Surviving an Affair doesn't always mean the marriage survives.

Question for anyone out there who knows or who has lived through the divorce as a BS. How do I get past the realization that I lived with a liar and a cheater for 26 years?

I've been told many many things by very reliable sources in the last 9 months or so that have blown my mind. For instance, today learned that my Wxh has used meth as recently as the last few years. Also, that he was a major peeping tom in the FIRST year of our marriage. And that he has had many ONSs....and all sorts of things.

So I'm lucky to be rid of him right? I don't want him back. But two problems have me stuck. I can't stand the fact that my son has to go see him and especially the fact that he can involve OW with my son. And I HATE the fact that he is still trying to make it my fault that we are divorced.

Oh wait....3 problems. Now I am kicking myself for not listening to my gut more all those years. I knew things were 'off'. My brother today told me that I have always had a good BS detector....but I put it on ignore for so long trying to preserve my marriage. Brother told me that Xh is a highly devious person....so how do I avoid another man like that? Or can I assume that I won't be fooled so easily at age 44 as I was at age 15?

Here are my goals...maybe I am just posting them to get my thots clear---
1) Let go of Wxh's opinion of me. His opinion of me doesn't matter.
2) Let go to the degree I have to with regards to ds10 being with his father--even when it includes OW
3) Don't put the garbage from my marriage on to another man

hugs.

Stop listening to anything people want to 'enlighten' you on now. If they couldn't tell you when they first knew, I'd seriously question whether these people should be in your life at all.

SW, I am sorry for you, and the only thing I think that works to "get through it" (I don't think anyone ever "gets over" it) is

ONE DAY AT A TIME

And I don't know if there's a formula for how long that takes, either. I remember once hearing that recovery from alcohol addiction takes approximately three months for every year drinking, but I've never read scientific literature to substantiate that.

I am getting through it right now. Mine was nowhere near 26 years, and thus I expect my recovery time will be much shorter. However, one piece of advice I was given might also be helpful:

DON'T QUIT BEFORE THE MIRACLE HAPPENS

The miracle in this case is the day you all of a sudden find yourself realizing that you haven't thought about WxH all day, and that he no longer has rented space in your mind.

Bless you.

SW,

I'm sorry to hear about what you have been through. I can relate to much of what you wrote both as an xBH and in reading how you ignored/dismissed many "red flags" for so long with your xWH...my xWW has done this exact same thing with regard to her OM for years as well, a fact that befuddled me for a long, long time and made any potential R between us completely impossible.

Yes, SAA is about personal survival, even if the marriage cannot/should not survive. I didn't discover MB until WAY late -- about the time my WW filed for D. It was also about this time that I discovered her long running (and long denied) affair. Given the particulars of that situation--no good exposure targets, massive self-entitlement, immense emotional-addiction, a well-orchestrated scapegoating campaign, WW being surrounded by enablers, her immaturity & insecurity, etc--I fully know that MB (as good as it is) plans would not have saved my marriage no matter how perfectly I executed them. That, I have come to appreciate, is for the best by far...I know I am now far better off w/o her and that this would have happened sooner or later anyway. I am through the mental turmoil and pain and see this clearly now.

Even though MB/SAA was not a marital-recovery tool for me, it (and several other sources as well) was a phenomenal education and enlightenment resource. I am very grateful because, without it, I would probably still be groping around in the dark with so many confusions, unanswered questions, and self-blame/"what did I do wrong?" thoughts flying through my head. Undoubtedly what I have learned has sped me to a point of understanding and personal recovery much, much faster than would have otherwise been possible.

Like yourself, I have also learned a great deal for the future too--about improving my own personal shortcomings/mistakes and about what characteristics to be wary of, some subtle, some not, in others. Your "3 goals" seem excellent to me!

Best wishes,
SD

Thank you. I am glad I hung around MB. I first came here in 07 when I discovered inappropriate secret texting between my husband and the wife of a friend of his. I, prior to learning MB methods, exposed that to BH and a huge blew up followed. That BH had been a friend since childhood. Anyway, felt I must not be meeting then WHs needs so came here....learned a lot, tried to apply things, got 2 X 4 a lot.....but also had SAA vets strongly urge me to snoop. Although I didn't trust him, I oddly enough did not think he was cheating on me! How weird is that? I guess I had convinced myself he loved our 'stuff' so much that he wouldn't risk having to give half of it to me. Funny thing is he wrongly assumed that *I* loved our stuff so much I would be willing to forgive an affair. LOL....that is the first time I"ve thought of how those two beliefs came head to head.

Sometimes I feel ill at the things people are willing to do around here to save a marriage. I am more like LLL in that I don't think I've got what it takes to go through that long process of recovery even if WH had been willing (or if I had asked him ) to work the program. I realize this puts me in the position of another sort of recovery, but I feel at least I have a fresh start. I could heal much more quickly if I didn't have to see him when we swap our son out. I do already go long periods of time not thinking about him. So to you I can say, be glad you have no ties to her. And join my club of those who have SAA in marriages that couldn't be saved.

I actually find it helpful to hear these things. It brings me a sense of clarity. My brother is one HUGE source....and he and I have been cleaning up a lot of our relationship issues that XWH caused. My brother was only 13 when I married and he knew of many things long before he realized he should have told me. It is very complicated but basically my brother believed I didn't want to know things. Part of that was my brother's own guilt from things he was doing...and his own issues that clouded reality.

I am in the same situation. I spent so much time making excuses for him and believing the lies,that now I feel like I failed. He has moved on to the 3rd OW, and he doesnt cry in private I am sure. I dont want him and I certainly do not want what we had back (at least not the last few years) but its not how I saw my life, so I keep grieving.
So you are not alone SW

Thank you. Is your divorce final?

SW

Yes, SAA is all about personal growth. SAA can mean divorce. It happened to me. Which has nothing to do with what happens to someone else who may divorce or may recover to build a new marriage. The is just life in all its "Glory." And all its sadness.

My own divorce had many factors, and her affair was one of them, but not the only one. If it had been that alone, we could have probably survived and even thrived. But it wasn't and that is that; I cannot change fate.

You are regretting that you spent 26 years with someone who turned out to be a far less person than you believe you deserved and that is probably a good analysis. Yet you did it. And you did it with the emotions and tools you had then, at the time, which is not the same as the emotions and tools you have now. They don't teach marriage and family life in school, but probably should. And most folks just learn from their peers, their prejudices and their parents. Not the best of places to learn, for the most part.

Now you find yourself over 40. You look forward in life and wonder what the heck are you going to do now. You look at yourself and worry about your market value in terms of finding someone worthy. You worry that the men your age are all looking for someone younger or better looking or slimmer or rich or whatever is in your mind just to list some that might apply.

You don't feel safe.

And that is not something that you have had to worry about up until recently. And a lack of safety is the ultimate worry for a woman, period.

You think you have thrown half your life away with a total jerk. But that isn't the right way to look at it. You have lived your life as best you could, mistakes and all. You have become who you are because of the life you have lived. You have lived and learned. You are now at a starting point for the rest of your life.

And, most important, you have your son. That is one gift you got from your years with "That guy." And I would bet you would not trade your son for having spent the past 26 years with a better man. I too have a son. He is with me right now. I would not trade him for a better outcome with my ExWW. No way, no how.

One undercurrent I read in your post is that you like family life, with a husband, kids and well, just family. And you want that again, older and wiser and worry about picking a real guy instead of a fake one. I understand that. Heck, I am real old and I too would like someone to share my days and dreams and there is nobody around here I think I could trust with my heart. But I will eventually get over that and find companionship, I hope.

My recommendation to you, not even at the advice level, is that you stop looking back, count your blessings that you did not live any more days with a husband who neither respected you or himself and move on down the road. Does that make sense?

Lrry

No it is not final. I filed last year, and let him talk me out of it cause he was going to change.

Very true. Although I don't worry that I won't eat or can't feed my son I don't feel safe. I have many people in my life but that is not the same.


Good point. This made me feel MUCH better.


You are correct about this for sure. My son has been the joy of my life. So it is a double edged sword....my son is my greatest joy but he is also what keeps me tied to the man who has hurt me so much. Hmmmm......


This is what I want. And the man I am cautiously 'seeing' wants that as well. Simple things. Point our rocking chairs toward the west, raise our kids, enjoy our grandkids....he makes it sound so simple. Maybe it is.



From YOU yes. (Are you sure you haven't been talking to this man I'm seeing. That is EXACTLY what he says.) LOL. Thank you for responding to my post. I always enjoy your words of wisdom to others.

I bulldozed the divorce. I never let Xwh get anywhere near trying to talk me out of it. Of course, once I discovered, via a keylogger that he had slept with my cousin 7 years ago and lied about when directly asked....I knew I would never take him back. One does reach a point where there is nothing else that can be done to save the marriage.

Is that where you are? Are you done?

SW


Well, I completely understand that one. It isn't my Ex that is the problem, it is the flaming jerk she married. I have a pity party posted in Divorce on this forum if you have the stomach to read me confessing the sins of a New Husband.

Nothing either of us can do about it. Other people make choices that cause us problems. It is what it is. I can't change what I can't change, so I just go with the flow as best I can, and that said, I will not allow him to control me in any way, but he tries. Now turn that around. Your Ex has to deal with you. No matter how much he will attempt to deny it, he knows what he knows about himself. And your son is a reminder of just what he did. It sucks to be him.


Wise man. Listen with your heart. Listen with your head. Pay attention. You may have found a keeper. Not all guys are bad. Some of us, as someone once told me, are decent people inside.


I have been known, cough, hack, uh, to post something that is off the wall. And then I want to run away from my stupid. Then someone says something like you just wrote, and the time I spend here all of a sudden becomes worth it. And since the guy you are seeing shares my world view, he must be great, at least in my mind.

Thanks.

Larry

I understand the anger, regret, and self-questioning you are going through right now. You feel that you are in the wrong for being fooled for all those years. Well, the truth is that you were trusting of the man that you loved, and that man was a secretive, self centered cheat. You were presented with his best side. Not having the benefit of a looking glass into the future, how were you supposed to know that the man you loved had this alien other self inside him?

It is definitely going to hurt for a long time, and there will be many times that you want to kick yourself for falling hook, line and sinker for his subterfuge.

Please stop that thought very quickly, with the realization that YOU did nothing wrong. How can you blame yourself for being the loving young woman blinded by love? It is normal to trust each other in a relationship.

You handed your trust to him as a precious gift from your heart. When he destroyed that, he destroyed a large part of your heart and life, and he also damaged your trust to such an extent that you wonder how you can ever offer it to another.

One of the major fears that paralyze people with anxiety about entering into a future relationship is this doubt in YOUR SELF: how will you know who to trust? Can you ever feel secure enough in your self to offer that trust again? If he can sell that mind trip to you, then he can have the satisfaction of knowing that you will never trust anyone again. Don't buy that BS!

It is natural for you to be withdrawn and hurting right now. Give yourself time. Learn to understand your self, your needs, your fears, your hopes, before you begin another relationship. People who repeatedly pick the same person are usually people who have not taken the time and patience to do all of this self examination, and giving yourself time to heal.

If you don't feel very good about yourself, then your standards for a partner won't be very high, because you are not worth much.....? No, break out of that cycle right off the bat! Good luck and God bless.

Very nice Ellen

Larry

Thank you! Yes it is BS that I can't trust my instincts....I'm spending the day tomorrow with a man who absolutely adores everything about me. He just wants to be with me!

Oh and as a plus he was clearly disgusted by Jessie James' behavior that was recently revealed in the news.

I just want the simple things. He says I should just let go and enjoy life with someone who wants to be with me. Maybe I will. For tomorrow at least.

I have noticed that too. Sometimes I find myself shaking my head in disbelief when I read some of the heart-wrenching BS's stories here and then see some of the (however well-intentioned) completely pie-in-the-sky, less-than-one-chance-in-a-thousand sort of advice that is dispensed. I recall exactly how it felt to be a confused, irrational, emotionally-labile, desperate-to-hear-what-you-want-to-hear BS. These poor folks need to be frankly informed and reassured that divorce is a legitimate and even preferred option in select situations. Some WS-scenarios are not worth even an attempt or a consideration of �recovery�, yet I read it pushed here occasionally in outlandish circumstances. Almost a guarantee of future & continual BS-masochism�and the BS�s personal dignity and sanity is worth something too.

Ex. #1: Your WS cheats early on in the marriage (say, within the first 2-3 years)
Ex. #2: Your WS has now had multiple inappropriate extra-marital relationships
There shouldn�t even be a thought of anything but Plan D here and the poor BS needs to be supported in that, not misguided into believing that there is a �marriage� here worth recovering�there is not and probably there never was from the get-go.



Yes, I am immensely grateful that I did not have children with her. For the (theoretical) kids� sake of course, but also because I know that otherwise I would be forced to deal with her off-the-deep-end craziness and she would undoubtedly be dragging me back into court over and over, fabricating accusations against me in endless custody hearings. Even without kids, she harassed me for trivial things like garden shovels and throw-pillows for 2 full years, so I know of where I speak. I �dodged a bullet� there!

I know this is a touchy, delicate subject here since you don�t want to put your son �in the middle� or make him feel like a pinball, but have you considered utilizing an intermediary for kid-transfers? If you have a trusted friend/relative nearby, he/she could be immensely helpful with all your co-parenting issues. Basically, I would inform xWH that:
If there is a child emergency, I need to hear from you immediately�call my cell.
For everything short of that, call/email XXXX only; I'll get the message later.
Pick-up & drop-off our son at XXXX�s house only.

Just a thought, I know it is a tough call�.

IM,

Please don't let ANYONE talk you out of it, even yourself. I am sorry you�re hurting, but you do need to complete this divorce and not look back. 3 OW!

I have seen here on MB people talk about Plans A & B to both BWs and BHs whose spouses had been caught in 3 or 4 different affairs with 3 or 4 different OMs/OWs.

Ridiculous.

Sad as it is�through no fault of the BSs�these relationships are NOT �marriages�; they are �philanderer-security-arrangements� and there is no �recovery� to think about or pursue here.

Ellen,

Superb post...thank you...I read it 3 times.

SW:

I have been watching your ride since you joined here in 2007...

I thought that maybe you were married to a good man, who had some issues. But those issues were profound and deep within him, and something that may never be straightened out.

That others have come to you after the D is final and start telling you of the things that he was doing in the past is really troubling... WHY couldn't they have done that YEARS ago?

You shouldn't doubt yourself. You NEVER had all the facts. You NEVER knew how duplicitus your ex-husband could be. You are well to be rid of him. Your son will soon be old enough to make his own choices about time with his dad, and his dad will make HIS choices to see son as well. And you will see XH trying to see DS less and less.

LG