversationally...not accusatory. You must presume he is your teammate, husband and lover and DOESN'T really want to work friday nights. He had too and thankfully he's leaving that job (trusting him at his word). Then...move on and try to have fun with him in the time he does offer you.

I still think negotiating some time with him friday morning might teach him about some give and take available in the POJA process even though not applied in this situation.

Alas...please remember...he's been thinking for awhile "life doesn't have to be this hard". Doesn't mean you have to bury all your feelings but I think you should attempt to not dwell on emotions, feelings and the relationship all the time. Try to mix in fun and recreational companionship. To be loved...you must BE lovable. In the end, if you are lovable and he still doesn't get it...I guess you have your answer.

I do hope you are wrong about him being a narcissist....because I can only post to you from my point of view trying to put myself into his shoes so you get the benefit of seeing things from his eyes and mind. Just because I'm an MB vet...in my eyes...doesn't make me different than other men. I may be a bit more in tune and respectful of women because I have a professional mother and older sister which gave me a headstart but I don't think I'm special because I learned this stuff at 40 years of age. I'm think I'm just an average guy (though not a narcissist to whom I can't relate).

Mr. W

I go to school on Friday morning currently, leave the house at 6:15am, get home at 1:30pm. My semester is over at the end of April, though, and I won't be back on that schedule until August.

I'll see if he'll sit down later tonight and do a weekly UA schedule with me. That'll help.

I wish I could just be disappointed instead of ticked. It would be nice to be able to commiserate about how awful his boss was to impose this change on him, instead of knowing that H imposed it on himself.

His boss sent out an email asking all the sales guys to get together and figure out who was going to take over the vacant shift, and H marched in there after talking to ONE guy (who wasn't even in sales) and volunteered for it.

I knew this was coming up, and asked H to just sit tight and wait and see what the boss decided to do. He said he would, but that he could see 'the writing on the wall' that it would end up being him. He failed to tell me that he was already carrying the marker and intended to write on the wall himself.

Ahhh...glad I got that out before he gets home.

Just be mindful of passive aggression or letting the "anger" out sideways over something else.

If you are going to bite your tongue...don't ruin it by jumping on him for something else.

If you act all pissed but keep your mouth shut he really won't see that as much of a change. You got to organically change and let it roll off your back.

You're choosing to make love bank deposits...not withdrawals no matter what he says or does (even if he tests your new attitude which he may because since he failed...he may want vindication by having you fail on your end as well).

ACT...don't react.

Mr. W

REally interesting conversation. I read the comments about being offended before I saw the videos. Having read the comments first, I did see how offensive the videos were. Yet I could also see myself sitting in the audience, laughing, but also feeling uncomfortable for a reason I couldn't put my finger on.

I don't know if others understand how much some of us have tried to twist ourselves into knots trying to please hypercritical men, because that's what we see all around us. Most of us know very few men who "love women." I can imagine if you're used to being around respectful men, this stuff could be funny. But that's not the case for many of us. Sad to say but even at church and work there are plenty of men who joke about how women make no sense and are irrational.